Welsh Lamb

[richlist]

Why do Welsh farmers export lamb to the EU when the supermarkets are full of Lamb imported from New Zealand ?

Seems a rather strange set up!
Surely Welsh farmers can sell their meat in their home market after Brexit.......or am I missing something ?

Moderator Message:
Moved from DAK to the Snug leaving a link as the question probably doesn't have a concise answer and has inevitably evolved into a discussion. - Chris

[swill453]

Why do Welsh farmers export lamb to the EU when the supermarkets are full of Lamb imported from New Zealand ?

Seems a rather strange set up!
Surely Welsh farmers can sell their meat in their home market after Brexit.......or am I missing something ?

Welsh sheep farmers don't earn very much (apparently about £16k p.a.). I'd imagine they already sell their lamb to the most lucrative market they can find.

Taking that market away from them and telling them to sell somewhere else doesn't seem like the kindest thing to do to them...

Scott.

[richlist]

This isn't rocket science is it ?

Surely lamb from Wales has got to be cheaper than lamb shipped from New Zealand.

We can't buy it if they choose to sell it to the EU.......

[swill453]

We can't buy it if they choose to sell it to the EU.......

We can't buy it if our supermarket buyers don't pay them enough to live on.

Scott.

[ReformedCharacter]

Surely lamb from Wales has got to be cheaper than lamb shipped from New Zealand.

You might think so, but I don't think that is the case. I do know that the UK was buying considerable amounts of lamb and butter from NZ before the UK joined the EEC.

RC

[Alaric]

. I do know that the UK was buying considerable amounts of lamb and butter from NZ before the UK joined the EEC.

The EEC imposed tariffs, quotas or both on New Zealand produce. Memories of 1939-45 were still relatively recent in 1972 so when left to own decisions the UK Government offered British farmers subsidies in the interests of local food production even if they weren't price competitive. Once the UK joined the EEC, we were required to join the Common Agricultural policy which had its own rules, mostly written in the interests of French farmers.

[vrdiver]

This isn't rocket science is it ?

Surely lamb from Wales has got to be cheaper than lamb shipped from New Zealand.

We can't buy it if they choose to sell it to the EU.......

Actually no. New Zealand lamb has much lower production costs, whilst container shipping makes the additional transport costs negligible.

The Welsh farmers are currently expressing concern that lamb should not be part of any FTA with New Zealand, as without a protectionist tariff they could be wiped out by the loss of the EU market (uncompetitive with an added tariff) and UK market (wiped out by NZ tariff free imports) as their meat costs more and UK consumers are not known for their flag loyalty where their wallets are involved.

VRD

[richlist]

Why didn't they or their representatives or the Welsh Minister etc raise this as an issue leading up to the referendum ?

It's no good coming along after the event.

[swill453]

Why didn't they or their representatives or the Welsh Minister etc raise this as an issue leading up to the referendum ?

It's no good coming along after the event.

Yeah, nobody voiced any concerns about brexit, did they? Oh, wait...


Scott.

[richlist]

The point is that we are hearing about this and other issues for the first time.......they were not widely highlighted to the general public leading up to the referendum.

Who is responsible for that ?
There have to be representatives in Wales and Government officials who WERE responsible.......I do hope they are not the same people making a noise about it now and demanding The Gov take action to mitigate.

The chance to raise this as an issue came and went in 2016.

Welsh lamb is where it is......currently on its way to the EU.

[swill453]

The chance to raise this as an issue came and went in 2016.

It was raised, a lot. See https://www.google.com/search?q=welsh+l ... 62&bih=937

And don't forget that many in the Leave campaign were promising that leaving single market would be madness and the last thing they were advocating https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson_MP/sta ... 4024602624

Scott.

[richlist]

The chance to raise this as an issue came and went in 2016.

It was raised, a lot. See https://www.google.com/search?q=welsh+l ... 62&bih=937

And don't forget that many in the Leave campaign were promising that leaving single market would be madness and the last thing they were advocating https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson_MP/sta ... 4024602624

Scott.

