In the red with Imperial Brands!

[idpickering]

I have held Imperial Brands since my first purchase on 17 Aug 2010, and my average purchase price, having topped up, and trimmed back, over the holding period, is 2572p per share. Currently IMB go for 2564p per share. For the first time, in capital value terms, I'm in the red!. Such is the sentiment towards this share, this comes as no surprise I guess, but it is an eye-opener nonetheless. I remind myself that the share was bought for the perceived reliable income, and in that regard it has delivered. Over the total time held I have received dividends totalling some 26.8% in value of my monies invested, so not an appalling result I suppose. It is an income strategy after all. I have no intention of buying yet more of the shares as I've spent enough on IMB already.

Ian.

[Arborbridge]

I have held Imperial Brands since my first purchase on 17 Aug 2010, and my average purchase price, having topped up, and trimmed back, over the holding period, is 2572p per share. Currently IMB go for 2564p per share. For the first time, in capital value terms, I'm in the red!. Such is the sentiment towards this share, this comes as no surprise I guess, but it is an eye-opener nonetheless. I remind myself that the share was bought for the perceived reliable income, and in that regard it has delivered. Over the total time held I have received dividends totalling some 26.8% in value of my monies invested, so not an appalling result I suppose. It is an income strategy after all. I have no intention of buying yet more of the shares as I've spent enough on IMB already.

Ian.

Testing times, eh? And if there is a real ber market rather than just a little correction, we will have harder tests to come - as we all know from TJH's statistics. Forwarned - at least we know what to expect, approximately.

I've done only slightly better than you with IMB as I have a princely 1.7% profit on capital since 2010.

[OLTB]

Not wanting to be one of Brody, Quint or Hooper but if we're comparing financial scars, I'm 30% down in capital terms with my first purchase at £41.18! (I have bought in over the last 18 months at lower prices as well, but not looking to do any more at this time).

Cheers, OLTB.

[monabri]

Having first bought into IMB in February 17 ..... .... I'm "down" ~15% if including dividends paid is taken into account! My average purchase price being £31.45.

Current predicted "break even" in 1.9 years....

[monabri]

Not wanting to be one of Brody, Quint or Hooper but if we're comparing financial scars, I'm 30% down in capital terms with my first purchase at £41.18! (I have bought in over the last 18 months at lower prices as well, but not looking to do any more at this time).

Cheers, OLTB.

We're not exactly "poster boys" for HYP are we?

[idpickering]

Thanks for your input guys. I've been a good boy though, and have just held firm on these, and have no intention of selling my IMB holdings. If it was an option for me in HYP management terms, I would top up further, for the long term, but I really have placed enough faith, and cash, in them already I think.

Ian.

[vrdiver]

I've held since March 2012, topping up in October '13 and again in May '17, for an average purchase price of £26.695. I've not sold or trimmed during this period.

The XIRR is showing as 4.4%, with a total profit (including dividends) of 19%, but -3.8% excluding dividends.

On the plus side, I can hardly complain that IMB are killing me, unlike some of their customers...

VRD

[idpickering]

We're not exactly "poster boys" for HYP are we?

Newcomers look away now.

No, to be fair, I think we've been good HYPers to be honest. All of us realise that it is an income strategy, and the capital returns/losses should be ignored. This conversation is all very much tongue-in-cheek, and we can see the funny side at least. It is good though, that any newbies can see how us old timers are handling this. (or not)

Ian.

[monabri]

On the other hand...

I calculate that the average yield on IMB based on my average price is 5.43%....tax free (unless spreadsheet Phil decides otherwise).

It certainly is a good entry point for new HYPs.

[Arborbridge]

No, to be fair, I think we've been good HYPers to be honest. All of us realise that it is an income strategy, and the capital returns/losses should be ignored. This conversation is all very much tongue-in-cheek, and we can see the funny side at least. It is good though, that any newbies can see how us old timers are handling this. (or not)

Ian.

I'd also mention that until this conversation, I hadn't even noticed whether or not IMB was in profit for me - it didn't occur to me to look. I've had almost 25% of my capital outlay back in 8 years, via that good dividend flow, whilst the capital is still intact for the future.

What's not to like?

[kempiejon]

I'd also mention that until this conversation, I hadn't even noticed whether or not IMB was in profit for me - it didn't occur to me to look. I've had almost 25% of my capital outlay back in 8 years, via that good dividend flow, whilst the capital is still intact for the future.

What's not to like?

Like Arb I have not checked, I don't know when I first bought IMB but I started with BATS in my HYP as they were the bigger yielder, that was over 10 years ago, at some point I switched to IMP, I sold some BATS bed and ISAing a couple of years ago and bought IMB, they will be below purchase price, I'll probably look over the next week and update if I remember.

[idpickering]

I'd also mention that until this conversation, I hadn't even noticed whether or not IMB was in profit for me - it didn't occur to me to look. I've had almost 25% of my capital outlay back in 8 years, via that good dividend flow, whilst the capital is still intact for the future.

What's not to like?

Like Arb I have not checked, I don't know when I first bought IMB but I started with BATS in my HYP as they were the bigger yielder, that was over 10 years ago, at some point I switched to IMP, I sold some BATS bed and ISAing a couple of years ago and bought IMB, they will be below purchase price, I'll probably look over the next week and update if I remember.

