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Light Bulbs

Does what it says on the tin
Dod101
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Light Bulbs

#190190

Postby Dod101 » December 31st, 2018, 10:23 am

This is not strictly DIY or Building but.......

Remember in the old days when if you needed to buy a new lighting bulb you went to the retailer and asked for a 40, 60 or a 100 watt bulb?Irrespective of the manufacturer they were pretty much the same. Highly inefficient I know and needed to be replaced regularly but at least you knew what you were buying.

Nowadays, I have mostly replaced these old bulbs. The new more efficient ones do not in my experience last the 10 years or however many hours they claim and I need to buy a replacement from time to time. Even in the unlikely event that I have found one that I like (amount of light emitted, what colour of light emitted and so on) I can seldom simply buy an exact replacement and so go through the same frustration each time of trying to find one that suits. I am writing here mostly of table lamps. I think I have the solution to downlighters, set in the ceiling. I use mains LEDs and have a note of the ones I like and seem to be able to replace these if I need to.

Am I missing something?

Dod

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190198

Postby Itsallaguess » December 31st, 2018, 11:27 am

Dod101 wrote:
Am I missing something?


It's all about the lumens now Dod, which measures light output rather than energy-usage, but there's standard conversion-charts that can help with this type of thing -

Image

Some more information here, from the above website -

https://www.thelightbulb.co.uk/resources/lumens_watts/

Note also that there's different types of light-output too, in terms of the light-spectrum. Warm-white is usually used to replace what we'd normally have used the old 100W bulbs for, but there's also Cool-white that look good in kitchens and bathrooms, so be aware of that too...

Some info here on the cool-white / warm-white difference - https://www.lights2you.com.au/blog/warm ... d-lighting

As an aside, when I replaced all my 100W bulbs at home, I used these 9W LED ones from Screwfix, which come in a really good-value 5-pack for just £9 currently -

https://www.screwfix.com/p/lap-bc-gls-l ... pack/5894t

They're available in both warm-white (linked above), cool-white, and also in both the bayonet-cap and screw-in variety.

Highly recommended for both light output, longevity, and value....

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190205

Postby Dod101 » December 31st, 2018, 11:35 am

Many thanks IAAG aka Itsallaguess. Clearly I was missing something. I am very grateful for the info and will follow It up.

Dod

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190211

Postby jackdaww » December 31st, 2018, 12:03 pm

approaching 80 , i decided to replace my outside light bulb , which has been up there a long time.

climbing the ladder on xmas day ( possibly for the last time) -- which will fail first , the bulb or me ?

replaced with a 1500 lumen led - brilliant .

the old bulb -- which still works - is a 100w tungsten clearly marked WOOLWORTHS - who were extinguished around 10 years ago.

will keep you posted -- TLF willing .

:D

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190212

Postby jfgw » December 31st, 2018, 12:18 pm

Dod101 wrote:Remember in the old days when if you needed to buy a new lighting bulb you went to the retailer and asked for a 40, 60 or a 100 watt bulb?Irrespective of the manufacturer they were pretty much the same. Highly inefficient I know and needed to be replaced regularly but at least you knew what you were buying.

...

Am I missing something?

Dod

You may have needed an SBC (small bayonet) for a table lamp and, if you bought one of those red fireglow lamps for your electric fire, you may have found, when you got home, that it had three bayonet pins and wouldn't fit.

If you had a fluorescent light, you had to make sure you got the right fitting (pins or bayonet).

Until the foreign Edison screw stuff started coming over, I think that was pretty much all you needed for regular household lighting.

Oh, and some candles and matches for when there was a power cut. You could use the torch by the back door (the one you used if you needed the privi at night) to find the candles. Maybe keep your front bike light handy, and a spare "800" battery (Which was like two U2s side-by-side but slightly taller, and with a contact at the front for the bulb and a contact at the top for the screw-down "switch"). If you had any other torches with batteries in them, the batteries will have corroded so they would not work.

