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The Grand National

A virtual pub for off topic, light hearted pub related banter and discussion. No trainers
PinkDalek
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Re: The Grand National

#403284

Postby PinkDalek » April 10th, 2021, 7:37 pm

AleisterCrowley wrote:
PinkDalek wrote:
AleisterCrowley wrote:yes, just checked - BoyleSports pay to 7th


That’s good. What do they pay e/w for the places? 1/7th?

..

Erm...well , £27 back from £5 e/w at 22/1
Go figure!



Looks like 1/5th then!

£5 stake plus £22 (5*22/5).

AleisterCrowley
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Re: The Grand National

#403287

Postby AleisterCrowley » April 10th, 2021, 7:42 pm

I'll take your word for it. I've never understood odds (what does 11/4 mean?)

PinkDalek
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Re: The Grand National

#403290

Postby PinkDalek » April 10th, 2021, 7:48 pm

Say you bet £5 to win & you hit lucky. Your winnings are £5 * the 11 & divide by the 4 (or same as £5 * 2.75). Plus you get your original stake back.

I’ll leave others to explain E/W or place etc as short on time way past beer O’clock.

AleisterCrowley
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Re: The Grand National

#403299

Postby AleisterCrowley » April 10th, 2021, 9:00 pm

Ah that makes sense - obvious when explained, but '2.75 'would make it easier for me to visualise
Looking at randon footie on 888 , Rangers v. Hibs is 14/5 the draw
So that is just 'fourteen fifths' ie 2.8 , so if you bet £10 on the draw you get £28 back plus your stake so £38?
What does 'on ' mean?

SalvorHardin
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Re: The Grand National

#403304

Postby SalvorHardin » April 10th, 2021, 9:48 pm

AleisterCrowley wrote:Ah that makes sense - obvious when explained, but '2.75 'would make it easier for me to visualise
Looking at randon footie on 888 , Rangers v. Hibs is 14/5 the draw
So that is just 'fourteen fifths' ie 2.8 , so if you bet £10 on the draw you get £28 back plus your stake so £38?
What does 'on ' mean?

Yes, 14/5 is the same as 2.8 to 1. £10 bet = £38 if win as you've stated. Implied probability of a win is 5 / (14 + 5) = 5/19

Watch out because where bookies quote "decimal odds", such as Betfair or the Tote (e.g. 1.80) , the return of your stake is built into the price. So bet £10 at 1.80 and you get £18 back if you win made up.of your £10 stake plus £8 winnings.

Whereas with fractional odds the price is your winnings AND in addition you get your stake back.

"Odds on" is a term in fractional odds where the denominator is higher than the numerator. So odds of "4-1 on" are actually 1-4, i.e. bet £4 to win £1

AleisterCrowley
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Re: The Grand National

#403307

Postby AleisterCrowley » April 10th, 2021, 9:54 pm

bookies quote "decimal odds", such as Betfair or the Tote (e.g. 1.80) , the return of your stake is built into the price.

oooh nasty, thanks for the warning
So in the 14/5 case they would quote as 3.8?

terminal7
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Re: The Grand National

#403308

Postby terminal7 » April 10th, 2021, 9:59 pm

Watch out because where bookies quote "decimal odds", such as Betfair or the Tote (e.g. 1.80) , the return of your stake is built into the price. So bet £10 at 1.80 and you get £18 back if you win made up.of your £10 stake plus £8 winnings.


Of course 1.8 is equivalent to 4/5 with Bookies - though it would probably be 8/11 or even 4/6 in reality.

Betfair beats bookies' prices around 97% of the time. That's because the over round with bookies is usually 115% give or take (actually around 150% on Grand National - every horse was better with Betfair) compared with maybe 101% over round with Betfair. You do need to take account that Betfair will charge a commission - depends on your turnover with them - but even then betting with Betfair can make the difference between winning and losing over time.

T7

conflict of Interest statement - I have shares in Flutter and they own Betfair as well as Paddy Power - I also have shares in William Hill.

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Re: The Grand National

#403311

Postby Mike4 » April 10th, 2021, 10:12 pm

AleisterCrowley wrote:
PinkDalek wrote:
AleisterCrowley wrote:yes, just checked - BoyleSports pay to 7th


That’s good. What do they pay e/w for the places? 1/7th?

..

Erm...well , £27 back from £5 e/w at 22/1
Go figure!



Now my interest is piqued. I know little about betting but when I settled your bet I got £67.86 due back to you, including return of your stake.

£2.50 to win @ 22/1 = £55.00
£2.50 place @ 22/1 = £ 7.88
Stake return £. 5.00
TOTAL £ 67.86

OddsMonkey agrees with me if you dab in your numbers
https://www.oddsmonkey.com/matched-bett ... alculator/

AleisterCrowley
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Re: The Grand National

#403313

Postby AleisterCrowley » April 10th, 2021, 10:26 pm

£5 each way so £5 to win , and £5 for a place = £10 total bet

Well my nag romped home in 7th place * so
£5 each way, odds 22/1
Not a winner so £5 at one-fifth of the odds (based on PD's analysis)
22/5= 4.4
4.4 x 5 =£ 22. Plus stake back = £27

*the other one won, different bookies
Last edited by AleisterCrowley on April 10th, 2021, 10:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

PinkDalek
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Re: The Grand National

#403314

Postby PinkDalek » April 10th, 2021, 10:29 pm

£5 E/W is £10 bet - £5 for the win & £5 for a place but, anyway, the 22/1er didn’t win!