Thanks for your input kempiejon. Like you I bought into BATS first, my initial purchase being on 15 Dec 2006 at 1475p per share. And don't I wish I'd bought more then. IMT (as was) were a later addition for me. Over time I have just left my BATS shares alone, and the only additions/sales have been with IMB. Having just checked (not that it matters of course) and I'm currently down 0.5% in capital value terms on my IMB shares! I'm sure I can live with it.

Ian.

[OLTB]

A note just to say that IMB are proving to be a very good income payer for me (and I'm sure everyone who holds) and that my HYP will be an important regular income stream for me when I stop work and in the meantime I am busy squirreling away dividends and re-investing them.

My HYP year is 31 Aug - 31 Aug. and at the end of March 18 it looks like I will have received more in dividends since 1 Sept 17 (six months) than for the whole of Aug 16 - Aug 17 (bearing in mind that Aug 16 - Aug 17 was my first year HYPing so hadn't had a full year's worth of dividends).

The plan of setting up an income portfolio that increases each year seems to be working.

Cheers, OLTB.

[idpickering]

A note just to say that IMB are proving to be a very good income payer for me (and I'm sure everyone who holds) and that my HYP will be an important regular income stream for me when I stop work and in the meantime I am busy squirreling away dividends and re-investing them.

My HYP year is 31 Aug - 31 Aug. and at the end of March 18 it looks like I will have received more in dividends since 1 Sept 17 (six months) than for the whole of Aug 16 - Aug 17 (bearing in mind that Aug 16 - Aug 17 was my first year HYPing so hadn't had a full year's worth of dividends).

The plan of setting up an income portfolio that increases each year seems to be working.

Cheers, OLTB.

Good stuff OLTB, and a useful reminder of why we frequent this board, thank you. Have a rec sir!

Ian.

[tjh290633]

It's time for me to chip in and point out that I first invested in Imperial Group when they split off from Hanson Trust, on 1st October 1996, at 375p. Added to in 1997 at 417p and 369p, and in the following year at 440p. Dividends in the first year were 21.4p/share. In 2002 sold my rights and trimmed back by 20% at 1084p.Trimmed back a further 20% in 2003 at 986p. Yet again in 2007 by 20% at 2323p and in 2008 by 25% at 2669p, then sold my rights in 2008. In 2013 I added twice, at 2278p and 2233p, then trimmed back by 25% in 2016 at 3579p. Further top-ups in 2017 and this February 2018, at 3130p and 2641p. The dividend is now 170.72p/share, making the yield 6.6%. When first bought in 1996 it was 5.7%.

Because of trimming back and selling rights, my average cost is negative at -795p. The XIRR is 21.95%.

Just an example of LTBH, but with trimming when overweight and topping up when underweight. Currently it is 95% of the median holding weight.

TJH

[idpickering]

An excellent post Terry, thank you for chipping into this thread. Your results are a prime example of an individual's HYP policies, and HYP management. I humbly rec your post sir.

Ian.

[cshfool]

In the red with "Brody, Quint or Hooper..."

Your gonna need a bigger portfolio.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I91DJZKRxs

csh

[Arborbridge]

Maybe I've lived through different times since 2006/7, but I do not seem to get much "trimming" requirement. It's also obviously a function of my tolerance to a larger percentage holding compared with the median: I'm tolerant up to 1.75x median with a hard limit of x2, though recently I have been thinking of reducing these factors to 1.5 and 1.75.

My sole trimmings for excess capital weight in ten years are: AZN, DGE, UBM.

Currently my largest holding is IGG at 1.41x, all others being 1.25x or less.

Arb.

[idpickering]

Maybe I've lived through different times since 2006/7, but I do not seem to get much "trimming" requirement. It's also obviously a function of my tolerance to a larger percentage holding compared with the median: I'm tolerant up to 1.75x median with a hard limit of x2, though recently I have been thinking of reducing these factors to 1.5 and 1.75.

My sole trimmings for excess capital weight in ten years are: AZN, DGE, UBM.

Currently my largest holding is IGG at 1.41x, all others being 1.25x or less.

Arb.

Morning Arb. I'm very much with you on this. I like to let my winners run, and am more likely to trim the dross instead. I have 'taken profits' before though, with Unilever, and more recently Royal Mail, by trimming both back a bit in order to redeploy the capital. My largest holding is Shell (RDSB) which weighs in at 6.2% in capital value terms. I don't mind that. The over balance is caused as I doubled my holdings in Jan 2016, and they've recovered well since. I do not intend selling any Shell, and am very much of the 'never sell Shell' ilk. I rebalance my HYP diversity by targeting my lower value holdings going forward, and topping them up.

Ian.

[tjh290633]

Maybe I've lived through different times since 2006/7, but I do not seem to get much "trimming" requirement. It's also obviously a function of my tolerance to a larger percentage holding compared with the median: I'm tolerant up to 1.75x median with a hard limit of x2, though recently I have been thinking of reducing these factors to 1.5 and 1.75.

My sole trimmings for excess capital weight in ten years are: AZN, DGE, UBM.

Currently my largest holding is IGG at 1.41x, all others being 1.25x or less.

Arb.

Your limits are higher than mine. Nothing wrong with that, as it is really a reflection of holding values. Bear in mind that I started at 10% of portfolio value, then twice the median and now 1.5 times the median. Currently my highest value holding is WMH at 1.37 times.

IMB is still top of my top-up ranking, with SSE (disqualified) next then NG. and S32 following.

If I have to trim three times in a year, that is above average. Very occasionally that could be the same share, but not often. It is an indication of the level of volatility in the market.

TJH