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IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

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idpickering
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IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

#476475

Postby idpickering » January 27th, 2022, 10:08 am

    Morning all,

    My HYP was last put up here; viewtopic.php?p=463020#p463020 Since which I've topped up my Primary Health Properties and Greencoat UK Wind holdings. Today I took the draconian step of selling my BHP Group holdings. The monies released were put into a top up of my Rio Tinto holdings, and bringing on board Persimmon. My account is set to buy more PSN next month, and I do intend taking up the upcoming share offer by LXI too. Either way, that's more than enough tinkering for me, so my intention is to take a step back, continue with my monthly top ups, and let my HYP do it's job.

    As of now (ish) my HYP looks like this, shown in capital value weighting;

    Share                                  Weight
    Legal & General 5.4%
    British American Tobacco 5.3%
    BAE Systems 4.8%
    GlaxoSmithKline 4.6%
    National Grid 4.6%
    Admiral Group 4.5%
    BP. 4.4%
    Rio Tinto 4.3%
    Shell (RDSB) 4.2%
    IG Group 3.8%
    Phoenix Group 3.6%
    Tritax Big Box 3.5%
    Vodafone 3.5%
    SSE 3.4%
    United Utilities 3.4%
    Tesco 3.4%
    Tate & Lyle 3.4%
    Sainsbury 3.3%
    AstraZeneca 3.2%
    The Renewables Infrastructure Group 3.2%
    Greencoat UK Wind 3.0%
    Primary Health Properties 3.0%
    Schroders (non-voting) 2.8%
    LXI 2.8%
    HICL 2.5%
    Persimmon 2.3%
    Unilever 2.3%
    Diageo 1.9%
    Average 3.5%


    The law of ish applies.

    Comments welcome, but be gentle with me. ;)

    Ian.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476483

    Postby kiloran » January 27th, 2022, 10:25 am

    idpickering wrote:The law of ish applies.

    Ian.

    Rubb-ish?

    Sorry, couldn't resist :lol:

    --kiloran

    idpickering
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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476488

    Postby idpickering » January 27th, 2022, 10:31 am

    kiloran wrote:
    idpickering wrote:The law of ish applies.

    Ian.

    Rubb-ish?

    Sorry, couldn't resist :lol:

    --kiloran


    No worries. You made me LOL at least.

    Going back to my HYP though, tbh I'm glad to add a bit more diversification with having brought Persimmon on board.
    My actions today are not what I really want to be doing with my HYP, and would rather just let it be.

    Ian.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476503

    Postby MDW1954 » January 27th, 2022, 11:05 am

    Ian,

    As recently as January 20th, you were describing BHP as "a mainstay" in your HYP:

    https://www.lemonfool.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=33015

    What changed your mind? Why sell the entire holding?

    MDW1954

    PS I took up the LXi offer as well.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476506

    Postby csearle » January 27th, 2022, 11:10 am

    I'm thinking of having the Sell button surgically removed from the web interface. C.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476511

    Postby tjh290633 » January 27th, 2022, 11:30 am

    As you know, Ian, I share a lot of holdings that are in your portfolio. I don't fiddle with it unless circumstances demand it. Other than reinvesting accumulated dividends from time to time, and responding to the odd corporate activity, I am content to let it go its own sweet way. You have some shares which I do not hold, and might take inspiration from them, should I decide to replace one or two of my current holdings. DGE has moved up off the naughty step this morning, which leaves SGRO, IMI, CPG, MKS and MARS in the sub-2% yield area, which is where I contemplate disposal. At the moment I am letting them run.

    TJH

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476521

    Postby kempiejon » January 27th, 2022, 11:47 am

    Ian I gave a superficial look at the numbers and as I said on another thread BHP are priced near a 10 year high - so that sale looks like good timing.
    You have some form for swapping out of shares at opportune moments but I can't see a trigger for disposing that high yielder.
    RIO and PSN both yielding at the top end of the FTSE100 around 9% so your switching won't impact materially on portfolio income. Some milksops might think that yield too high.
    I hold all 3 and have no particular desire to swap out BHP, the change in listing I don't think makes a difference to my ownership but we'll see.