Julian F. G. W.

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190218

Postby Dod101 » December 31st, 2018, 12:42 pm

Dear Julian

I appreciate it is New Year's Eve (assuming you are a Sassenach) so I accept your advice in the spirit in which I assume it was proffered but although I may be old, I am not that old!

I find that every time I go to buy a bulb replacement, 'they no longer make that one, try this' is the usual advice from my ever helpful local general store. We still have one which stocks just about all hardware you could ever need, but modern light bulbs seem to be as much a mystery to them as to me.

Dod

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190222

Postby bungeejumper » December 31st, 2018, 12:56 pm

We have getting on for 100 bulbs at Bungee Towers. (Sheesh.) Although, to be fair, thirty-odd of those are in multi-bulb candelabra thingies which are rarely used, so the tungstens are still in place. Changing the other 70 to LEDs (and just a few fluorescent bulbs) has not been a cost-free experience - but, at one tenth of the power consumption, they fill my soul with glowy warmth every time I turn them on. ;)

Indoors, the LEDs have been superb and we've never had one fail. I still prefer the fluorescents for outdoor lighting, though, because the light quality is gentler - but we've found that they either last ten weeks or ten years. The really big con was the halogen quartz bulbs, which were hardly any cheaper to run than tungstens but which didn't like our shaky rural electricity supply at all - very few of them lasted more than six months.

The only downside we find to LEDs is that they're a bit lacking in magic and atmosphere. A big Up to LED Hut, whose stuff has been very good. I had often wondered about the vulnerability of bulbs ordered off the internet, but we've never had any broken in transit yet.

BJ

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190230

Postby Dod101 » December 31st, 2018, 1:31 pm

I have well over 100 individual bulbs and I do not think that that is particularly unusual. If I added in the individual bulbs in candelabra the count would be even more. The majority are not used very much but it is reading lamps and general lighting in the couple of rooms that I use most where my problem lies. I have sorted the kitchen lighting (using LED Hut's products) and also the bathrooms.

Anyway, IAAG's diagram seems to be my guide to use.

Dod

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190265

Postby PrincessB » December 31st, 2018, 4:55 pm

The only downside we find to LEDs is that they're a bit lacking in magic and atmosphere.


I'm using a combination of old tech and new.

The TV room and master bedroom have wall mounted incandescents with dimmer switches and can be dialed down to a red hued glow which is great for atmosphere. I've also found that as the dimmer switches have a soft start (bringing the bulbs up to full brightness over a second or so) we've not blown a bulb since installation a few years ago.

Kitchen has four industrial style pendant lamps fitted with 1850 lumen LEDS. That turned out to be the expensive bit.The first set were from Ikea and not bright enough, the replacements by Philips were a bit better but not quite there. The current set are adequate but not operating theatre bright which should be the norm in a kitchen.

I now prefer Edison screw bulbs over bayonet fittings, once you've screwed them in they do stay put. The problems start when realise there are two screw diameters and they don't do all of the bulbs for both fittings.

Worst bulbs are the halogen strips in the wall lights in the dining room - They don't yet do LED units with sufficient lumens to replace the existing power hungry bulbs and I'm not prepared to change the wall light fittings so I end up changing them on a very regular basis.

On the plus side, when they do blow, I can just chuck them in the bin and don't have to drive to the dump.

Happy new year to all,

B.

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190274

Postby sg31 » December 31st, 2018, 5:26 pm

PrincessB wrote:
The only downside we find to LEDs is that they're a bit lacking in magic and atmosphere.


I'm using a combination of old tech and new.

The TV room and master bedroom have wall mounted incandescents with dimmer switches and can be dialed down to a red hued glow which is great for atmosphere. I've also found that as the dimmer switches have a soft start (bringing the bulbs up to full brightness over a second or so) we've not blown a bulb since installation a few years ago.

