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Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

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Julian
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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258234

Postby Julian » October 16th, 2019, 2:26 pm

Chrysalis wrote:Thanks Julian.
I wonder if you are able to tell me if linked bank account details can be changed online?


I did not receive the promised call back yesterday, to report back on my muddled accounts, but they seem to have rectified one account. Just the other one to go now, and also to make sure that my spouse’s SIPP charges are not going to be debited from my son’s account....
But I’ve wasted a number of hours on this whole takeover now. Sigh.

Bank account details can be changed online. To me somewhat confusingly it's under the "Cash & Transfers" drop-down-menu that you should see at the top of the screen which has a "bank account" menu option to take you to the screen where you can change that stuff. Personally I think of the nominated bank account as a property of my account/profile so I spent a while trying in vain to find it in the "Account" menu and sub-menus in the top right corner of the screen; don't make my mistake because that's not where it is.

Maybe it's the two of us adopting different terminology but you say "I need to be able to pay dividends away into two different accounts". I always take "pay dividends away" or sometimes "dividend pay-away" to mean that dividends recieved are automatically paid out ("paid away") to a nominated external bank account, either immediately on an as-received basis or lumped together and all paid out in a single automated transfer once per month (for ATS it was once per month on the 12th of each month I seem to remember). Note that this is exactly what IS NO LONGER POSSIBLE on the new ii system. You need to work out for yourself roughly what FIXED amount it might be safe for you to set up to be paid out regularly to your external account depending on the timing of the dividends you receive and what sort of float you are willing to leave in the ii account so that you don't end up with a fixed monthly payment failing due to insufficient dividends received that month and your float being depleted.

As I said, we're probably just using different terminology but I wanted to make 100% sure that my previous post hadn't been misunderstood

- Julian

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258245

Postby Lootman » October 16th, 2019, 3:20 pm

Julian wrote:
Chrysalis wrote:I also understood from what I read that II would pay out dividends as received.

Can any of the existing II account holders confirm the situation? Is it really the case that dividend payout has to be done manually?

My older ex-TDDI ii account inherited (or already had) the previous TDDI way of handling dividends, i.e. they will only accumulate in your cash management account

I'm not sure I understand that dividends can ONLY accumulate in your cash management account with ii. I mean, I'm sure you can do that, but you can also just let the cash sit in the sharedealing account itself. It doesn't earn interest but that doesn't amount to much anyway at current rates.

So at least in my case I don't need or have a separate cash account. The cash from dividends just sits in the sharedealing account along with any cash that is hitherto uninvested, or the proceeds from sales or corporate actions.

The rest is as you say. If you need some cash from that account it can be done by direct bank transfer via the site. The cash is usually in my bank account within a day or two. For my purpose it's not so much the cash only from dividends, but rather whatever amount I need. I might typically transfer 5K or 10K at a time - whatever I think I will need in the coming weeks and months. I don't want to be bothered moving small amounts, so just do it on an ad hoc basis.

With TD I did use to also have a savings account, but I think they went away when TD moved to ii, and I don't miss it.

Chrysalis
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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258289

Postby Chrysalis » October 16th, 2019, 5:48 pm

Thanks Julian, I think I understood your info.
My reference to two accounts was that in ATS, I had different linked bank accounts for each trading account I held (bare trust child accounts). II only allows one account to be linked per profile. That means I’ll have to manually switch between the accounts when I am manually draining them of the cash (I still can’t quite believe that they don’t have an automatic pay away facility, but hey ho).

Julian
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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258349

Postby Julian » October 16th, 2019, 11:20 pm

Lootman wrote:
Julian wrote:
Chrysalis wrote:I also understood from what I read that II would pay out dividends as received.

Can any of the existing II account holders confirm the situation? Is it really the case that dividend payout has to be done manually?

My older ex-TDDI ii account inherited (or already had) the previous TDDI way of handling dividends, i.e. they will only accumulate in your cash management account

I'm not sure I understand that dividends can ONLY accumulate in your cash management account with ii. I mean, I'm sure you can do that, but you can also just let the cash sit in the sharedealing account itself. It doesn't earn interest but that doesn't amount to much anyway at current rates.
...
With TD I did use to also have a savings account, but I think they went away when TD moved to ii, and I don't miss it.

Sorry Lootman. As it happens I accidentally used old (TD Waterhouse I think) terminology but now realise why that could be confusing.

In the old TDW days they called the place where the cash component of your account was held the CMA (cash management account) as opposed to your actual holdings and some of their detailed documentation used that terminology. As you say that’s actually invisible to the user. When you logged on it just looked as if you had a bunch of shares and a cash balance (which might have been zero) in your “account” but what it was actually showing you was the list of shares in your trading account and then, for the cash held, it was giving you the balance of the CMA associated with your trading account. A CMA was always automatically opened for you when you applied for a trading account because it would be impossible for cash to ever be held unless there was a CMA attached to the trading account. All settlement amounts were to/from the CMA. As you say it was also possible to open a savings account as well but that was optional.