Calc. for that one here viewtopic.php?p=403284#p403284 as you seem to have missed it.

Mike4
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Re: The Grand National

#403317

Postby Mike4 » April 10th, 2021, 10:37 pm

PinkDalek wrote:£5 E/W is £10 bet - £5 for the win & £5 for a place but, anyway, the 22/1er didn’t win!

Calc. for that one here viewtopic.php?p=403284#p403284 as you seem to have missed it.


Lol apologies, I didn't notice AC had backed the wrong horse!

PinkDalek
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Re: The Grand National

#403322

Postby PinkDalek » April 10th, 2021, 10:55 pm

Mike4 wrote:Lol apologies, I didn't notice AC had backed the wrong horse!


He also backed the winner (with another bookie).

Mind you others would, perhaps, have gone for a double or whatever it is called (would have needed to have been with the same bookie I would imagine).

No doubt he’s saving the winnings for the next TLF Social.

AleisterCrowley
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Re: The Grand National

#403328

Postby AleisterCrowley » April 10th, 2021, 11:18 pm

£83 profit
Should just about cover four pints and a G&T at The Clachan :(

AleisterCrowley
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Re: The Grand National

#403330

Postby AleisterCrowley » April 10th, 2021, 11:53 pm

Mike4 wrote:
PinkDalek wrote:£5 E/W is £10 bet - £5 for the win & £5 for a place but, anyway, the 22/1er didn’t win!

Calc. for that one here viewtopic.php?p=403284#p403284 as you seem to have missed it.


Lol apologies, I didn't notice AC had backed the wrong horse!


Well, £27 from a £10 bet... I'm happy to carry on being wrong ;)

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Re: The Grand National

#403334

Postby Mike4 » April 11th, 2021, 1:05 am

AleisterCrowley wrote:£83 profit
Should just about cover four pints and a G&T at The Clachan :(


Lol, I bought three pints of beer and a large Merlot in the Dundas Arms in Kintbury last summer, £28!

On quibbling the cost it turned out their till had "accidentally" added 10% optional gratuity as bill was over £20 which means till assumes this must be food. Feckin cheek of it! I bet that works dozens of times every night.....

AleisterCrowley
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Re: The Grand National

#403337

Postby AleisterCrowley » April 11th, 2021, 1:27 am

Mike4 wrote:
AleisterCrowley wrote:£83 profit
Should just about cover four pints and a G&T at The Clachan :(


Lol, I bought three pints of beer and a large Merlot in the Dundas Arms in Kintbury last summer, £28!

On quibbling the cost it turned out their till had "accidentally" added 10% optional gratuity as bill was over £20 which means till assumes this must be food. Feckin cheek of it! I bet that works dozens of times every night.....


Ah ..rail timetables ..Newbury, Kintbury, Hungerford and Bedwyn..

Even minus the gratuity that's still pretty steep. I'm still annoyed because it looks like a pub back home extracted £x from me for a round twice via contactless. I'm pretty sure (but not certain) that I only bought one round in the place - but having investigated it's more or less impossible to get a full timestamped breakdown (2107 and 2214 would be believable, 2107 and 2109.. I would smell a rat)
Looking forward to going back to 'real cash' in pubs, where the accounting is real time...

dealtn
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Re: The Grand National

#403357

Postby dealtn » April 11th, 2021, 10:01 am

PinkDalek wrote:
Mind you others would, perhaps, have gone for a double or whatever it is called (would have needed to have been with the same bookie I would imagine).


A double is 2 winners in different races.

A forecast is first and second in same race.

A winner and seventh, doesn't exist as a bet, unless a bookie decides to run a novelty bet such as "both placed".

PinkDalek
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Re: The Grand National

#403366

Postby PinkDalek » April 11th, 2021, 10:49 am

dealtn wrote:A winner and seventh, doesn't exist as a bet, unless a bookie decides to run a novelty bet such as "both placed".


Aha, thanks!

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Re: The Grand National

#403368

Postby tjh290633 » April 11th, 2021, 10:56 am

I wonder if some enterprising channel will put on National Velvet? It's a long time since I saw that the first time round, when Liz Taylor was an unknown starlet.

TJH

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Re: The Grand National

#403382

Postby bungeejumper » April 11th, 2021, 11:27 am

Mike4 wrote:Lol, I bought three pints of beer and a large Merlot in the Dundas Arms in Kintbury last summer, £28!

Ah yes, one of our local gastro pubs hit on a whizzo scheme for improving its turnover. When you asked the barman for a glass of sauvignon you got the fancy one at £12 a glass, not the house version. They didn't stay in business for very long. :|

WRT AC's query about the exact timing of contactless payments, wouldn't your bank statement have that? (You might have to click on the transactions, though.)

BJ


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