Gifts - the wider picture

[pancake101]

Hi

Not really a LBYM subject how ever we are all savvy and I think this is a good place to raise this topic.

I would not have given this much thought but I remembered a conversation with my sister from years ago and the situation I have is similar to my that my own parents had. My sister and I had different numbers of children and she thought at Christmas she should have got more than I did as she had more children. My parents gave a cheque for Christmas for us to decided to spend what we wanted - it was up to us - if it went on children, the day its self, gifts each or whatever. Invariably we spent in on our children. So for ease - if it was £100 it was then £50 for my two but only £33 for my sisters children! Hence sisters complaint.

I said at the time - rather gob smacked, that was one way of looking at it- but it really was not the way our parents had thought about it when giving.

So thinking ahead should I spend equally per household or per grandchild? Not just for Christmas but birthdays? Bear in mind that I may want to give financial gifts given that today's children have so much more 'stuff' than even 40 years ago .

[paulnumbers]

Per child is fair on the grand children, per family is fair on a sibling basis. One can't win.

I think you're right to be gob smacked.

[Slarti]

We have 1 child, my wife's brother 3. We agreed early on that there was a limit to be spent per child per occasion.

This was the same as my parents had done with their brothers and sisters, back in the 50s even though I was an only child and most of the others had 2 or 3 kids.

I'd always look to put a £1, £5, £10 or £20 note (depending on when it was) in the child's card, which totally bypassed the type of problem you describe.

Slarti

[Dod1010]

I have five grandchildren, three in one family and two in the other. My gifts are to the grandchildren and so I have no hesitation in giving the same to each child. If their parents don't like it too bad but I do not think that is the case and I would hope not.

Dod

[pancake101]

Slarti - On reflection, much much later, after mulling over what sister had said- that by her way of thinking I had spent a third more on her children than she had on mine! As we too, had had a rough spending guide on gifts. I had never thought of it like this - it was a nephew/niece's birthday - gift in the post! What she said made me stop and think! I wonder if I had mentioned that she would have kept quiet!

I had been thinking of giving a a family gift for a holiday at some point and this is what triggered this question! So equal amounts or not???

[Vision25]

Hi

Not really a LBYM subject how ever we are all savvy and I think this is a good place to raise this topic.

I disagree, I think this is a great LBYM topic as it is about spending money.

I would not have given this much thought.....

Again I disagree, I think you are vastly overthinking this.

I suggest you spend equally between per household AND per grandchild.

Give them nothing.

Vision25

[Slarti]

I had been thinking of giving a a family gift for a holiday at some point and this is what triggered this question! So equal amounts or not???

Not sure how well a family gift would be received, in my family, unless it was a gift of a holiday

For kids, a nice crisp note in their card that is just for them and they don't have to share goes down best. Just my opinion.

Oh, and nobody over 16 gets anything other than a hug unless it is a very special occasion.

Slarti

[ten0rman]

We are in the situation where with three children we have three grandchildren to one child (and definitely no more after those), one grandchild to another child (and possibly no more after that), and the third child doesn't have any at all with nothing on the horizon. So whatever we do it's going to be unbalanced unless we stick to grandchildren only.

But I think there's more to it than has has been said. What about the impending perverse effects of the new "death tax", or to give it its proper name, Probate Fee. It does seem to me that a good idea now, considering our ages, would be to give each grandchild £100 per birthday, and £100 per Christmas, the idea being to gradually reduce our savings to well below one of the Probate Fee borders, and by doing the above, keep the total individual gift limit per person to below £250. Now I know it's not much, and I do have other ideas as well, but it's a step towards passing on money and reducing the amount stolen by the state.

Incidently Slarti, I disagree with the nothing to over 16's. One grandchild, at 21 is rather poorly paid, and the other, at 19 is an apprentice. Both live in a rural area and need personal transport to get around, public transport being rather poor. The other two at 18 months and 10 would best be catered for by direct transfer into a savings account.

Regards,

ten0rman

[BusyBumbleBee]

Thank heavens this has never raised its head in our family. We work on the basis of evening out gifts over time and according to what each child and grand child needs/wants. There has never been a single winge from any - and they are all a delightfully close family getting together at least 3 times a year - often together with my wife's twin sister's family- as well as talking to each other by phone and email frequently. I have spoken to all of the within the past three days - and managed to get a hug from them all as well - despite them living at opposite ends of the country. Only problem I have is not spoiling two 12 year old granddaughters who are always exceptionally kind to me.

[Lootman]

What about the impending perverse effects of the new "death tax", or to give it its proper name, Probate Fee. It does seem to me that a good idea now, considering our ages, would be to give each grandchild £100 per birthday, and £100 per Christmas, the idea being to gradually reduce our savings to well below one of the Probate Fee borders, and by doing the above, keep the total individual gift limit per person to below £250. Now I know it's not much, and I do have other ideas as well, but it's a step towards passing on money and reducing the amount stolen by the state

Bear in mind that you can make a cash gift of £3,000 annually in addition to the occasional/birthday gifts that you mention. If you're serious about reducing your potential probate fee exposure as well as inheritance tax, that would be prudent.

But as you say, you'll need to employ other and more aggressive strategies to really make the dual death taxes go away. I'd also take a look at methods that at least ensure that probate will not be needed, even if IHT might still be a factor.

[didds]

My mum and dad a wghile back mooted about passing inheritance to their grand kids rather than me (3 kids) and my brother (2 kids).

I did point out backed my brotyher) that u7ltimately then we could see a position where outr kids are cash rich in theor own right, and he and/or me lose a job and our house. our kids will inherit OUR house/pot/etc. So any concerns that the Gcs get a disproportionate share is mollified byb the fact that "his" kids will get 50% of his bucket, and mine will get 33% of mine.

admittedly none of this was being done for inheritance planning etc.

Me and bro have 50/50 split now (we are told).

didds

[PinkDalek]

Bear in mind that you can make a cash gift of £3,000 annually in addition to the occasional/birthday gifts that you mention.

Double that for the other spouse (and more if the prior year's annual exemption is unused) but be careful not to assume you can give £3,250 to, say, one individual and totally exempt that figure.

The IHT small gifts exemption and the annual exemption do not interact in the manner suggested. The small gifts exemption per donee cannot exceed £250, so anything over that figure cannot be reduced by the £250.

[Slarti]

Incidently Slarti, I disagree with the nothing to over 16's. One grandchild, at 21 is rather poorly paid, and the other, at 19 is an apprentice. Both live in a rural area and need personal transport to get around, public transport being rather poor. The other two at 18 months and 10 would best be catered for by direct transfer into a savings account.

It was something started by my parents when they realised how much their grandparents were giving to grand, and great grand children. My Dad's granda had 37 of them before he died. The other side of the family was a bit smaller, only 19 by the time great Grandma died. It was also the age ranges with my Dad's granda having a grandchild aged the same as the oldest great grandchild with a 40 year span over them all. They just didn't enough income to keep doing presents for adults earning more than they were.

Slarti