Anyway, basically your understanding is what I was intending to say. Dividends accumulate as cash in your account unless to take action to withdraw them either as a one off transfer out or by regular scheduled payments out of the account (essentially a standing order paid to your nominated external bank account) where for the later you have to be careful that sufficient cash is in the account to meet those standing orders.

- Julian

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258838

Postby malkymoo » October 18th, 2019, 6:07 pm

Julian wrote:Anyway, basically your understanding is what I was intending to say. Dividends accumulate as cash in your account unless to take action to withdraw them either as a one off transfer out or by regular scheduled payments out of the account (essentially a standing order paid to your nominated external bank account) where for the later you have to be careful that sufficient cash is in the account to meet those standing orders.

- Julian


I would like to take regular scheduled payments from my ISA (which is what I used to do with AST) as you describe above. However on enquiring about that via II secure messages, I was told it was not possible. I did notice that there is a pull-down menu on the cash withdrawal page, but it could not be moved from the default "single payment".

Am I missing something?

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258856

Postby Parky » October 18th, 2019, 7:33 pm

I knew it was all going too well! I have been locked out of my account for a couple of days now and no-one knows why so far. Several phone calls and new passwords have not resolved the problem. They are trying to blame it on my computer/browser, but I haven't had any other problems anywhere else :( . Anyone else having problems?

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258872

Postby Dod101 » October 18th, 2019, 8:55 pm

In summary I think the answer to the last two posts is no and no. I finally established that with II your dividends can accumulate for as long as you like but when you want some or all of that accumulated cash you have to go in to the website and instruct that however much of the accumulated you want paid to your bank account. I was an II customer in the past and the funds usually arrive within 24 hours.

I have not been locked out but at the end of week 1 my ATS ISA remains with ATS although my SIP has transferred over.

Dod

Chrysalis
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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258876

Postby Chrysalis » October 18th, 2019, 9:32 pm

I do find the lack of an automatic dividend payout facility to be quite a basic omission. I’ve never come across another broker that doesn’t provide it, albeit in slightly varying ways.

I’m not locked out, but my accounts are still not properly set up. The joint account mandate that I filled in and sent to ATS, and received assurances that this would be transferred to II, has not in fact done so. I was slightly alarmed when my customer service bod started saying again that it ‘wasn’t possible’ to change an account from sole to joint (this is what they said before, and the reason I went through the rigamarole of getting it changed with ATS). We will see what Monday brings.

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258903

Postby CryptoPlankton » October 19th, 2019, 1:12 am

malkymoo wrote:
Julian wrote:Anyway, basically your understanding is what I was intending to say. Dividends accumulate as cash in your account unless to take action to withdraw them either as a one off transfer out or by regular scheduled payments out of the account (essentially a standing order paid to your nominated external bank account) where for the later you have to be careful that sufficient cash is in the account to meet those standing orders.

- Julian


I would like to take regular scheduled payments from my ISA (which is what I used to do with AST) as you describe above. However on enquiring about that via II secure messages, I was told it was not possible. I did notice that there is a pull-down menu on the cash withdrawal page, but it could not be moved from the default "single payment".

Am I missing something?


Between us, puffster and I managed to work out how to set this up in this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=26&t=11942#p142263

You will need to open a non-ISA trading account if you don't already have one. Then set up a regular payment from the ISA to the trading account and a regular payment for the same amount from the trading account to your nominated bank account.

It seems unnecessarily clunky, and you need to be sure to complete all the fields exactly as described in the penultimate post of the linked thread (and in one attempt), but it does the job perfectly satisfactorily once done.

HTH

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258908

Postby Chrysalis » October 19th, 2019, 8:24 am

Thanks for that. Doesn’t really solve the issue though, if you can only regularly pay a fixed amount, rather than all dividends accumulated. I hold funds that pay our annually, six-monthly and quarterly, hence the income fluctuates widely. ATS, IWeb and Youinvest permit payout of all dividends, either as they arrive, or at a specified frequency. It doesn’t seem a lot to ask.

Aiui my only workaround will be logging on and periodically draining the account manually.

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258911

Postby Dod101 » October 19th, 2019, 8:49 am

That is an interesting but clunky system on the separate thread. I think like most, I have a problem in that income from dividends fluctuates wildly from one month to the next and so I do not/am not able to set up one fixed amount. I will simply operate the transfer myself but you would think that II could do it. They even have the example of the ATS system to use.

I wonder why they are so anti it?

