Being pursued for failure to pay a road toll

[forgotusername]

In May 2022 (yes 2022), I drove from Faro to Lagos in Portugal using the A22 motorway. Each section has toll cameras so I booked a hire car fitted with a transponder and left my credit card details with the car company. A few weeks ago I received a letter from EPC PLC saying that I had not paid the tolls I had incurred which amounted to about £9. They also said I had ignored a previous notification, (which I never received). They are now seeking a payment of over £82.
I can see that the card I used then expired at the end of October 2022. Evidently, the hire company tried twice to collect the tolls on this card but both attempts were declined. I have since learned that Via Livre, the company that collates the tolls and informs the car providers how much to collect had a substantial backlog resulting in delayed collections.
EPC PLC have so far been unmoved by my explanation of the reason for non payment. From my perspective, I do not have a contract with EPC PLC nor any way of affecting the size of the penalty they have imposed. If an attempt to collect is delayed long enough, then every card will expire at some point. Surely some sense of justice is required.
I have made payment to them via bank transfer of the toll fee but am seeking advice as to what I should do about the penalty charge element.

[didds]

I suspect you'll need advice from a Portuguese lawyer ?

[Lootman]

I won a case like this a few years ago. It was also overseas.

I hired a car and apparently it got a parking ticket. However I did not know this because there was no physical ticket on the car.

At some later point the car rental company received a notice to pay the fine. And rather than consult with me, they just paid the fine, and then asked me to reimburse the amount.

I refused, claiming that I had been denied my right to fight the ticket in court. That was the end of the matter and I assumed that (depending on the jurisdiction) a driver has to be allowed a right to due process. The hire company was lazy and did not make the effort to contact me and ask about the incident.

In fact more generally I have had good success fighting parking tickets.

Of course a debt that is owed overseas is always harder to collect in any event. If they cannot charge your credit card then they may well just give up if you ignore them.

[Mike4]

And if you ignore them and collect the equivalent of a CCJ in Portugal, would it matter a jot?

[Dicky99]

Looking on Google someone else sought online legal advice in similar circumstances and the advice returned was as follows :-

Please note the following:
- Epc Plc is a UK-based company that collects unpaid tolls and fines from drivers who have used roads, bridges, tunnels and other infrastructures in various European countries.
- Epc Plc is a member of the British Parking Association (BPA) and has access to the DVLA database to obtain the details of vehicle owners.
- Epc Plc has been accused of sending penalty notices to drivers who have already paid their tolls or fines, or who have never used the infrastructures they claim.
- Epc Plc has also been criticised for charging excessive administrative fees and interest on top of the original tolls or fines.
- Epc Plc has no legal authority to enforce the payment of penalty notices in the UK, unless they obtain a court order from the country where the alleged offence took place
- Epc Plc has a low success rate in obtaining such court orders, as they often lack sufficient evidence or face legal challenges from the drivers
Based on this information, it seems that you have received a penalty notice from Epc Plc that is either fraudulent or erroneous. You have several options to deal with this situation:
You can contact Epc Plc and dispute the penalty notice. You can provide them with any evidence that you have paid the tolls or fines, such as receipts, bank statements or credit card bills. You can also ask them to provide you with more details about the alleged offence, such as date, time, place and direction of travel. You can also challenge their administrative fees and interest charges, as they may be unreasonable or unlawful. You can also ask them to prove that they obtain a court order from the country where the alleged offence took place.

You can also contact the car hire company or the toll management authorities in Portugal to verify if you owe any charges or if there was a system error in 2018

Hope this is useful to you.

https://www.justanswer.co.uk/law/nauoo- ... c-plc.html

[Lootman]

And if you ignore them and collect the equivalent of a CCJ in Portugal, would it matter a jot?

For me it would not. It is a civil judgement. so even if I went to Portugal again I would not be denied entry or detained for this. I might however not rent from the same hire company.

There are really 3 factors here:

1) The creditor is overseas. Such debts are always riskier and costlier to collect on.

2) This is a stale debt, over a year old. One could reasonably argue that their inaction for that long a period indicates acceptance of the situation.

3) The OP was prudent in ensuring that there was a transponder, which should have avoided this situation. The OP did nothing wrong. And he has even paid the toll, just not the egregious penalty.

[forgotusername]

Thanks to all who replied. Dicky99 said
"You can contact Epc Plc and dispute the penalty notice. You can provide them with any evidence that you have paid the tolls or fines, such as receipts, bank statements or credit card bills. You can also ask them to provide you with more details about the alleged offence, such as date, time, place and direction of travel. You can also challenge their administrative fees and interest charges, as they may be unreasonable or unlawful. You can also ask them to prove that they obtain a court order from the country where the alleged offence took place."