    Looking over the rest of the portfolio down the bottom of your weighting list I see Diageo languising but as the yield rarely tops 3% unlikey to get more money in a HYP as they're just not high yielders. Also down there is Schroders, another I hold, with them around 5% yield and 2.8% weighting might be another suitable top up candidate. Unilever rarely yields this high of course recent news has depressed the valuation. Your top up in LXI is another REIT and you are looking plump in the property sector, perhaps the same can be said for financials though you've no banks. Just observations, your portfolio weighting is more balanced than my own.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476564

    Postby idpickering » January 27th, 2022, 1:43 pm

    MDW1954 wrote:Ian,

    As recently as January 20th, you were describing BHP as "a mainstay" in your HYP:

    https://www.lemonfool.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=33015

    What changed your mind? Why sell the entire holding?

    MDW1954

    PS I took up the LXi offer as well.


    That's fair comment Malcolm. BHP have indeed been a mainstay in my HYP for a number of years, but I reserve the right to have a change of mind. In answer to your question though, I said this over on Company News earlier;

    For me, I wasn't keen on holding a share who's primary listing etc was based in Australia, and for the size of BHP, not listed in at least the upper FTSE index. Maybe I'm wrong, but as I said, I feel better for selling out. I don't like uncertainty, although I grant that they've been very transparent in their actions, and the reasons for doing what they're doing too.


    viewtopic.php?p=476480#p476480

    As I said above, I might be wrong? Only time will tell.

    Ian.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476569

    Postby idpickering » January 27th, 2022, 1:53 pm

    tjh290633 wrote:As you know, Ian, I share a lot of holdings that are in your portfolio. I don't fiddle with it unless circumstances demand it. Other than reinvesting accumulated dividends from time to time, and responding to the odd corporate activity, I am content to let it go its own sweet way. You have some shares which I do not hold, and might take inspiration from them, should I decide to replace one or two of my current holdings. DGE has moved up off the naughty step this morning, which leaves SGRO, IMI, CPG, MKS and MARS in the sub-2% yield area, which is where I contemplate disposal. At the moment I am letting them run.

    TJH


    Thanks for your input Terry. With regards to DGE, I'm happy to just let that be. I've held it since 22 Jun 2016, and get that I could buy a higher yielding share with the dosh, but I like the diversity they bring to my HYP, albeit a small amount.

    As for holding onto your shares long term, you're an inspiration to be sure. I strive to be that way tbh, but being human sometimes I fall.

    Ian.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476573

    Postby idpickering » January 27th, 2022, 2:03 pm

    kempiejon wrote:Ian I gave a superficial look at the numbers and as I said on another thread BHP are priced near a 10 year high - so that sale looks like good timing.
    You have some form for swapping out of shares at opportune moments but I can't see a trigger for disposing that high yielder.
    RIO and PSN both yielding at the top end of the FTSE100 around 9% so your switching won't impact materially on portfolio income. Some milksops might think that yield too high.
    I hold all 3 and have no particular desire to swap out BHP, the change in listing I don't think makes a difference to my ownership but we'll see.

    Looking over the rest of the portfolio down the bottom of your weighting list I see Diageo languising but as the yield rarely tops 3% unlikey to get more money in a HYP as they're just not high yielders. Also down there is Schroders, another I hold, with them around 5% yield and 2.8% weighting might be another suitable top up candidate. Unilever rarely yields this high of course recent news has depressed the valuation. Your top up in LXI is another REIT and you are looking plump in the property sector, perhaps the same can be said for financials though you've no banks. Just observations, your portfolio weighting is more balanced than my own.


    Thanks very much for your input kempiejon, and your kind words too. I'm certainly not an expert, but get lucky sometimes I guess.
    I do intend topping up my Schroders shares at some point, and Phoenix Group too. Unilever are in my sights for a top up too at some point as well.

    Ian.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476599

    Postby csearle » January 27th, 2022, 3:23 pm

    According to my broker BHP will continue to present on the LSE through the use of something called a Depositary Interest, which as far as I can see means that they will be tradable, and continue to pay dividends. I have no intention of selling as long as they continue to perform. C.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476600

    Postby monabri » January 27th, 2022, 3:33 pm

    https://equiniti.com/uk/news-and-views/ ... interests/

    "A DI is a legal wrapper which, when placed around non-UK shares, converts them to CREST eligible UK securities. The service is provided by a registrar, with the shares held in custody on the share register and converted to a UK DI through a Trust Deed Poll. The company is then able to list its shares for trading on the London markets, with the DIs settling those trades electronically within CREST. "

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476615

    Postby tjh290633 » January 27th, 2022, 4:45 pm

    idpickering wrote:Thanks for your input Terry. With regards to DGE, I'm happy to just let that be. I've held it since 22 Jun 2016, and get that I could buy a higher yielding share with the dosh, but I like the diversity they bring to my HYP, albeit a small amount.

