Wealth at Work

[NapoleonD]

Hi all

Apologies if this is not the correct forum.

I attended a seminar at work (global investment bank) in November about pension planning. I am 53 in March, and have paid into every company pension plan since i was 23.

I have a couple of final salary pension that come to maturity in the next 10 years, and 3 defined contribution plans. 2 of these were with previous employers and have been sitting with whoever those employers chose as the administrators. Their total value (the first 2 DC schemes) is about £120k.

The seminar was run by Wealth at Work, who took me through a personal pension review, and all is good regarding retirement planning at 62 (the current DC scheme will provide the bulk of the total DC pension fund, and there is no proposal to move this).

One of the DC plans (DC1) has been growing year on year. DC2 has seen a drop since 2020. Wealth at Work are obvs keen to take on management of the plan, but their fees seem high? My 'basic' research (a thread on MSE) suggests avoid/they're ok in equal measure, though a third option is a local IFA.

I am assuming Fools on here have views on this topic, what are your thoughts?

TIA.

[swill453]

I am assuming Fools on here have views on this topic, what are your thoughts?

In your situation I consolidated old DC plans into a SIPP and invested myself. No fees to IFAs or "wealth" management companies. I've no regrets.

Scott.

[BullDog]

I am assuming Fools on here have views on this topic, what are your thoughts?

In your situation I consolidated old DC plans into a SIPP and invested myself. No fees to IFAs or "wealth" management companies. I've no regrets.

Scott.

I second that suggestion.

[NapoleonD]

In your situation I consolidated old DC plans into a SIPP and invested myself. No fees to IFAs or "wealth" management companies. I've no regrets.

Thanks Scott. It has occurredto me, but I just don't have the time or the investment nous to manage my own portfolio. A close friend did the same thing, but he's more smash and grab than buy and hold. So he's lost thousands on GME, Baillie Gifford, Tesla etc.

My fear is being sucked into such black holes of investment despair.

[swill453]

In your situation I consolidated old DC plans into a SIPP and invested myself. No fees to IFAs or "wealth" management companies. I've no regrets.

Thanks Scott. It has occurredto me, but I just don't have the time or the investment nous to manage my own portfolio. A close friend did the same thing, but he's more smash and grab than buy and hold. So he's lost thousands on GME, Baillie Gifford, Tesla etc.

My fear is being sucked into such black holes of investment despair.

So don't be.

I'm not giving any advice, but what I would say is that if I'd invested my entire pension wealth in a world tracker like VWRL and set up automatic reinvestment of dividends and then not given it a moment's further thought, then I'd be in an even better position than the relatively fortunate one I'm in now.

Scott.

[xxd09]

Knowing the limits of your investment knowledge is wise-daunting to try investing at this stage in life!
However that is every investors first step
Its your money and only you will really care about it
Take your time and do some reading over the next year or two-Monevator.com is good
Then you can start taking investment steps bit by bit
Financially it will be worth it but you have to have the confidence to make the decisions
Good luck and keep posting
xxd09

[Urbandreamer]

Thanks Scott. It has occurredto me, but I just don't have the time or the investment nous to manage my own portfolio. A close friend did the same thing, but he's more smash and grab than buy and hold. So he's lost thousands on GME, Baillie Gifford, Tesla etc.

My fear is being sucked into such black holes of investment despair.

I take it that you expect to pay for advice about taking your pension when you retire. How much to take is in many ways more difficult than how to invest.

I agree with xxd09 you need to seriously consider reading up on the subject.
Investing can be easy. Index trackers do work.

Even if you do decide to use an IFA or Wealth at Work, understanding what's going on can make a HUGE difference.
Can I recommend reading Beyond the 4% rule.
https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Beyond-4-Rul ... 907&sr=8-1
It's not going to tell you how to invest, or how to retire, it offers alternative choices and argues pro's and con's.

[kempiejon]

Obviously Wealth at Work are touting for business. They don’t give the seminars away solely for your benefit. I’d agree with those suggestions that you could take control yourself and save on some costs or fees, I also feel having the power and control myself liberating.