I am not disputing that I incurred these tolls. Whilst I no longer have record of the vehicle I hired, the route and dates are consistent with my holiday in May 2022. I have supplied EPC PLC with copies of my credit card statement showing it was still valid in September and told them it expired on 31 October 22. I have obtained evidence from the company in the UK that I use to book hire cars (Zest) who told me that
"Via Livre is currently facing a significant backlog in uploading this information, causing delays in verifying whether tolled roads were used, ultimately delaying the charging process.
This issue is not unique to a specific provider; it affects all Portuguese rental companies. Consequently, all of our partners are experiencing challenges in charging tolls to customers' cards."

I do regard the penalty element of the charge made by EPC PLC to be excessive, especially as I was unaware that I owed any money given the passage of time since the tolls were incurred.

I find dealing with EP PLC awkward. They do not display a phone number so one is oblige to use their web site to send messages. Their attitude is, if you don't supply new information, we will not reply to anything you say and the charge will remain.

There was a story in The Independent recently highlighting this problem, They said they had asked EPC PLC for comment and were told it could take eight weeks. https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/ne ... 46475.html

I am going to try to seek more information from Via Livre although I don't hold out great hopes for what they can tell me.

[stevensfo]

There was a story in The Independent recently highlighting this problem, They said they had asked EPC PLC for comment and were told it could take eight weeks. https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/ne ... 46475.html

I am going to try to seek more information from Via Livre although I don't hold out great hopes for what they can tell me.

They said they had asked EPC PLC for comment and were told it could take eight weeks.

The arrogance of companies like these leaves me speechless. Where's Esther Rantzen when you need her?


From Dicky99's post:

- Epc Plc is a member of the British Parking Association (BPA) and has access to the DVLA database to obtain the details of vehicle owners.
- Epc Plc has been accused of sending penalty notices to drivers who have already paid their tolls or fines, or who have never used the infrastructures they claim.
- Epc Plc has also been criticised for charging excessive administrative fees and interest on top of the original tolls or fines.

Maybe a complaint to to the BPA, a few strong letters, Private Eye, Twitter etc with comments like 'although we are not currently suggesting outright fraud or criminal activity, we nevertheless...' etc. i.e. Stay polite, but strong, steer clear of any suggestion of libel, and make it clear that the police should be involved.

Just enough to at least bring them down to earth.

Steve

[Dicky99]

There's various ways it could be challenged but I think I'd be inclined to focus on...

"Epc Plc has no legal authority to enforce the payment of penalty notices in the UK, unless they obtain a court order from the country where the alleged offence took place"

BPA should be able to confirm that prerequisite in which case you could respond to them saying, with a bit more finesse, "provide evidence of a court order or go whistle".

[scrumpyjack]

There is a discussion about this on MoneySavingExpert

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/di ... -toll-fine

The view is that having made your case, you should do nothing more and not respond to any communication from EPC.

My guess would be that the legal liability for the fine in Portugal is the owner of the car (the Hire company) and they are trying to recover the fine from you. But the fine was due to their incompetence.

Just ignore and do not engage with EPC on this

[forgotusername]

Further to the help you have all given, I searched the BPA web site and found that EPC PLC do not have a complaints policy, which most members do. So far as making a complaint to BPA, they require me to complain to EPC PLC first and to submit evidence that they are not acting on it. As EPC PLC don't have a complaints policy, this becomes more complicated. I will send a letter instead.

I have contacted Via Livre in Portugal to ask when they notified my hire company of the tolls my car had incurred. Annoyingly, although their web site has a submit button, clicking on it produces no response other than the button changes colour. To date, I have not received any acknowledgement of my query. I'm assuming the message was sent but may have to contact them again if I hear no more.

The MSE thread isn't really about tolls although it does mention EPC PLC.

I will see if The Independent got any response in due course.

The point about a court order is important, thank you.

[Lootman]

Just ignore and do not engage with EPC on this

I generally ignore such letters. That has the added benefit that the collections agency does not know for sure that you received the demand. Once you reply then they know that you got it and that you were concerned enough to take an action, which might prompt them to continue.

And for an amount as low as £82, I cannot imagine that the collections people are going to do very much more. It is certainly not worth going to court for that amount and many creditors write off amounts under £100 or some other round number.

A while ago I got a demand letter for a similar amount from 5 years earlier. I ignored it. They then sent a second letter threatening this and that. I ignored that as well. Then a third letter arrived saying that the debt had been cancelled. Result.

[stevensfo]

Further to the help you have all given, I searched the BPA web site and found that EPC PLC do not have a complaints policy, which most members do. So far as making a complaint to BPA, they require me to complain to EPC PLC first and to submit evidence that they are not acting on it. As EPC PLC don't have a complaints policy, this becomes more complicated. I will send a letter instead.

This is like something from Monty Python!!

"Sorry mate, yeah, we just mugged you, stole your money, broke your nose and kidnapped your children. But we don't have a complaints policy. Know what I mean, guv?"

What is YOUR policy?

Steve

[Dicky99]

You may or not be aware that their correspondence address is :-
Unit 6 Shepperton House
83-93 Shepperton Road, London N1 3DF.

Their Directors are:-
Stuart Hendry
Tsjerk Friso
Menno Martijn Van Ruler

Just in case you need somewhere to send a formal complaint letter.