    As for holding onto your shares long term, you're an inspiration to be sure. I strive to be that way tbh, but being human sometimes I fall.

    Ian.

    My holding of DGE was bought in May 2009 at 842p, and the yield from the next two dividends was 4.37%. I have never topped the holding up, nor have I had to trim it. The IRR of my holding is 16%.

    It's a bit like IMI, you have to catch them unaware. IMI was bought in March 2009, at 265p, with a yield from the next two dividends of 7.8%. The IRR has been 44%, but I have trimmed 3 times, had a return of capital and topped up 4 times along the way. It was in danger of being trimmed again before Christmas, but fell back in price quite a lot. I think it was about £18 at one time. Not quite a ten-bagger.

    TJH

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476619

    Postby MDW1954 » January 27th, 2022, 4:47 pm

    kempiejon wrote:Ian I gave a superficial look at the numbers and as I said on another thread BHP are priced near a 10 year high - so that sale looks like good timing.


    Hmm. That makes it sound expensive. Plot it over that 10-year period against the FTSE All-Share, though, and it's undershot it by almost 25%.

    And what is that "10-year high" on an inflation-adjusted basis? I don't know, and I haven't bothered to calculate it.

    So my guess is that BHP could yet have plenty of upside.

    MDW1954

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476622

    Postby idpickering » January 27th, 2022, 4:52 pm

    tjh290633 wrote:My holding of DGE was bought in May 2009 at 842p, and the yield from the next two dividends was 4.37%. I have never topped the holding up, nor have I had to trim it. The IRR of my holding is 16%.

    It's a bit like IMI, you have to catch them unaware. IMI was bought in March 2009, at 265p, with a yield from the next two dividends of 7.8%. The IRR has been 44%, but I have trimmed 3 times, had a return of capital and topped up 4 times along the way. It was in danger of being trimmed again before Christmas, but fell back in price quite a lot. I think it was about £18 at one time. Not quite a ten-bagger.

    TJH


    I bought my DGE holdings on 22 Jun 2016, and haven't touched them since. My buying price was 1854p, and I'm up 101.6% as I type, excluding dividends received.

    Ian.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476624

    Postby Bouleversee » January 27th, 2022, 4:53 pm

    That looks like a pretty good p/f, Ian. I hold quite a lot of the same, a few high fliers that aren't on your list and quite a few disasters. You don't seem to have any of the latter. Is that because you got rid before they became not worth selling or they went bust or that you have never had any of them in the first place, the likes of Carillion, N. Brown, De la Rue, Card Factory, etc, If you bought PSN early this a.m. you will already have made a decent profit as they dropped like a stone and then picked up again. As you know, I have held for quite a while and was showing a big profit, some of which has disappeared due to cladding fiasco. You never did say why you sold TW which you had preferred to PSN hitherto. Were you cleverly taking a profit before they fell back or just anticipating falls? As you also probably know, I rarely get round to selling anything before it is too late.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476633

    Postby idpickering » January 27th, 2022, 5:29 pm

    Bouleversee wrote:That looks like a pretty good p/f, Ian. I hold quite a lot of the same, a few high fliers that aren't on your list and quite a few disasters. You don't seem to have any of the latter. Is that because you got rid before they became not worth selling or they went bust or that you have never had any of them in the first place, the likes of Carillion, N. Brown, De la Rue, Card Factory, etc, If you bought PSN early this a.m. you will already have made a decent profit as they dropped like a stone and then picked up again. As you know, I have held for quite a while and was showing a big profit, some of which has disappeared due to cladding fiasco. You never did say why you sold TW which you had preferred to PSN hitherto. Were you cleverly taking a profit before they fell back or just anticipating falls? As you also probably know, I rarely get round to selling anything before it is too late.