It’s good to have a plan so you need to get an idea of what your annual income requirements will be in retirement. Recording expenditure for a few months and extrapolating out for an annual figure of base line costs and desired extras was a revelation on my journey.

You say you’re 53 and looked at a plan to retire at 62 that should give you enough time to make your own arrangements, get an idea of expected income from your current plans and perhaps make a tweak if you’re retirement expectations are not quite met by the current state of your pensions.
Sensible lifestyle questions to ask yourself might be relating to mortgage, debt, savings, partner and kids, hobbies, ideas of part time/ graduated retirement. Assuming you’ll have a decade or more post work how will you fill your time?

I started investing in a FTSE100 tracker that was 20 years ago and gave me satisfactory returns. Although my investing became more complicated since I am reverting back to the thinking that market average is good enough and I’m not any better. Today I would probably look at a global rather than UK tracker. There are plenty of low cost, low effort solutions available, others have mentioned VWRL which in a SIPP will currently throw off 2% in dividend income. Moving existing DC pots to a low cost online provider likely reduce your current costs and there’s nothing much else to think about – provided you initially decide that a global tracker is satisfactory.

I think you've had some good advice so far about a DIY approach but I also know some people are just not interested - in which case you should consider giving the job to an IFA. I have little to offer regarding how to find a good IFA as my limited experience with financial proffessionals is out of date.

[Boots]

I agree completely about taking control yourself. By controlling the costs, you may well find your performance starts to beat the big boys.

You don't need to go down the smash and grab route.

I would strongly recommend reading Smarter Investing by Tim Hale - simple, quiet, calm investment with low costs.

A lot of actors in the personal investment space try to win business by employing the FUD principle (Fear, Uncertainty & Doubt). They will try to impress you how difficult it all is and how mistakes could jeopardise your retirement. I reality, for many of them, the ONLY thing on their minds is to feather their own nests. Investment need not be difficult. You may well make some mistakes, but if you are sensible they will be modest in their impact. It is also true that the ONLY person who really has your best interests at heart, is YOU.

[scrumpyjack]

In your situation I consolidated old DC plans into a SIPP and invested myself. No fees to IFAs or "wealth" management companies. I've no regrets.

Thanks Scott. It has occurredto me, but I just don't have the time or the investment nous to manage my own portfolio. A close friend did the same thing, but he's more smash and grab than buy and hold. So he's lost thousands on GME, Baillie Gifford, Tesla etc.

My fear is being sucked into such black holes of investment despair.

So don't be.

I'm not giving any advice, but what I would say is that if I'd invested my entire pension wealth in a world tracker like VWRL and set up automatic reinvestment of dividends and then not given it a moment's further thought, then I'd be in an even better position than the relatively fortunate one I'm in now.

Scott.

I completely agree that the world tracker route is very sensible and probably lower risk that any other alternative. There is no reason to suppose that the judgement of any individual investment manager will be consistently better than the market and by definition it will be higher risk and higher cost.

[TUK020]

I am assuming Fools on here have views on this topic, what are your thoughts?

In your situation I consolidated old DC plans into a SIPP and invested myself. No fees to IFAs or "wealth" management companies. I've no regrets.

Scott.

I second that suggestion.

same

[TUK020]

In your situation I consolidated old DC plans into a SIPP and invested myself. No fees to IFAs or "wealth" management companies. I've no regrets.

Thanks Scott. It has occurredto me, but I just don't have the time or the investment nous to manage my own portfolio. A close friend did the same thing, but he's more smash and grab than buy and hold. So he's lost thousands on GME, Baillie Gifford, Tesla etc.

My fear is being sucked into such black holes of investment despair.

So don't be.

I'm not giving any advice, but what I would say is that if I'd invested my entire pension wealth in a world tracker like VWRL and set up automatic reinvestment of dividends and then not given it a moment's further thought, then I'd be in an even better position than the relatively fortunate one I'm in now.

