Pubs of old London and elsewhere

[brightncheerful]

https://spitalfieldslife.com/2020/07/06/the-pubs-of-old-london-o/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pub#Origins

Yonks ago, effectively anyone could open a pub to provide extra income, so anyone did. In those days, the pub might be no more than the front room of the person's home. Pubs were generally warmer than people's homes so were more appealing than going home after work. The Wine and Beerhouse Act 1869 reintroduced the stricter controls of the previous century. The sale of beers, wines or spirits required a licence for the premises. whereupon the pubs that were not viable closed and the customers went elsewhere.

In 1577, there was one pub for every 187 people.

In our town, there were 47 pubs originally (1911 population 9,000, 1801 population 3500) Nowadays, in our town there are about 10 pubs.

useful link for whereabouts of closed pubs:
http://www.closedpubs.co.uk/index.html

I have contributed info to the closed pubs project. Some years ago when scanning old auction catalogues, I sent the project organiser lots of photos of former pubs that were being sold.



How many pubs in your town compared to how many originally?

[bungeejumper]

In 1901 there were eleven pubs in our village, which had a population of 800. Since 2000 we've had only one, and nowadays there are 1,100 residents. The village forge, the baker's shop and the post office were all part-time pubs in the evenings - whereas nowadays it's the pub that's the post office.

Pubs had another function apart from keeping the village population warm in the evenings. (And, of course, entertaining them in the absence of TV.) As long as the beer was strong enough, they performed a sterling service in terms of birth control.

BJ

[scotia]

How many pubs in your town compared to how many originally?

In the nearest two towns to our village there were zero pubs (veto polled) until 1967/68. There are now a few.
In our village possibly the smoking ban killed the one pub a few years ago, along with others in neighbouring villages - although none of them were any great loss. We still have an hotel, with a reasonably civilized bar, in our village.

[Rhyd6]

According to the 1911 census there were 11 pubs/ale houses on a 3 mile stretch of road which runs through our village. There is now 1 and the future of this is looking decidedly dodgy. Opening at the moment shouldn't be too bad because there is a large car park that can be used for al fresco drinking but the pub itself isn't very big and social distancing inside will be very difficult. To be honest I can't say that we've missed the pub that much, we've been having our own "Friday Night Inn" with several local people strolling up on a Friday evening bringing their own drinks and it's been great just to sit around at safe distances and chat. When the weather is wet we've adjourned to the barn, again there is enough room for social distancing. At the moment the general consensus is that we'll carry on as we are until the weather turns cooler then we'll have to revue the situation.

R6

[bluedonkey]

Where I grew up, there were 5 pubs, now there's 4, so not much of a reduction.

In the City of London, these pubs I used to frequent but now gone:

Old King Lud
The Cartoonist
The Hatchet
The Witness Box
The Poppinjay

[AleisterCrowley]

I think I've been to The Cartoonist - New Fetter Lane/Fleet St area?

[bluedonkey]

I think I've been to The Cartoonist - New Fetter Lane/Fleet St area?

That's it. It had a ground floor and a basement bar. Watney Combe Reid I think but I can't recall what I drank there, maybe Stag Bitter or Guinness. On Little New Street opposite Hill House where I worked. Many, many years ago!

[AleisterCrowley]

Part of an ugly tower block, if that's the one?

[bluedonkey]

Part of an ugly tower block, if that's the one?

It was certainly a modern pub rather than Victorian.

[tjh290633]

I believe that Marlborough had 5 pubs next door to each other in the 1950s. It may still have.

TJH

[marronier]

The reason there were so many pubs in bygone days is that water was dangerous to drink , so the pubs were there to brew and sell the small beers and beer that was safer to drink.

Drinkable water, improved home furnishings , drinks availability in supermarkets , changing demographic habits , gastropubs , prices , increasing rents and business rates , site values are increasingly reducing the number of pubs.

[swill453]

In our town in central Scotland, population c19,000, we have 11 pubs, football club, cricket club and a couple of bowling clubs.

Scott.

[bluedonkey]

Where I grew up, there were 5 pubs, now there's 4, so not much of a reduction.

I just remembered, although there's one less pub, the old infants school has been converted to a club/bar, so no overall reduction.