    Hi Lorna, thanks for your input and kind comments. With regards to 'disasters', I've had my fair share of duds, like anyone else I guess. Re Carillion I dropped them before they went under, a fair bit before I recall. I'd lost confidence in them I think, and got out, lucky for me it transpired. Anyway, I tend to be draconian sometimes, and if something bothers me regarding a share I drop them. As for TW. I think it was because I thought they were the weak kid brother to the likes of PSN. As for PSN, I bought at 0853hrs today, @ 2354p per share.

    Going forward I intend to keep my sticky fingers off the sell button, and just concentrate in carrying on with my monthly top ups. Famous last words eh? lol

    Ian.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476642

    Postby Bouleversee » January 27th, 2022, 6:22 pm

    idpickering wrote:
    Bouleversee wrote:That looks like a pretty good p/f, Ian. I hold quite a lot of the same, a few high fliers that aren't on your list and quite a few disasters. You don't seem to have any of the latter. Is that because you got rid before they became not worth selling or they went bust or that you have never had any of them in the first place, the likes of Carillion, N. Brown, De la Rue, Card Factory, etc, If you bought PSN early this a.m. you will already have made a decent profit as they dropped like a stone and then picked up again. As you know, I have held for quite a while and was showing a big profit, some of which has disappeared due to cladding fiasco. You never did say why you sold TW which you had preferred to PSN hitherto. Were you cleverly taking a profit before they fell back or just anticipating falls? As you also probably know, I rarely get round to selling anything before it is too late.


    Hi Lorna, thanks for your input and kind comments. With regards to 'disasters', I've had my fair share of duds, like anyone else I guess. Re Carillion I dropped them before they went under, a fair bit before I recall. I'd lost confidence in them I think, and got out, lucky for me it transpired. Anyway, I tend to be draconian sometimes, and if something bothers me regarding a share I drop them. As for TW. I think it was because I thought they were the weak kid brother to the likes of PSN. As for PSN, I bought at 0853hrs today, @ 2354p per share.

    Going forward I intend to keep my sticky fingers off the sell button, and just concentrate in carrying on with my monthly top ups. Famous last words eh? lol

    Ian.


    Ah, I see they had recovered quite a bit by then so you haven't made a profit yet but I expect they will continue to rise. I see that at this price the yield is 10%. I paid 453p for my first holding and topped up at a bit more later, total gain now 300% even after recent falls and I have had some very large divs. but not bought specifically for HY. My biggest gain on current holdings is Experian with 435.37% but it wouldn't qualify for HYP though it is pretty HY on my buying price. In the past I have topped up after a fall if I thought it was a good company but I won't make that mistake again, especially with so many dodgy auditors around and I am not interested in getting a high yield if it is coming out of my capital rather than profits.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476685

    Postby kempiejon » January 27th, 2022, 8:35 pm

    MDW1954 wrote:
    kempiejon wrote:Ian I gave a superficial look at the numbers and as I said on another thread BHP are priced near a 10 year high - so that sale looks like good timing.


    Hmm. That makes it sound expensive. Plot it over that 10-year period against the FTSE All-Share, though, and it's undershot it by almost 25%.

    And what is that "10-year high" on an inflation-adjusted basis? I don't know, and I haven't bothered to calculate it.

    So my guess is that BHP could yet have plenty of upside.

    MDW1954



    I know I don't know about upside or not in BHP share price. It could go up or down, I hope they don't go down lots and the dividend can be maintained and slowly increased but if one was going to sell, as Ian has done, doing so at a historic high seemed like a good time to do it.

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    Re: IDP's HYP as of 27 Jan 2022.

    #476745

    Postby idpickering » January 28th, 2022, 3:57 am

    kempiejon wrote:

    I know I don't know about upside or not in BHP share price. It could go up or down, I hope they don't go down lots and the dividend can be maintained and slowly increased but if one was going to sell, as Ian has done, doing so at a historic high seemed like a good time to do it.


    Thanks kempiejon. We all know that mining shares are cyclical, and you might recall I did top slice both my BHP and RIO holdings a while back as they’d gotten very overweight in capital value terms in my HYP for my taste. With the kerfuffle with BHP I took the step of relieving myself of them, luckily at that sp high you’ve mentioned. I get that HYP isn’t about timing the market, but I think one has to just use common sense in one”s HYP management sometimes.

    Ian.


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