Kitchen has four industrial style pendant lamps fitted with 1850 lumen LEDS. That turned out to be the expensive bit.The first set were from Ikea and not bright enough, the replacements by Philips were a bit better but not quite there. The current set are adequate but not operating theatre bright which should be the norm in a kitchen.

I now prefer Edison screw bulbs over bayonet fittings, once you've screwed them in they do stay put. The problems start when realise there are two screw diameters and they don't do all of the bulbs for both fittings.

Worst bulbs are the halogen strips in the wall lights in the dining room - They don't yet do LED units with sufficient lumens to replace the existing power hungry bulbs and I'm not prepared to change the wall light fittings so I end up changing them on a very regular basis.

On the plus side, when they do blow, I can just chuck them in the bin and don't have to drive to the dump.

Happy new year to all,

B.


Atmosphere in the main bedroom? I wish. :D :oops:

We have just completed a big extension and renovation of the upstairs area, well it's almost completed. I've fitted some of these in every room

https://www.ledkia.com/uk/48-buy-recess ... ing-lights

Good quality, seriously cheap and they fit within the depth of the plasterboard so it doesn't matter if there's a joist in the way. They give a much wider angle of light beam than traditional down lighters. Basically they flood the whole room with light. In bedrooms 3m x 4m, 2 x24W is more than enough to provide strong light. If you change the transformer they are dimmable. We didn't bother, bedside lights will do when atmosphere is needed.

When they are off you don't notice them they don't hang down or attract attention. No more deciding which lights will fit the décor, these just provide light.

I can't sing their praises highly enough. They are just brilliant. So far everyone who's seen them has asked for the suppliers details because they want some themselves.

I have no connection with the company concerned.

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190500

Postby Mike4 » January 2nd, 2019, 9:04 am

Dod101 wrote:
I find that every time I go to buy a bulb replacement, 'they no longer make that one, try this' is the usual advice from my ever helpful local general store. We still have one which stocks just about all hardware you could ever need, but modern light bulbs seem to be as much a mystery to them as to me.


A completely different and somewhat tongue-in-cheek solution to this problem is to revert to gas lighting.

Bags of personality and warmth. Endless fun lighting them. The illumination equivalent to heating your house with open grate coal fires. Simply wonderful!

https://www.lehmans.com/category/gas-lights

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190503

Postby jackdaww » January 2nd, 2019, 9:42 am

for table lamps etc , led 6W=40W=470lumens can be got at poundland - for £1.

for stronger lights 1500 lumens can be found at around £4 - eg morrisons, and £8 at wilko.

however LED HUT do not appear to offer these 1500 lumen led's.

:idea: :idea:

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190588

Postby PrincessB » January 2nd, 2019, 4:00 pm

for stronger lights 1500 lumens can be found at around £4 - eg morrisons, and £8 at wilko.


In error, I quoted 1850 lumens for the pendant lights in the kitchen, I found the box and they are actually offer the easy to remember 1921 lumens per bulb. Company is called Integral LED and they now sell a 2000 lumen bulb for those who like brightness.

A completely different and somewhat tongue-in-cheek solution to this problem is to revert to gas lighting.

Bags of personality and warmth. Endless fun lighting them. The illumination equivalent to heating your house with open grate coal fires. Simply wonderful!


I will get to a point along the way, please read on.

I've been watching a lot of property renovation shows on TV recently. The UK stuff is mainly terrible as it tries to create drama by highlighting the problems people are going to face - Usually; Wanting to be in by Christmas, running out of money, project stalling as they cannot increase the mortgage, someone getting pregnant, rain, late deliveries etc etc.

These poor skint, wet pregnant folk then have to do a load of the work themselves while battling the bank and eventually turn it around and end up with a double higt hall with expensive hanging lighting cluster along with a massive range cooker in the kitchen and a blind eye turned on the fact that the rest of the house is still a building site after three years of stress.

