Advice on Dying

[TAllen]

This is a difficult one to write, but I will just be practical and direct:

A widowed friend is shortly going into palliative care and will soon be leaving two teenage children orphaned. A family member will step in to care for the children as guardians. Several weeks ago, we submitted LPAs for health and finance, but they are unlikely to be approved in time (and there seems to be no expedited process). We are also named as executors in the Will.

The friend has varying degrees of lucidity and could go downhill at any stage. His Will is quite simple. There is one family home and substantial savings (which will thankfully give his sensible kids relative financial security). I understand his finances are quite simple, with not too many accounts. There are admin tasks like direct debits, figuring out how to transfer ownership of the car so the Guardian can insure it (while one of the kids is using it to learn to drive) and funeral arrangements.

I would appreciate any advice you could offer on what else can be done now (partial lucidity, without an LPA, ahead of Probate), particularly on any administrative actions to prepare, simplify matters, and ensure continuity for the kids. Thank you.

[DrFfybes]

What a horrible situation to be in, my sympathies.

One thing they could do now is do give you access to their accounts. Most institutions have their own PoA process where you can nominate a family member or friend to access your accounts without a general LPA.

This will at least allow you to familiarise yourself with their income and outgoings, and be more prepared for "keeping the lights on" when they do pass and all the accounts are frozen.

You may also consider getting the utility accounts moved into the name of the person who will eventually become responsible, and ensure they are paid from an account that will remain open and contain sufficient funds to get through the probate process. Oh, and make sure the new person knows the passwords for the online portals, and has changed the phone no on the account to their number.

Paul

[Gerry557]

You have a will so that's covered.

I would consider have some joint accounts so when the day comes there is some access to funds until probate and accounts are sorted. I'm assuming IHT is not an issue. He could makes gifts to his children or trusted person now to ease the complications.

Ask him to make a list of passwords to accounts. Facebook, email the NAS or whatever. Talk to the children and the guardian to see what needs they might have. I assume they intend to stay in the house. So admin for bills etc.

Sorry for your situation

[Lootman]

I would consider have some joint accounts so when the day comes there is some access to funds until probate and accounts are sorted.

I would second that, not least because with a joint account, probate becomes moot for that account. It passes automatically to the surviving account holder upon death.

A power of attorney is mostly moot if the subject is lucid and willing to give control to others.

Not all types of accounts can be held jointly however, such as ISAs and pension accounts.

[yorkshirelad1]

Sorry you are in this situation. There have been articles from time to time on TLF on what might be called "dying tidily" and the information that exors need to collect etc. If your friend is up to it, you might ask their help in filling in the form.

See for example
Dying tidily template: https://www.lemonfool.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=41938

Digital assets: https://lemonfool.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=33788

[TAllen]

@yorkshirelad1 @Lootman @Gerry557 @DrFfybes - heartfelt thanks for your kind advice.

We visited him last night and managed to discuss details of funeral wishes, insurances, documents etc. With your suggestions there are a few more for our visit today. Being a sole parent, he was very organised on the paperwork front and in planning for the kids who will be ok (in time). With your help, we are tying up loose ends and, all things considered, he will be able to leave with full peace of mind.

[Gerry557]

It might also be worth keeping the mobile phone going for a while too even if you reduce the contract. Might help with access to accounts email etc.

[Clitheroekid]

Several weeks ago, we submitted LPAs for health and finance, but they are unlikely to be approved in time (and there seems to be no expedited process).

As you managed to have a discussion with him yesterday you might consider suggesting that he provides you with a `Section 10' Power of Attorney.

This is a very simple PoA made in standard form as prescribed by section 10 and schedule 1 of the Powers of Attorney Act 1971 - https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1971/27/schedule/1

It doesn't need to be registered anywhere, so it can be used immediately it's been signed to deal with bank accounts etc. The only drawback is the reason LPA's were introduced, namely that it ceases to be valid if the donor loses mental capacity. However, from what you say, it's physical rather than mental illness that's the problem, so it may well be a useful option.

[Clitheroekid]

Something else just occurred to me. I've heard of life insurance policies that allow the proposer to increase the amount of cover without any medical checks, and that it's therefore possible to take advantage of this where the proposer is suffering from terminal illness.

I've no real knowledge of the life insurance market or any experience of this ever happening, but it's got to be worth just checking any life policies that your friend has on the off chance they might include such a provision.

[TAllen]

Thanks @Gerry557 and @Clitheroekid for your suggestions.

Section 10 is very helpful, e.g. to ensure life or pension benefits have the kids identified as beneficiaries (for instance). Access to the phone, email and digital accounts is in-hand, but a substantial job in its own right. Thankfully he was very organised.

It's a good reminder to all of us to keep our affairs in order for when the time comes.

[stewamax]

Financial arrangements after a death are dealt with elsewhere on this board, but two suggestions for whoever registers the death:
- do get lots of death certificates (@£11 ea.). Financial institutions will return them but may hold on to them for longer than is convenient
- do use the ‘Tell Us Once’ service that should be offered by the registrar

And:
- don’t immediately tell the deceased’s main clearing bank – you will have your hands full without all the direct debits and standing orders being frozen and in-payments from e.g. any pension blocked (I’m aware purists will disagree with this !)