Fast laptop required

[hiriskpaul]

My daughter would like a high performance laptop. It must be capable of running intensive calculations for long periods, sometimes hours at a time or overnight. So not something where thermal throttling will kick in after a few minutes. The programs she runs are memory intensive as well, so at least 16GB of RAM, preferably 32GB or potentially even more. It must also be reasonably portable, ideally no more than 2.5 kg. High storage capacity not a priority compared with speed, so 256GB SSD would be fine.

I have had a quick look around and was wondering whether so-called gaming laptops might be suitable? She does not need fast graphics though, so does not really want to pay for fancy graphics cards, but would like a decent IPS screen.

Budget is £1500. Depending on the supplier, she may be able to get an educational discount of 10% or so.

[Breelander]

My daughter would like a high performance laptop. It must be capable of running intensive calculations for long periods, sometimes hours at a time or overnight. ... I have had a quick look around and was wondering whether so-called gaming laptops might be suitable?

I would look a business machines rather than gaming. Anything described as an Ultrabook should be suitable.

I bough a used Dell Lattitude E7270 (i7, 16GB, 256GB SSD) that would fit you requirements, that often gets left running intensive video processing overnight. The equivalent current model is within your budget. But Ultrabook is a specification, not a brand name. Any brand of Ultrabook should meet your requirements.

Ultrabook is an Intel specification and trademark[1] for a line of high-end subnotebook computers featuring reduced bulk without compromising battery life.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultrabook

[Gaggsy]

I bought a desktop PC from Overclockers a few years ago. Highly configurable and a good service.
I see they do gaming laptops too. Might be worth contacting if you don't see exactly what you need. They seemed to have real people there.

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/gaming-l ... 500-pounds

[johnhemming]

My laptop is custom built by
https://www.utopiacomputers.co.uk/

To be really fast etc. It is more expensive because it is top of the range, but I am sure they can do other really fast machines.

[hiriskpaul]

I have just found out that the software my daughter is using does need a fast graphics processor as it uses the GPU to speed up the calculations. Nvidia 10 series upwards.

So I guess that does mean a gaming laptop. Thanks for the suggestions. Will take a look.

[UncleEbenezer]

Is this something like SETI or scientific programme, or perhaps a crypto challenge like ECDL?

Or something more dodgy like bitcoin mining, or even organised crime?

Yes, the problem description suggests that a gaming machine will have the most power. Though I wouldn't go for a laptop: with a laptop you're paying over the odds for classy screen, audio, etc, and for the penalties - both in extra cost and unmaintainability - of miniaturised components. A server-grade 'puter, designed to run tasks unsupervised, will give you what you want more robustly and without paying for expensive extras.

[AsleepInYorkshire]

My daughter would like a high performance laptop. It must be capable of running intensive calculations for long periods, sometimes hours at a time or overnight. So not something where thermal throttling will kick in after a few minutes. The programs she runs are memory intensive as well, so at least 16GB of RAM, preferably 32GB or potentially even more. It must also be reasonably portable, ideally no more than 2.5 kg. High storage capacity not a priority compared with speed, so 256GB SSD would be fine.

I have had a quick look around and was wondering whether so-called gaming laptops might be suitable? She does not need fast graphics though, so does not really want to pay for fancy graphics cards, but would like a decent IPS screen.

Budget is £1500. Depending on the supplier, she may be able to get an educational discount of 10% or so.

https://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/build-your-own-pc/

Not always the cheapest but allows you to specify where your money goes (noting you will need a lot of air cooling for the specification - I have a Dell G3 and the reason I mention this may be helpful - it's very fast - but it's very heavy. Obviously it's not really a laptop you want to drag around with you - but the price reflected this - and if your budget spills over this could help pare it back without losing the performance)

AiY

AiY

[Breelander]

...Though I wouldn't go for a laptop...

Try finding a desktop that meets the daughter's requirements

...reasonably portable, ideally no more than 2.5 kg.

[stewamax]

Though I wouldn't go for a laptop: with a laptop you're paying over the odds ...

True. For what your daughter wants, portability apart, you can can get tower machines with oodles of RAM, top-of-the-range Geforce graphics cards and decent cooling. See e.g. Yoyotech Warbird series and gaming machines and Chillblast's gaming range with Intel 18-core X-series processors. Depending on how the software she runs was written (especially whether a repetitive calculation can multi-thread), having 32GB or 64GB RAM, a top-of the-range video card and an umpteen-core processor can make a huge difference. And you wont' get these in a laptop for any sensible price (if at all).

[xeny]

I would look a business machines rather than gaming. Anything described as an Ultrabook should be suitable.

No - you'll run into thermal throttling issues with extended CPU intensive use in a thin chassis.

The first right answer for this problem is a gaming laptop - try and find something without too many LEDs.

The left field possibility to consider is a desktop and remote access to it - you'll get better cooling, which means better processing performance.

Here's overclockers list of RTX 2060 equipped laptops:

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/gaming-l ... a-rtx-2060 as a starting point.

[servodude]

I'll echo the suggestion that a gaming laptop makes sense, but they can be a bit bulky compared to other laptops.

I have a Gigabyte P35W for a similar use case (i7,16GB RAM, 256GB SSD +1TB HDD) that's about 3 years old and in daily use

Eventually I found it too bulky for being carried about and I keep it at home and drive it remotely. As while it's in your weight spec (at a tad over 2kg) it is physically large for a 15" device.

