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Gas and Electricty

Making your money go further
Stompa
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Re: Gas and Electricty

#442748

Postby Stompa » September 16th, 2021, 1:03 pm

staffordian wrote:As to cost, a possible reason for Utility Point's failure could have been their cheap fixed tariffs. Only last week, I looked at whether swapping to a new fixed deal might be worthwhile, but the cheapest would have been 33% higher than my Utility Point tariff, so I'm not expecting to be better off :)

FWIW I've just got details of my British Gas SoLR tariff following the collapse of PfP. It'll cost me around 40% more than with PfP. PfP was already 16% more than my previous Utility Point tariff of just a couple of months ago.

The best switch currently available will reduce the cost by around 9%. I'm wondering if it's worth the bother!

pje16
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Re: Gas and Electricty

#442749

Postby pje16 » September 16th, 2021, 1:05 pm


Allitnil
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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443350

Postby Allitnil » September 18th, 2021, 5:20 pm

At least four of the smaller UK energy companies are expected to go bust next week amid soaring wholesale gas prices.

At the beginning of 2021 there were 70 energy suppliers in the UK. Industry sources say there may be as few as 10 left by the end of the year.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58610561

88V8
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Re: Gas and Electricity

#443371

Postby 88V8 » September 18th, 2021, 6:12 pm

Allitnil wrote:At least four of the smaller UK energy companies are expected to go bust next week amid soaring wholesale gas prices.
At the beginning of 2021 there were 70 energy suppliers in the UK. Industry sources say there may be as few as 10 left by the end of the year.

I'm with Ovo, who were quite a tiddler when I signed up.
Rather glad they've grown, so I shall be spared the faff of moving again.
I think this annual business of chasing the holy grail of lower tarriffs is ultimately going to be a waste of time.
We'll all have to pay for the green crap, and E7 which we're on is going to get hammered by EVs; already the day/night differential has diminished.
Tough times to come.

V8

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443377

Postby swill453 » September 18th, 2021, 6:39 pm

Does anyone know who's going to go bust soon? And how to find relative sizes of suppliers?

Scott.

mutantpoodle
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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443482

Postby mutantpoodle » September 19th, 2021, 8:12 am

Hi Scott
I doubt anyone actually KNOWS but lots of speculation
some even here in this thread

Avro have been asked to provide some fiscal info to one of the quango government watchdogs, and within the news it says they have 40000 or so customers for gas and electric
but others O have no info about

I am with AVRO and have been for 3 years, superb service and absolutely no problems.............so I hope they are not one of the '4' this week

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443486

Postby simoan » September 19th, 2021, 8:54 am

mutantpoodle wrote:I am with AVRO and have been for 3 years, superb service and absolutely no problems.............so I hope they are not one of the '4' this week

Unfortunately. I think they will be one of them. Like you I’ve used Avro and their customer service was very good. It’s a real shame that competition is being removed from the market. It looks like things will almost return to how they were before with maybe just a few of the newer suppliers sticking around to fight the old guard and less good deals available as a consequence.

All the best, Si

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443491

Postby airbus330 » September 19th, 2021, 9:13 am

I'm a 3yr AVRO customer and will be sad if they go, but if you sell on wafer thin margins with insufficient hedging when energy prices spike, fallers are inevitable. The way the market is structured in the UK has to be wrong if this is the result, but I suspect that in a few years when prices stabilise a new crop of discounters will appear.

Added
Oh dear, having just tried to logon to Avro, it appears the website is offline. Hope thats not the end already for them.

Dod101
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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443493

Postby Dod101 » September 19th, 2021, 9:20 am

airbus330 wrote:I'm a 3yr AVRO customer and will be sad if they go, but if you sell on wafer thin margins with insufficient hedging when energy prices spike, fallers are inevitable. The way the market is structured in the UK has to be wrong if this is the result, but I suspect that in a few years when prices stabilise a new crop of discounters will appear.


Sadly this is not just a marketing business and needs a certain amount of capital behind it. I could never see how many of these very small players could survive. I am not saying I am right to have stuck by the traditional suppliers but it has been a lot less hassle than switching every year. The small suppliers seem to have made the traditional mistake of selling long and buying short if what you say is correct. This is one of these occasions when hedging was essential but then that costs and would no doubt rob them of any real margin for expenses and profit.

Dod

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443496

Postby genou » September 19th, 2021, 9:34 am

airbus330 wrote:Added
Oh dear, having just tried to logon to Avro, it appears the website is offline. Hope thats not the end already for them.


Working for me a moment ago.

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443498

Postby airbus330 » September 19th, 2021, 9:39 am

Dod101 wrote:
airbus330 wrote:I'm a 3yr AVRO customer and will be sad if they go, but if you sell on wafer thin margins with insufficient hedging when energy prices spike, fallers are inevitable. The way the market is structured in the UK has to be wrong if this is the result, but I suspect that in a few years when prices stabilise a new crop of discounters will appear.


Sadly this is not just a marketing business and needs a certain amount of capital behind it. I could never see how many of these very small players could survive. I am not saying I am right to have stuck by the traditional suppliers but it has been a lot less hassle than switching every year. The small suppliers seem to have made the traditional mistake of selling long and buying short if what you say is correct. This is one of these occasions when hedging was essential but then that costs and would no doubt rob them of any real margin for expenses and profit.

Dod

Agree with that. Its a fake market constructed by government policy and has attracted people who create glossy business plans but little collateral.

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443499

Postby airbus330 » September 19th, 2021, 9:44 am

genou wrote:
airbus330 wrote:Added
Oh dear, having just tried to logon to Avro, it appears the website is offline. Hope thats not the end already for them.


Working for me a moment ago.