[scotia]

The reason there were so many pubs in bygone days is that water was dangerous to drink , so the pubs were there to brew and sell the small beers and beer that was safer to drink.

Drinkable water, improved home furnishings , drinks availability in supermarkets , changing demographic habits , gastropubs , prices , increasing rents and business rates , site values are increasingly reducing the number of pubs.

By1860 there was a pure water supply from Loch Katrine to Glasgow. But that didn't appear to affect the density of pubs in Glasgow, although it certainly reduced the cholera. My grandfather often repeated that he had seen many a good man ruined in a Glasgow Public house (more than a century ago).

[PinkDalek]

... On Little New Street opposite Hill House where I worked. Many, many years ago!

Yikes, The Cartoonist & the Touche Ross gang!

Thank goodness The Blackfriars is still there I assume. Usually spoilt by was it Peats or PWs?

King Lud was fine (way back then) but we used to get hammered in the Hoop & Grapes (I think now revamped or similar).

Then there was the City Golf Club (surely no longer exists).

[bluedonkey]

... On Little New Street opposite Hill House where I worked. Many, many years ago!

Yikes, The Cartoonist & the Touche Ross gang!

Thank goodness The Blackfriars is still there I assume. Usually spoilt by was it Peats or PWs?

King Lud was fine (way back then) but we used to get hammered in the Hoop & Grapes (I think now revamped or similar).

Then there was the City Golf Club (surely no longer exists).

Yes, Touche Ross. I was trying to remember the Hoop & Grapes (Farringdon Rd) but hardly ever went in there , I was mixing it up with the Magpie & Stump (Old Bailey). The Blackfriars with the copper top to the bar, Peat Marwick Mitchell's watering hole round the corner from their offices on Puddle Dock.

The City Golf Club! I was taken there once by a "member" about 4pm when the pubs were shut. I seem to recall we went there to watch the Derby. I imagine it has gone as its only raison d'etre was to drink outside licensing hours.

My regular lunchtime haunt was the Coach & Horses on Whitefriars St, sawdust on the floor, jumbo sausage roll for lunch and the only pub ever where the barman started pouring my pint as soon as he saw me come in.

The Hatchet was notorious for not having a Ladies loo!

[PinkDalek]

[... I was mixing it up with the Magpie & Stump (Old Bailey).

Not a regular there and I had to look it up. Somewhat confused by 'A Dickens’ pub in the heart of The City of London. With a history stretching back to 1550 The Magpie & Stump combines an historic London pub with modern day party venue. ...' from https://www.magpieandstump.com/ as I don't recall anything old about the refurbished entirety of 20 (inc 18?) Old Bailey and I don't think we went there before the major refurbishment.

There were too many to chose from but I think (my nearest to us) favourite was probably Ye Old Mitre off Ely Place/Hatton Garden https://www.yeoldemitreholborn.co.uk/. Not only for the beer but more that it was slightly off the beaten track and one was less likely to be spotted, when was meant to be elsewhere during a hot summer afternoon.

Thanks for recharging Ye Olde Brain. We are planning a City pub crawl at some stage and may look up the Coach & Horses on Whitefriars St, assuming it is still there.

[bluedonkey]

There is still a pub where the Coach & Horses was but as is the way, I think they've gone upmarket - not difficult, mind. The News of the World printing presses were across the road, the printers used to come in and get a tray of pints to take back.

[AleisterCrowley]

A few of those ring a bell (definitely the Blackfriar, just north of the bridge) but I was based in SE1 so our locals were south of the river (shudder)
Nearest were the Ship, and the Goose and Firkin (now the Duke of York)
There was (is) a lovely old pub on Borough High St with galleries etc - Greene King so average beer

[bluedonkey]

A few of those ring a bell (definitely the Blackfriar, just north of the bridge) but I was based in SE1 so our locals were south of the river (shudder)
Nearest were the Ship, and the Goose and Firkin (now the Duke of York)
There was (is) a lovely old pub on Borough High St with galleries etc - Greene King so average beer

I remember the Goose & Firkin. At one time there were 8 Firkin pubs in London. This meant back when there was a separate lunch and evening opening, you could do all 8 pubs over a 4 day Easter weekend, not that I ever managed that though knew some who did.
The Borough High St pub I think is the old coaching inn, now full of tourists, called The George Inn. Still worth a visit though.