Scott.

same

[airbus330]

In recent years I've been staggered by how many acquaintances use the expensive St James Place for their investment needs. I've often pointed out the expense of them and their dubious performance, but have been largely met with blank faces and happy with the service comments. That changed last week when I had the OMG I've lost so much money this year conversation with a StJP client, who had actually looked up the fees he'd paid over the years! I, like others have suggested, used the simple global tracker and have not regretted it since I have now retired on the proceeds. Developing a deaccumulation strategy for generating income in retirement is as important and I wish I'd spent more time on this before the event.

[seagles]

In recent years I've been staggered by how many acquaintances use the expensive St James Place for their investment needs. I've often pointed out the expense of them and their dubious performance, but have been largely met with blank faces and happy with the service comments. That changed last week when I had the OMG I've lost so much money this year conversation with a StJP client, who had actually looked up the fees he'd paid over the years! I, like others have suggested, used the simple global tracker and have not regretted it since I have now retired on the proceeds. Developing a deaccumulation strategy for generating income in retirement is as important and I wish I'd spent more time on this before the event.

I used St James at one time. A friend of mine worked for them and we were discussing previous pensions we both had, to cut it short he recommended one of his colleagues. I then put all my DC pensions in their hands, over the few years they run them the return certainly beat what was achieved in all the seperate pension schemes. The problem was that when the rules chnaged about "drawdown" they did not have a valid offer (at the time). As I had been managing a HYP portflio for some time I took the decision to open a SIPP and "manage" it myself, went with HL, was very happy with them, great communication, easy to understand and liked the "platform". Since then have moved the SIPP from a mix of Equities and ITs to a pure IT portfolio. I have been paying in the max £2880 per year to garner the tax from HMRC and then drawdown that to get the 25% tax free element and investing this plus all the income in growing the portfolio. As it stands that means about 2 trades a year. Easy to do and no problems other then when they or the government changes some of the requirements/processes, then a quick call has always resolved or pointed me to the correct option.
As above, would recommend doing it yourself, but read up on it and learn.

[88V8]

Wealth at Work are obvs keen to take on management of the plan, but their fees seem high? My 'basic' research (a thread on MSE) suggests avoid/they're ok in equal measure, though a third option is a local IFA.

They were one of two wealth managers we used for a few years before striking out on our own, as it were. The other was Towry Law. Both of them came aboard as a result of retirement seminars in my wife's workplace.

Overall, both of them were mediocre. Outperformed when the market was falling but underperformed when it was rising.
WaW won't be a disaster, if you decide to go that way, but as others have pointed out, there are better ways.

I didn't go the tracker route, for me income investing is a bit of a hobby, but if you don't want to spend the time and lack the inclination...
On the other hand, you have a number of pensions, you could self-invest one of them without having to put all your eggs in the self-propelled basket.

V8

[Maxb6]

Honestly reading any defensive against this shambles of a company makes me sick.
How anyone can think WAW can offer anything other than a horriblely forced sale is beyond me.

They are NOT IFAs. They only offer their inhouse DFM portfolio.

This portfolio is badly managed and massively underperforming, no wonder when you look at the managers and their "experience"

The charges include VAT which was actually stopped by the FCA so shouldn't happen.

Their reports haven't changed in over 10 years exact same wording on each and every person's report.

They don't offer proper comparisons on products just state DFM is better, but it really is not.

The staff are heavily targeted and pressured into selling you stuff you don't need.

Please please please avoid this cowboy company!
Even SJP would be better than these fools.

[ukmtk]

I have gambled with my money in my SIPP and lost out (not by a large amount).

If you do transfer to a SIPP then feed the money in over a number of months.
I.e. don't buy a huge amount of something all at once - drip feed it in.
This will protect you against buying at a peak - as most markets are currently.

A simple world tracker is a good idea - especially if you have a few years to go.

I wish I had done it when I started out by myself (12 years ago).
I buy V3AB with my monthly savings.
It has a nice small unit price and is an accumulator (the dividend variant is V3AM).
Some Lemon peeps have pointed out that it is an ESG ETF.

DYOR and good luck

[GrahamPlatt]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Monkey-Pin-mis ... B007WRECVW

That’s all I have to say.