The Lemon Fool

Is there anything that can prevent a whitewash in this series bar the weather?
Adelaide provided the conditions for England's seamers yet they still lost by 120.

Our bowlers will pose little threat on the dry fast wickets they'll face from now on. Australia's pace attack have England's batsman under their collective thumb and their spinner turns it.

It's 5-0 AFAICS.

LTB

Leothebear wrote:Is there anything that can prevent a whitewash in this series bar the weather?
Adelaide provided the conditions for England's seamers yet they still lost by 120.

Our bowlers will pose little threat on the dry fast wickets they'll face from now on. Australia's pace attack have England's batsman under their collective thumb and their spinner turns it.

It's 5-0 AFAICS.

LTB

Unbelievable that having won the toss, Root put the Aussies into bat. Then Smith nearly handed it back to us by not enforcing the follow on. Both schoolboy errors.

Agree probably 5-0

John

Already predicted.

viewtopic.php?p=84458#p84458

moorfield wrote:Australia 5 - England 0

I think we can safely presume (95% etc) that Perth will be a loss. You have to go back to 1986 for the alst time England didn;t win there, and 1978 for England's only ever win there. In 13 Ashes tests held there, England have won that one, drawn three and lost nine - the last seven in a row.

If that last seven England losses the closest results were loss by 7 wickets, or 150 runs. History is stacked against them.

So its pretty much looking like a dead rubber by the time they get to the MCG on Boxing day. The openers are weak as a partnership, and Cook is looking past his prime now. The upper middle order is inexperienced on the whole and has struggled to cement places for some years now. There is a lack of pace in the attack and a genuine spinner.

England does have international class players in Root, Bairstow, Ali (with the bat) and Anderson and Broad. And Stokes who isn't on tour and appears out of form in his NZ efforts recently. The writing is on the wall - Cook, Anderson and Broad won't see another down under Ashes I doubt.

didds

The whitewash is officially on hold......

........at least until the first session tomorrow morning.

The whitewash is officially on hold......

.......at least until the first session tomorrow morning.

I think we all feel that way.

England 360 all out before lunch?

The concern is that an attack of Anderson, Broad, Woakes, Overton (and Ali) would just be too pedestrian on the Perth track, and Enhlands proposed 360 could be faced down with 560 by the Aussies.

Here's fingers crossed

didds

Aus are 410-4 as I write. What we feared would happen is happening.

The Aussie quicks must be loving their rest and yet chomping at the bit. We can all see what'll happen when England bat again.

So for 360 read 400 and 560 read 660; the outcome was slightly worse than predicted.

I'm sure the Aussies will enjoy rubbing England's nose in it but that apart it's now a dead series. After such a comprehensive drubbing it's hard to England even trying. They know they're up against a far better team especially in Australian conditions.

Perhaps now it'll be remembered that when playing in Australia you must have pace. Anderson, bless him, a great bowler with swing and seam is innocuous out there on dry fast wickets, which make up the vast majority.

Leothebear wrote:
Perhaps now it'll be remembered that when playing in Australia you must have pace. Anderson, bless him, a great bowler with swing and seam is innocuous out there on dry fast wickets, which make up the vast majority.

The Duke ball is also an issue for Anderson. He has at least taken some wickets. Starc has taken more wickets than Broad, Ali, and Overton combined.

DM

Leothebear wrote:Perhaps now it'll be remembered that when playing in Australia you must have pace. Anderson, bless him, a great bowler with swing and seam is innocuous out there on dry fast wickets, which make up the vast majority.

Alomg with Broad, Woakes etc etc etc...

TMS asked Bayliss about going out to Aus with no out and out fast bowlers and as he replied (paraphrased) "If we haven;t got them, we can;t take them".

Genuine England quicks happen organically not through any attempted schooling or systems etc still. Its the way it is.

meanwhile Broad has a scuppered knee apparently, so maybe its best to not take him to NZ in the spring and lety somebody new take up the reins. I can also see a point of not taking Cook to NZ - he seems to be on the wain so england may as well throw somebody else into the mix. Yes England have struggled top replace Strauss still, and that would be a 2nd spot to replace but it is going to happen sooner or later. maybe England just have to bite the bullet and accept they will be weak for a few years until somebody comes through as replacements for the older guard who surely will not see another Ashes tour down under, and maybe not even the next home ashes series.

didds

Snorvey wrote:The female commentator on BT sports is quite good..... But when an England player gets caught LBW and, after a brief moment, is given out by the umpire, she really shouldn't say

'Oooooh and the finger goes up!'

Still, it made my day.

I'm beginning to understand why you were sent to live in a remote part of Scotland!

Is no-one watching/listening?:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live: ... orts_extra

Before we accept the fact that Steve Smith is too good for our bowlers, perhaps the decision to play a not-match-fit Anderson should be reviewed.
I was very impressed with Jofra Archer. His extra pace and ability to vary it, may have just made the difference at Edgbaston.

Leothebear wrote:Before we accept the fact that Steve Smith is too good for our bowlers, perhaps the decision to play a not-match-fit Anderson should be reviewed.
I was very impressed with Jofra Archer. His extra pace and ability to vary it, may have just made the difference at Edgbaston.

In fairness to our bowlers, Steve Smith is too good for everyones bowlers. Quite extraordinary really.

And yes, Andersons selection is under the microscope.

selecting anderson (fitness) and moheen ( confidence) was barmy .

we have curran and leach and rashid , and no doubt others .

The thread title refers to the previous Ashes contest in Australia but judging by the mauling England are getting at Edgbaston, it might be equally apt for this series.

England don't have anyone anywhere near Smith in his present form. Lyon looks better than any spinner we can lay our hands on. Their pace and seam attack is at least as good as England's. On this showing they are simply the better side.

England with a complete bowling attack may well perform better but it's hard to see how they'll succeed against the Aussies, whose confidence must now be sky high.

Leo

England on track for a 3-2 series win

drop denly and moeen.

anderson is a non starter nwow.

play curran and archer and leach/rashid .

Leothebear wrote:The thread title refers to the previous Ashes contest in Australia but judging by the mauling England are getting at Edgbaston, it might be equally apt for this series. ...

Yes, I was in optimistic mode when I recommenced your thread, hoping that 5-0 might be in the offing this time around.

That was at about 5:30pm on day one. I didn't mention the score at the time, deliberately, but I'm guessing Australia were 9 down, with only the 10th wicket partnership left!

I still recall watching every ball of the Snow and Higgs 10th wicket partnership, putting on (looks it up) 128 in 1966. This Test's 162 for the last two wickets was on a par with that effort. Albeit number 10 and 11 didn't bat together.

At least it all showed how exciting 5 day Test cricket can be.

I hope to be at Lord's. Foolish Social anyone?