The one that I've found good fun is 'Living Big in a Tiny House' While the Tiny Houses get a bit samey when you've got that little space, the mindset of the builders is about getting the work done and it's refreshing. It's a Youtube channel and easy to search for. Mainly American and Australian builds from the ones I've seen.

The difference that has really struck me is the attention to detail in trying to seal the house against air leaks. They put all sorts of tapes and membranes into even the smallest builds and then control the internal environment with a heat recovery and ventilation system. They pay special attention to doors and windows in way I don't think the average UK window fitter would understand, or at least the ones I've met wouldn't, and they are supposedly the better ones.

I've done enough work on my house to drift towards Passivhaus Standards without doing anything complex, I'm a bit niggled as a few extra quid on window tape or membranes or a tad better insulation might have tipped the house into (admittedly) the lowest tier of Passivahus. I doubt that sealing everything up and installing a HRAV would help as I'm pretty sure the house leaks air like a sieve by their standards.

As for gas mantles in an airtight structure - I shudder, but I'm pretty sure they would work rather well in a UK built conservatory as you'd never suffer from the emissions as they would be straight out through the gaps in the UPVC.

B.

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190607

Postby Dod101 » January 2nd, 2019, 4:43 pm

Not sure that PrincessB has given me much illumination re my original query but I must say I am very chary of sealing my house. That would be as bad as living in an airliner with recirculated air. I like the old fashioned idea of fresh air circulating around, not necessarily through ill fitting windows, but with windows that open and stay open for most of the year. I open my sitting room windows even at this time of the year, during most mornings whilst I am doing other things.

Dod

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Re: Light Bulbs

#190617

Postby bungeejumper » January 2nd, 2019, 5:11 pm

PrincessB wrote:The difference that has really struck me is the attention to detail in trying to seal the house against air leaks. They put all sorts of tapes and membranes into even the smallest builds and then control the internal environment with a heat recovery and ventilation system. They pay special attention to doors and windows in way I don't think the average UK window fitter would understand, or at least the ones I've met wouldn't, and they are supposedly the better ones.

I've done enough work on my house to drift towards Passivhaus Standards without doing anything complex, I'm a bit niggled as a few extra quid on window tape or membranes or a tad better insulation might have tipped the house into (admittedly) the lowest tier of Passivahus. I doubt that sealing everything up and installing a HRAV would help as I'm pretty sure the house leaks air like a sieve by their standards.

Yeah, but. Make your house 100% airtight, and they'll find you dead in bed one day. Ideally, you'll have some advance warning because the "building sickness" (headaches, drowsiness, grumpiness, a burst of cold fresh energy whenever somebody opens the front door) will provide a timely reminder of how much we need to change the air in our rooms.

Three quarters of the glass panes at Bungee Towers are cemented directly into the stone window mullions, with no frames and with zero gap for air. The remainder, however, are air-leaky wooden frames, and none of them are double glazed. (The listed building people wouldn't like that even if we fitted them. :| ) Result: we have broadly the same heating bills as a fully-insulated modern house of comparable size. Funny, that.

Returning to Mike4's post, the mention of gas lighting brings back glorious memories of my student years when I lived on a houseboat. It still makes me laugh when they use the word 'orifice' to describe what you or I would probably call a gas jet. :lol:

BJ

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Re: Light Bulbs

#191763

Postby PrincessB » January 7th, 2019, 7:18 pm

but I must say I am very chary of sealing my house.


Yeah, but. Make your house 100% airtight, and they'll find you dead in bed one day.


Bear in mind that some of the TV shows we for builds in more extreme climates than the UK and the sealing of the house was to ensure the fresh air ventilation system worked properly without pumping cooled or heated air through cracks and seams.

As an overall observation, you're after complete control of the interior environment of the house regardless of what is going on outside and you're attempting to control the atmosphere inside while losing the least amount of energy.

