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Current Account for Trust.

Parky
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Current Account for Trust.

#235212

Postby Parky » July 9th, 2019, 2:35 pm

Which of the high street bank offer a trust Current Account? None of them advertise such a thing on their websites

PinkDalek
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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#235216

Postby PinkDalek » July 9th, 2019, 2:50 pm

Parky wrote:Which of the high street bank offer a trust Current Account? None of them advertise such a thing on their websites


We have two with Barclays. Treated as Business Accounts but no bank charges. Not the simplest of things to set up but I can look up the detail should you wish for the one we opened about 5 years back. Involved meeting a bank manager etc.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#235255

Postby chas49 » July 9th, 2019, 4:43 pm

Metro Bank will do this as well

Parky
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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#236163

Postby Parky » July 12th, 2019, 12:18 pm

Thanks. I am going with Barclays, and have set up a meeting with them to open the account.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#243951

Postby hiriskpaul » August 13th, 2019, 10:34 am

Parky wrote:Thanks. I am going with Barclays, and have set up a meeting with them to open the account.

How did that go?

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#243985

Postby Parky » August 13th, 2019, 12:43 pm

hiriskpaul wrote:
Parky wrote:Thanks. I am going with Barclays, and have set up a meeting with them to open the account.

How did that go?


I had to go into the bank and set up an appointment. (They don't answer their help-line phones). It took about 1.5 hours to complete the ID checks and make a copy of the deeds. It all goes to a central department somewhere, who sat on it for 3 weeks until I chased it up. Then another delay while a third trustee goes to a different Barclays branch to get ID (not the bank's fault, that one). But still waiting. I'm sure they can do better than that, but don't expect instant action! When you go in, make sure you get the bank branch phone number. The numbers published on the website are for a central help-line service which have long waiting times.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#243996

Postby hiriskpaul » August 13th, 2019, 1:30 pm

Parky wrote:
hiriskpaul wrote:
Parky wrote:Thanks. I am going with Barclays, and have set up a meeting with them to open the account.

How did that go?


I had to go into the bank and set up an appointment. (They don't answer their help-line phones). It took about 1.5 hours to complete the ID checks and make a copy of the deeds. It all goes to a central department somewhere, who sat on it for 3 weeks until I chased it up. Then another delay while a third trustee goes to a different Barclays branch to get ID (not the bank's fault, that one). But still waiting. I'm sure they can do better than that, but don't expect instant action! When you go in, make sure you get the bank branch phone number. The numbers published on the website are for a central help-line service which have long waiting times.

This does sound tedious. I am going to try Lloyds first as the other trustee already banks with them and lives over 100 miles away, so simpler if we don't both have to turn up together.

One possible difficulty is that I no longer have the Will as that has gone off to the probate office. Perhaps we should have set up the Trust account before applying for probate? I have scanned in the will, so can of course print off copies, but I suspect the bank might want to see the original.

Any costs involved in setting up or running the account? I was wondering whether this would be treated as a business account and so subject to fees.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#243998

Postby Parky » August 13th, 2019, 1:34 pm

LLoyds don't do trustee accounts (even though it has been my personal bank for 40 years). Barclays didn't mention any charges for the Trustee account. I was surprised to be honest. Maybe they forgot to tell me.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244014

Postby PinkDalek » August 13th, 2019, 3:36 pm

hiriskpaul wrote:One possible difficulty is that I no longer have the Will as that has gone off to the probate office. Perhaps we should have set up the Trust account before applying for probate? I have scanned in the will, so can of course print off copies, but I suspect the bank might want to see the original.

Any costs involved in setting up or running the account? I was wondering whether this would be treated as a business account and so subject to fees.


I'm unsure if you saw my previous link (perhaps on the other thread) to where I summarised what we undertook:

Discretionary trust banking and sharedealing; who?
viewtopic.php?p=132556#p132556

I think that was the one that covered a number of items you are asking.

From there HL required, inter alia:

2. Certified copy of a the original trust deed. Note this has to be certified on each and every page
3. A cheque for £1 to open the account.

The latter to have been drawn on the Trust's bank account.

Also, in so far as Barclays were concerned, this is dealt with as a Business Account but with no bank charges (as previously).

I very much doubt Barclays will open without a certified copy of the documentation. In our case, although the Will talked of the Discretionary Trust, our solicitors ended up preparing a Deed of Appointment once the Grant of Representation (Probate of the Will) had been obtained. It was a certified copy of that Deed that was presented to the Barclays Business Manager. Who I'm sorry to say had no knowledge of trusts whatsoever, so it did all take some time.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244065

Postby hiriskpaul » August 13th, 2019, 6:49 pm

PinkDalek wrote:
hiriskpaul wrote:One possible difficulty is that I no longer have the Will as that has gone off to the probate office. Perhaps we should have set up the Trust account before applying for probate? I have scanned in the will, so can of course print off copies, but I suspect the bank might want to see the original.

Any costs involved in setting up or running the account? I was wondering whether this would be treated as a business account and so subject to fees.


I'm unsure if you saw my previous link (perhaps on the other thread) to where I summarised what we undertook:

Discretionary trust banking and sharedealing; who?
viewtopic.php?p=132556#p132556

I think that was the one that covered a number of items you are asking.

From there HL required, inter alia:

2. Certified copy of a the original trust deed. Note this has to be certified on each and every page
3. A cheque for £1 to open the account.

The latter to have been drawn on the Trust's bank account.

Also, in so far as Barclays were concerned, this is dealt with as a Business Account but with no bank charges (as previously).