Thanks for that.
Yes, working again now.
Unfortunately I got caught up in the Toto Energy failure a couple of years ago, so will be downloading and screenshotting every account and statement off the Avro site as once they have gone it may take ages to sort out the credit balance with very poor support from the supplier of last resort.

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443534

Postby Dod101 » September 19th, 2021, 11:49 am

airbus330 wrote:
genou wrote:
airbus330 wrote:Added
Oh dear, having just tried to logon to Avro, it appears the website is offline. Hope thats not the end already for them.


Working for me a moment ago.


Thanks for that.
Yes, working again now.
Unfortunately I got caught up in the Toto Energy failure a couple of years ago, so will be downloading and screenshotting every account and statement off the Avro site as once they have gone it may take ages to sort out the credit balance with very poor support from the supplier of last resort.


Slightly tongue in cheek that is the cost of going to the cheapest supplier. Nothing changes. The supplier of last resort probably does not even want the hassle so why should they help?

Dod

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443546

Postby pje16 » September 19th, 2021, 12:16 pm

Dod101 wrote:The supplier of last resort probably does not even want the hassle so why should they help?

Probably just as well most of them don't think like that - we'd be in trouble if they did :roll:

Dod101
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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443556

Postby Dod101 » September 19th, 2021, 12:53 pm

pje16 wrote:
Dod101 wrote:The supplier of last resort probably does not even want the hassle so why should they help?

Probably just as well most of them don't think like that - we'd be in trouble if they did :roll:


Well I have no experience but someone was complaining that the SOLR was not interested in helping them. As I said if you go to the very cheapest that is often the cost, not just the pounds shillings and pence of the transaction.

Dod

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443560

Postby Sunnypad » September 19th, 2021, 1:10 pm

Hope it's on topic to ask for thoughts on this

My electric company is asking me to increase my direct debit. The amount requested is a little too high. I checked my account and found I was more than £200 in credit!

My neighbour, in an identical flat, has been told he owes about £1000. We looked at his meter - the meters are in the same cupboard - there appears to be nothing wrong with it.

He is out a lot more often than I am, doesn't run air con, and is now being asked to pay £300 a month!

Something is going on and it's not about the meters. I told him to contact CAB. It feels as if we have had arbitrary letters saying everyone is "advised" to pay a new amount that appears to have been plucked out of thin air. It's not just us - this is a big block of flats and several residents have had baffling bills.

He and I are a good comparison as we're both living alone in identical flats. There's some families here and I appreciate that more people running laptops etc is going to be an issue.

Is there a possibility of big companies coming together to fix very high prices?

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443568

Postby staffordian » September 19th, 2021, 1:38 pm

Sunnypad wrote:Hope it's on topic to ask for thoughts on this

My electric company is asking me to increase my direct debit. The amount requested is a little too high. I checked my account and found I was more than £200 in credit!

My neighbour, in an identical flat, has been told he owes about £1000. We looked at his meter - the meters are in the same cupboard - there appears to be nothing wrong with it.

He is out a lot more often than I am, doesn't run air con, and is now being asked to pay £300 a month!

Something is going on and it's not about the meters. I told him to contact CAB. It feels as if we have had arbitrary letters saying everyone is "advised" to pay a new amount that appears to have been plucked out of thin air. It's not just us - this is a big block of flats and several residents have had baffling bills.

He and I are a good comparison as we're both living alone in identical flats. There's some families here and I appreciate that more people running laptops etc is going to be an issue.

Is there a possibility of big companies coming together to fix very high prices?


Do you have a record of your electricity use over the last year?

If so, I would calculate the number of kW hours I'm likely to use in either the next 12 months or up to when your current tariff expires, and from this the cost. Subtract your credit and work out the monthly cost.

This would be my starting point for determining a reasonable monthly amount, and if it's significantly less than the supplier is suggesting I'd contact them armed with the figures and politely decline their invitation to increase the direct debit.

A side issue and perhaps a little pedantic. They can't ask you to increase the direct debit, as it's within their control, not yours. But they must advise you prior to making any change themselves.

Edited to add...

I'd be prepared for their figure to be up to 25% or more higher than you might calculate given the likely increases we're being told are on the way...

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443575

Postby Dod101 » September 19th, 2021, 2:01 pm

I solve the monthly overpayment problem by paying quarterly in arrears as I have done all my life. Why do people give electricity companies more money than they need to?

Dod

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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443582

Postby Sunnypad » September 19th, 2021, 2:25 pm

Staffordian - I've reduced the DD already.

Sorry, I waffled but my point was more that I was wondering, talking to neighbours, what the electric companies are going to do next, price wise. I have been told there are no alternative tariffs. I think a one price fixed tariff is coming soon.

Also, it seems odd that they say "you should increase your DD" when they owed me money.

There's talk of 4 smaller energy companies going bust, I don't recall where I heard it though.
Last edited by Sunnypad on September 19th, 2021, 2:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

staffordian
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Re: Gas and Electricty

#443583

Postby staffordian » September 19th, 2021, 2:26 pm

Dod101 wrote:I solve the monthly overpayment problem by paying quarterly in arrears as I have done all my life. Why do people give electricity companies more money than they need to?

Dod

I don't think all tariffs permit this, so it may limit options when looking for reasonable deals.

Whilst your (ie the traditional) method would be my preference, it would not rank highly in my list of priorities when comparing tariffs or suppliers, especially given the current low interest rates, where having a credit with a supplier won't exactly be costing me much in lost interest. But having said that, I would not allow an unreasonably large credit to accrue.

But given recent events, including my supplier going bust last week, my priorities are changing a little, mainly by giving more weight to larger suppliers. Come to think of it, when I'm eventually able to swap, there will probably only be big ones left...


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