I'll also add that if you're doing stuff that needs a fast machine I think you'll exhaust a 256GB drive very quickly ( I've recently added another ~480GB SSD drive to it )

-sd

[Infrasonic]

A 'workstation' class laptop would fit the remit better on the performance front, but not on the weight and price front (unless you went the SH or refurbished route...).

[hiriskpaul]

Thanks for all the comments. My daughter is using Google's machine learning software, TensorFlow. She may well go on to use other ML software, but they are all similar in requirements, typically utilising NVIDIA GPUs for the matrix arithmetic.

She has a desktop at university and does not really want one at home as she has no obvious place to put one. She also travels around and wants the convenience of a laptop. Her existing laptop is on its last legs and does not cope at all well with TensorFlow.

I guess another option would be to get a smaller, lighter laptop and then remote desktop in to her desktop to run the intensive stuff.

[Infrasonic]

Something like a 2019 Dell XPS 15 with an i9 CPU and GTX **** GPU might do the job, but you'd have to really check how much RAM et al the software actually needs as getting a fully specced out XPS 15 is going to be over £2.5K even with discounts.
1080P screen rather than 4K, 16GB RAM rather than 32 (if workable) smaller M.2 NVMe SSD will all bring the price down.
Dell have an outlet store on their website where cancelled orders and refurbished returns (with warranties) go for quite a decent discount to RRP.

[Urbandreamer]

Thanks for all the comments. My daughter is using Google's machine learning software, TensorFlow. She may well go on to use other ML software, but they are all similar in requirements, typically utilising NVIDIA GPUs for the matrix arithmetic.

She has a desktop at university and does not really want one at home as she has no obvious place to put one. She also travels around and wants the convenience of a laptop. Her existing laptop is on its last legs and does not cope at all well with TensorFlow.

I guess another option would be to get a smaller, lighter laptop and then remote desktop in to her desktop to run the intensive stuff.

I would SERIOUSLY look into the remote desktop method. Providing that you/she has network access it really is the route to go.

Any laptop that can do the job will be seriously comprimised. For a moment just consider the power requirements of a NXIDIA RX570. It's 200 Watt's. You are talking risk of physical damage if you were to use a 200W laptop on your lap! The 2080 ti is nearer 300 Watt's.

However why limit yourself to one gpu? Well you sort of have to with a laptop, and a low power one at that.
If you relax the constraints so that the machine can't even be described as a desktop, then many people put together machines with up to 13 gpu's.

Normally that would be for bit coin mining. However the motherboards to build such a rig are cheap and can support a 7th generation i7.
Check out the HTC 110 BTC motherboard on ebay and Youtube for machine builds.
Such a machine could "live" in a garage or loft and be remote accessed. After all the gpu's are not being used to display much or anything are they?

Another cheap possibility would be an old Workstation with twin Xeon processors and a single gpu. Or a more modern threadripper solution. Again relying upon remote access.

Ps, I'm not into bitcoin mining and don't own any bitcoins. I should also say that my limited knowledge is indicating that the hardware should be chosen to match the software used. Some software makes extensive use of cpu threads while other software uses gpu's.

[Infrasonic]

If network access isn't an issue can the software not be hosted in a cloud environment, where multiple CPU/GPU's et al are pretty much par for the course?

Most education establishments have good links with the IT world, has this route been checked out?

[servodude]

I'll just add that the most compelling reason I have found to go down the remote access road is being able to move with my laptop without interrupting a running job
- less useful having a mega-portable machine if you have to find a power point and sit with it in one spot for an hour or more

-sd

[hiriskpaul]

Having read more about machine learning and the likely direction of my daughter's work, I think it highly likely she will eventually need access to hardware with multiple GPUs, in the cloud, or in her university department or computer centre. She may not realise this yet as she has only just got started. A small, cheap laptop seems the way to go to me (with remote access to something more powerful). My daughter has a £1500 grant from the Welcome Trust which she was intending to use to buy a laptop. I need to ask her how flexible this money is, ie could she buy a desktop and a laptop, or spend some money this year, more in a couple of year's time.

Apart from all the reservations raised over heat and power requirements, my daughter does not have a good track record when it comes to looking after computers. It would be fairly devastating if she wrecked a £1500 laptop!

Thanks for all the help. I need to discuss all this with my daughter.

[ReformedCharacter]

My hardware knowledge is out of date, so I'd be grateful if someone could explain how high quality graphics is delivered from a remote location to a local machine. I've only ever used VNC et al. and I don't think it can do that

RC

[hiriskpaul]

My hardware knowledge is out of date, so I'd be grateful if someone could explain how high quality graphics is delivered from a remote location to a local machine. I've only ever used VNC et al. and I don't think it can do that

RC

High quality graphics are not delivered and not even used. It just so happens that GPUs are excellent at particular types of arithmetic and this aspect can be exploited in certain applications. It looks machine learning is one such application and by the sound of it bitcoin mining is another.

From what I have gleaned so far, my daughter configures an ML run using a Python script and then kicks it off from the command line (although a Python IDE might be involved, it is not essential). So no graphics are needed at all. By the sound of it, she does not even need a remote desktop, as this ML stuff is cross platform. I suspect a remote SSH connection to a Unix/Linux command line is all that is really needed.