Slave Trader's Statue Chucked into the Drink

[csearle]

A slave trader's statue in Bristol has been torn down and thrown into the harbour during a second day of anti-racism protests across the UK!

Now I don't agree with infringing of the social distancing involved with this protest (although I've been convinced by the Oxford University Epidemiology experts that the social distancing we are employing has had little to do with the progress of mortality in this or any other country) but there has to be something quite satisfying about tearing down the statue of a slave trader as a symbol of wrong-doing.

Mind you this has been kicked off by the unforgivable murder of a black guy in America, who apparently was physically huge and a known armed robber, so whilst murdering him on the street isn't good or just, it is understandable that the police involved were motivated to prevent him from gaining the upper hand. They went too far though.

Chris

[OLTB]

Hi Chris

I’ve lived in Bristol for many years and the use of Colston’s name has been bitterly debated. Recently, the refurbishment of Colston Hall brought about an argument that the name should be updated as well. Bristol has many references to the historical slave trade and many argue that this is uncomfortable.

Personally, I don’t think that a statue to a slave trader should be displayed, but I also believe that mob rule and tearing it down isn’t correct either.

My main thoughts though when I see this vandalism, police horses having bikes thrown at them, the M6 being brought to a standstill etc. is where is the government of the day? We need some leadership and they are being mighty quiet.

Cheers, OLTB.

[UncleEbenezer]

Meeja are calling him "the slave trader Edward Colston".

How true is that? Was he first and foremost a slave trader, who made his fortune as proprietor of a slave trading fleet? Or was he much more peripherally involved - perhaps having the level of culpability of Fools holding shares in arms, tobacco, oils, etc, and more scapegoat than villain?

[ReformedCharacter]

... but there has to be something quite satisfying about tearing down the statue of a slave trader as a symbol of wrong-doing.
Chris

If you're condoning lawless mob-rule then that's a slippery slope.

RC

[Laughton]

Not absolutely certain but understand that they are going to rename Colston Hall as something else, once they finish all the building work.

Does this man that every reference to anything historical that was acceptable at the time but now isn't has to be removed? How about history books? Are they all now to be re-issued with any such references removed?

[jackdaww]

Meeja are calling him "the slave trader Edward Colston".

How true is that? Was he first and foremost a slave trader, who made his fortune as proprietor of a slave trading fleet? Or was he much more peripherally involved - perhaps having the level of culpability of Fools holding shares in arms, tobacco, oils, etc, and more scapegoat than villain?

===============

let he who is without .....

[swill453]

Learning about him (and his atrocities) is fine. Glorifying him is not. May not have been subtle, but the end is surely just.

Scott.

[Mike4]

The trouble is, no one man is either all good, or all bad*, and Colston is an excellent example.

Someone wise and famous once noted this but a brief goggle did not reveal who. If I'm wrong and they didn't, I'm claiming it for myself


* There seems to be one exception according to a book I read some bits from, when I was at skool. I wasn't convinced.

[swill453]

The trouble is, no one man is either all good, or all bad*, and Colston is an excellent example.

Wow, what an offensive semi-justification.

How much do you consider the goodness or badness of each of the 80,000+ human beings he was responsible for selling into slavery?

Scott.

[Mike4]

The trouble is, no one man is either all good, or all bad*, and Colston is an excellent example.

Wow, what an offensive semi-justification.

How much do you consider the goodness or badness of each of the 80,000+ human beings he was responsible for selling into slavery?

Scott.

It's not a justification so much as an observation. An observation that line has to be drawn and where to draw lines gets difficult once you start off down that route.

As you are lumping Colston in with Hitler as 100% evil, who next is up for your vilification? One for PD really, not here.

[bungeejumper]

I know Bristol pretty well, although I don't go there so much these days. The council has been dragging its feet for decades about the need to dissociate itself from Colston's filthy trade, and the issue of removing the statue has been discussed into the ground, but nothing has been done. To the best of my knowledge, Colston got rich on slaving and then turned his money over to good works for the city, just as people with bad consciences have been doing since the Middle Ages.

The issue goes back a long way further back than the current mayor Marvin Rees, who I used to know, a very long time ago. Marvin's problem is that he's (a) a left-liberal Blairite sort of guy, and (b) of mixed race himself - and that's why he looked so embarrassed on last night's news. It's probably also part of the reason why the police were instructed not to impede something that Marvin had been planning to do anyway.

Not that he'd have found it politically easy to do. Bristol's council has been locked in a bitter three-party civil war for the last twenty years at least, and all kinds of bizarre decisions have happened because one party was trying to spite the other two. Would gladly offer examples, but the slippery slope toward Polite Discussions is always there, and I think it would be best to avoid it.

BJ

[UncleEbenezer]

I lived briefly in Bristol many years ago. I remember the Colston Hall as the city's main venue for music. But I had no idea where the name came from, nor was there any controversy (so far as I know). As for the statue, I don't even know where that was: I don't see the interest in statues.

But it occurs to me, surely if we go down the road of demolishing statues of malefactors, we'll have very few statues left anywhere in the country. And a city like Bristol, if it wants to show virtue rather than virtue-signalling, should switch from digging up history to tackling today's evils, such as BAE.

Meanwhile, I hope none of those who took Colston down are so hypocritical as to have condemned others taking down heritage they find unacceptable. Like the Taliban demolishing the Bamiyan Buddhas.

[redsturgeon]

Moderator Message:
This topic is more suitable for the Polite Discussions Forum. I've ;locked this thread here and there is a thread over there if you wish to discuss further.