I very much doubt Barclays will open without a certified copy of the documentation. In our case, although the Will talked of the Discretionary Trust, our solicitors ended up preparing a Deed of Appointment once the Grant of Representation (Probate of the Will) had been obtained. It was a certified copy of that Deed that was presented to the Barclays Business Manager. Who I'm sorry to say had no knowledge of trusts whatsoever, so it did all take some time.

Thanks, I missed this. I just have a will defining the Family Trust. By the sound of it, I need to get a solicitor to create a Trust Deed from this. I was hoping the Will would be enough.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244067

Postby chas49 » August 13th, 2019, 6:59 pm

hiriskpaul wrote:Thanks, I missed this. I just have a will defining the Family Trust. By the sound of it, I need to get a solicitor to create a Trust Deed from this. I was hoping the Will would be enough.


I would check this before you start spending money. If the trust is created by the will, that's it as far as I understand it. The trust exists. If (for whatever reason) there are no longer sufficient trustees (min. 2) then you may need a deed. But if the will named trustees who are still able to act, then you only need the grant of probate.

(But check this with someone who knows what they are talking about. - maybe not the solicitor who wants you to pay though - unless you just ask them to explain exactly why a deed is needed.)

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244069

Postby scrumpyjack » August 13th, 2019, 7:03 pm

AFAIA a deed of appointment is simply a document appointing an individual as trustee of the Will trust. You do not need to create a new trust deed - the Will should be sufficient if it was properly drafted. I have had this situation as Executor.

hiriskpaul
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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244070

Postby hiriskpaul » August 13th, 2019, 7:19 pm

Thanks chas49/scrumpyjack, I will continue then with my working assumption that the Will incorporates the Trust Deed and I don't need another one. I do still have the difficulty though that the Probate Registry has the original Will and will not give it back! I would hope there is some way round this, such as obtaining certified copies from the Probate Registry?

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244123

Postby PinkDalek » August 14th, 2019, 2:18 am

hiriskpaul wrote:Thanks chas49/scrumpyjack, I will continue then with my working assumption that the Will incorporates the Trust Deed and I don't need another one.


Apologies if I've misled but I was relaying what happened in our situation. I think chas49/scrumpyjack (recs applied) have explained to me why our solicitors prepared a Deed of Appointment. In our case one of the Executors/named Trustees was unable to act. Perhaps that's the reason one was prepared, which recited the history from the Will forwards. At least I now know the reason, some years down the line, which was never really explained to me at the time.

I do still have the difficulty though that the Probate Registry has the original Will and will not give it back! I would hope there is some way round this, such as obtaining certified copies from the Probate Registry?


I may still be wrong but I don't think you'll be able to move forward at this stage.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244151

Postby hiriskpaul » August 14th, 2019, 8:11 am

PinkDalek wrote:
I do still have the difficulty though that the Probate Registry has the original Will and will not give it back! I would hope there is some way round this, such as obtaining certified copies from the Probate Registry?


I may still be wrong but I don't think you'll be able to move forward at this stage.

I suspect you are right. I will probably have to wait for probate.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244303

Postby chas49 » August 14th, 2019, 4:44 pm

hiriskpaul wrote:
PinkDalek wrote:
I do still have the difficulty though that the Probate Registry has the original Will and will not give it back! I would hope there is some way round this, such as obtaining certified copies from the Probate Registry?


I may still be wrong but I don't think you'll be able to move forward at this stage.

I suspect you are right. I will probably have to wait for probate.


I think that the trust exists from the date the will becomes proved - so the trustees cannot actually do anything until probate is granted. One of the points of probate is to establish that the will in question is in fact the last will etc and therefore effective. If someone challenged the will successfully, then the will trust would not come into effect.

(All IMHO, IANAL again)

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244332

Postby scrumpyjack » August 14th, 2019, 6:28 pm

The Will can still be challenged after probate, for example an action may be brought under the 1975 Inheritance Act up to 6 months after probate.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244385

Postby chas49 » August 14th, 2019, 11:16 pm

scrumpyjack wrote:The Will can still be challenged after probate, for example an action may be brought under the 1975 Inheritance Act up to 6 months after probate.


This is correct. However I think the trust would exist and could open bank accounts etc. It would probably be prudent to wait for 6 months before finalising distribution if there is a risk of a claim
under the 1975 Act. The trustees might be in a position to determine that there is little risk of that (a will giving everything equally to the only dependants for example)

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244593

Postby hiriskpaul » August 15th, 2019, 7:07 pm

I popped in NatWest to see if they do trustee accounts and it turns out they do and the person I spoke to was knowledgeable about the subject - the branch manager just happened to be at the desk when I went in. He confirmed that they cannot open a trustee account until we have probate and the process is tedious. The Will should be fine, once proven by probate, but it has to be sent off somewhere for scrutiny and final approval. As this branch is local to me and has someone in it who knows what he is doing I think I will stick with them. NatWest is convenient for the other trustee as well.

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Re: Current Account for Trust.

#244613

Postby Parky » August 15th, 2019, 8:11 pm

hiriskpaul wrote:I popped in NatWest to see if they do trustee accounts and it turns out they do and the person I spoke to was knowledgeable about the subject - the branch manager just happened to be at the desk when I went in. He confirmed that they cannot open a trustee account until we have probate and the process is tedious. The Will should be fine, once proven by probate, but it has to be sent off somewhere for scrutiny and final approval. As this branch is local to me and has someone in it who knows what he is doing I think I will stick with them. NatWest is convenient for the other trustee as well.


Congratulations - you were lucky. The person I spoke to at my local Natwest was certain they did not do trustee accounts. Natwest would have been more convenient for me too. In fact, I might go back to them if Barclays fail to perform. As you indicate, it is important to find someone who knows what they are talking about - a rare commodity these days :(


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