Not in my part of Essex.......not on prime time tv and not in my daily newspapers.......and not any more or less than the Irish border was discussed in 2016.

Those that may have picked up a snippet of news about it in 2016 certainly didn't broadcast it to the voters at large.

If it's such a big issue it should have been shouted about in 2016......it wasnt.......opportunity missed.

[swill453]

If it's such a big issue it should have been shouted about in 2016......it wasnt.......opportunity missed.

Like I said (or implied anyway), nobody in 2016 had a clue about what type of brexit was likely to come to pass in the event of a yes vote. So it's disingenuous and unfair to accuse anyone of missing an opportunity to object.

Scott.

[XFool]

Why didn't they or their representatives or the Welsh Minister etc raise this as an issue leading up to the referendum ?

It's no good coming along after the event.

Are you sure it wasn't part of "Project Fear"?

[richlist]

It's certainly short sighted to assume that a vote to leave the EU would result in Welsh farmers being unaffected.

The period leading up to the referendum was supposed to be a period of 'due dilligence'. Welsh farmers ......&/or their representatives .......should have done their homework to identify the effects on them of a leave vote and any negative impacts that might affect them.

There was always the possibility of 'no deal' exit so that shouldn't be a surprise now.

[Maroochydore]

Personally I prefer fresh Welsh lamb to frozen New Zealand lamb and am prepared to pay a bit extra for it. Perhaps Welsh farmers need to get some expert marketing to present it as a premium product.

A few years old now but this makes interesting reading https://alexrenton.com/2013/03/28/good- ... -waitrose/

A couple of excerpts:
At my local butcher in Edinburgh, Bower’s, manager Mark Smith said darkly that the supermarkets ship in Kiwi lamb just because there’s more profit in it. At wholesale he’d found New Zealand lamb £2.50 to £5 a kilo cheaper than British – but that price difference doesn’t get handed to the customer. The National Farmers’ Union backs this accusation.

We put the two lambs to the test. I served the family cutlets, the little chops taken from the neck: each got two perfect jewels of pink fillet, and a little rib to chew on. They looked identical, but they were grown 11,000 miles apart: one was Scottish, the other from New Zealand.....The Scottish lamb won 4 votes to zero: “More flavour, juicier – a million times better.” The New Zealand lamb wasn’t bad: a little sweet, a bit bland, as you might expect from something that has spent a couple of months on ice.

[Nimrod103]

This isn't rocket science is it ?

Surely lamb from Wales has got to be cheaper than lamb shipped from New Zealand.

We can't buy it if they choose to sell it to the EU.......

Actually no. New Zealand lamb has much lower production costs, whilst container shipping makes the additional transport costs negligible.

The Welsh farmers are currently expressing concern that lamb should not be part of any FTA with New Zealand, as without a protectionist tariff they could be wiped out by the loss of the EU market (uncompetitive with an added tariff) and UK market (wiped out by NZ tariff free imports) as their meat costs more and UK consumers are not known for their flag loyalty where their wallets are involved.

VRD

I thought a big remainer argument was the high cost of shipping makes closer markets more important. But the New Zealander’s don’t have an issue with this?
PS IME New Zealand lamb chops are bigger and better than pathetic Welsh ones. Why would that be?

[Archtronics]

Government has two choices.

Keep quoters and high welfare regulations so welsh lamb is protected.
Or
Cut regulation/welfare and allow factory farming, then lamb producers will be able to compete with NZ, Aus, US etc.

Seems to me the latter is what was on offer from the leave camp, so is the likely outcome.

[swill453]

There was always the possibility of 'no deal' exit so that shouldn't be a surprise now.

I'd challenge you to find mention of it before the referendum. But that would take this further from DAK territory.

Scott.

[terminal7]

Are you sure it wasn't part of "Project Fear"?

Now part of Project Lemming

T7