Temperature, humidity, pollen or deadly spiders can be a bit more threatening for some. Over here, throwing the windows wide in winter means a bigger jumper and a chance to light the log burner.

To close, there are some useful systems which might be worth invesigating for problem rooms - Shower rooms or kitchens without external extraction might benefit from the more compact HRAV systems.

I found this on Amazon which might calarify on the use of the smaller devices for problem areas:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/KAIR-RECOVERY- ... B004VW3RGW

I don't have this product and have no affiliation to Amazon or the company so please treat link for information only.

B.

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Re: Light Bulbs

#191798

Postby dspp » January 7th, 2019, 8:57 pm

I'm fully with PB on this one. The UK myth of fresh air is just a wasteful draft.

Once you have properly sealed a house you can yourself choose how much fresh air to recirc air you want to live with, and the corresponding heating (or cooling) bills. Just simple careful bit-by-bit sealing and insulating my Victorian property (almost to passivhaus) has made me a slightly wealthier and much warmer person, and healthier for it.

We should examine our prejudices very carefully before recirculating them. There is a reason why the British have the worst housing stock in western Europe, and this is one of them.

regards, dspp

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Re: Light Bulbs

#196697

Postby JonE » January 26th, 2019, 3:43 pm

sg31 wrote:We have just completed a big extension and renovation of the upstairs area, well it's almost completed. I've fitted some of these in every room

https://www.ledkia.com/uk/48-buy-recess ... ing-lights

Good quality, seriously cheap and they fit within the depth of the plasterboard so it doesn't matter if there's a joist in the way. They give a much wider angle of light beam than traditional down lighters. Basically they flood the whole room with light. In bedrooms 3m x 4m, 2 x24W is more than enough to provide strong light. If you change the transformer they are dimmable. We didn't bother, bedside lights will do when atmosphere is needed.


Is it the case that their heat output is so low that having >270mm of insulation directly above them will not be a problem? I can see that bedroom lighting may not be in use for extended periods so it needn't be a concern but in a bungalow, for example, other rooms with extended periods of lighting demand could be involved and have no airspace above.

Perhaps the latter case is why they do surface-mounted versions - with what look like ventilation louvres in the casing. They seem less appealing visually though I guess fire-hats (or whatever they're called) could be used with recessed versions but that could make retro-fitting a tad tedious if needing to burrow into insulation.

Cheers!

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Re: Light Bulbs

#196706

Postby bungeejumper » January 26th, 2019, 4:07 pm

JonE wrote:Is it the case that their heat output is so low that having >270mm of insulation directly above them will not be a problem? I can see that bedroom lighting may not be in use for extended periods so it needn't be a concern but in a bungalow, for example, other rooms with extended periods of lighting demand could be involved and have no airspace above.

Heat output from modern LEDs is very low indeed. Just yesterday, I bought an LED reading lamp with a 9 watt array of LEDs, and the whole (flat) head is barely 1 centimetre thick. It's been on for the last 12 hours and it's barely blood-warm. Extraordinary. :)

BJ

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Re: Light Bulbs

#196819

Postby sg31 » January 27th, 2019, 11:16 am

JonE wrote:
Is it the case that their heat output is so low that having >270mm of insulation directly above them will not be a problem? I can see that bedroom lighting may not be in use for extended periods so it needn't be a concern but in a bungalow, for example, other rooms with extended periods of lighting demand could be involved and have no airspace above.

Perhaps the latter case is why they do surface-mounted versions - with what look like ventilation louvres in the casing. They seem less appealing visually though I guess fire-hats (or whatever they're called) could be used with recessed versions but that could make retro-fitting a tad tedious if needing to burrow into insulation.

Cheers!


They were fitted by a qualified electrician who was the one who introduced me to the type of fitting. He has been fitting them in commercial premises for a while and has fitted them in his own home.

They give off very little heat. I'm tempted to fit them in some downstairs rooms but will need to check the fire rating first.


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