Dod

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258916

Postby swill453 » October 19th, 2019, 9:53 am

Chrysalis wrote:Thanks for that. Doesn’t really solve the issue though, if you can only regularly pay a fixed amount, rather than all dividends accumulated. I hold funds that pay our annually, six-monthly and quarterly, hence the income fluctuates widely. ATS, IWeb and Youinvest permit payout of all dividends, either as they arrive, or at a specified frequency. It doesn’t seem a lot to ask.

Are you sure? I'm with Youinvest and I'm not aware of a facility to pay out dividends as they arrive.

Scott.

Julian
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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258921

Postby Julian » October 19th, 2019, 10:36 am

Chrysalis wrote:... ATS, IWeb and Youinvest permit payout of all dividends, either as they arrive, or at a specified frequency. It doesn’t seem a lot to ask.
...

As does Hargreaves Lansdown and not surprisingly (since like iWeb they are all based on the Halifax platform) also Halifax and Lloyds. Barclays also had divi pay-away at the time I was with them (before I left after a change in fee structure that was very negative for my use case) and I assume still does.

I agree that it seems a pretty basic capability that I would hope ii might add in the future. I'm not sure I'm willing to wait around in the hope that happens though.

- Julian

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258926

Postby genou » October 19th, 2019, 10:55 am

swill453 wrote:
Chrysalis wrote:Thanks for that. Doesn’t really solve the issue though, if you can only regularly pay a fixed amount, rather than all dividends accumulated. I hold funds that pay our annually, six-monthly and quarterly, hence the income fluctuates widely. ATS, IWeb and Youinvest permit payout of all dividends, either as they arrive, or at a specified frequency. It doesn’t seem a lot to ask.

Are you sure? I'm with Youinvest and I'm not aware of a facility to pay out dividends as they arrive.

Scott.


As stated "at a specified frequency" : which is monthly/quarterly/six-monthly/yearly with Youinvest.

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258927

Postby swill453 » October 19th, 2019, 10:59 am

genou wrote:
swill453 wrote:Are you sure? I'm with Youinvest and I'm not aware of a facility to pay out dividends as they arrive.


As stated "at a specified frequency" : which is monthly/quarterly/six-monthly/yearly with Youinvest.

I see, it wasn't an assertion that both facilities were available.

I tend to manually withdraw dividends as they arrive, I don't really want to wait up to a month.

Scott.

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#258944

Postby CryptoPlankton » October 19th, 2019, 11:51 am

Dod101 wrote:That is an interesting but clunky system on the separate thread. I think like most, I have a problem in that income from dividends fluctuates wildly from one month to the next and so I do not/am not able to set up one fixed amount. I will simply operate the transfer myself but you would think that II could do it. They even have the example of the ATS system to use.

I wonder why they are so anti it?

Dod

Personally, I don't find it a problem to maintain a sufficient balance in the account to absorb the fluctuations in monthly dividend payments. Knowing the expected income for the year, I set set the monthly transfer amount accordingly (with an appropriate safety margin). That way, I just have to tidy up and review the situation once a year.

I can see that it may not be ideal for some people's needs, but it actually suits me to have a known and consistent income coming from my ii investments each month.

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#259290

Postby knechtruprecht » October 21st, 2019, 4:12 pm

One idea ... is it worth exploring what would happen if you set up a payment amount larger than the largest you expect the balance to be each month?
Would the system: a) pay nothing; b) pay the balance actually available; or c) would shares be sold from somewhere automatically to make up the difference?

If b), you're sorted ... if a) or c) ignore this.

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#259323

Postby Chrysalis » October 21st, 2019, 6:50 pm

Worth asking, I suppose!

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#259338

Postby Lootman » October 21st, 2019, 7:36 pm

knechtruprecht wrote:One idea ... is it worth exploring what would happen if you set up a payment amount larger than the largest you expect the balance to be each month?

Would the system: a) pay nothing; b) pay the balance actually available; or c) would shares be sold from somewhere automatically to make up the difference?

Or (d), give you a negative balance in your cash account, on which interest will accrue. And probably notify you to supply extra cash or sell something.

That's the default if you have a margin feature in your account, which also lets you buy securities for which you do not (yet) have the funds. If the debit balance exceeds the margin you are allowed then they issue a margin call which, again, requires you to produce funds within a set period of time.

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Re: Alliance Trust Savings taken over by Interactive Investor

#259362

Postby EthicsGradient » October 21st, 2019, 9:35 pm

The conditions for a regular withdrawal say:

Please be aware that your withdrawal will not be actioned if:
There are insufficient funds in the account on the date selected for withdrawal
You currently have some outstanding trades that need some or all of these funds in order to settle. Withdrawing some or all of these funds would therefore reduce your personal trading level to below what you are currently trading
N.B The rejection of a withdrawal request would not occur until the withdrawal date itself

which sounds to me like "(a) pay nothing" would happen.


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