Simple thermostat

[kiloran]

My mum has a basic electromechanical rotary thermostat to control her combi. It's less than ideal.... it's positioned halfway up the stairs and seems to have 2-3 degC of hysteresis (dead band), so is on for a long time when it heats up (by which time the temperature in the living room is too high), then it's off for a long time. Mum is 95 and has poor eyesight, and is the ultimate technophobe, so doesn't understand the purpose of a thermostat. If she is too cold, she turns the thermostat up near max, and if she is too cold, she turns it right down. Which means she has to struggle up the stairs to change the thermostat setting (she normally uses her stairlift to go up and down stairs, but can't use that to alter the thermostat because she can't reach it.)

It's got to the point where I need to move the thermostat to somewhere more convenient. I don't want to rewire it, so I need a wireless thermostat. This would either be in the hall, or probably in the living room where she is most of the day.

Most of the ones I've looked at are way too complicated. We could set on/off times but mum won't accept that. She wants to be in control. We used to set the timer on the boiler so that it was off from 10pm to 6am, but if mum gets up in the middle of the night to make a cup of tea, she wants to be able to put the heating on.

Any thoughts or recommendations? She's not keen on digital displays, but if we have to go that way it will have to be a big clear display. A rotary knob would probably be best for her. Or maybe 5-6 buttons we could preset... 1=off, 2=19degC, 3=21degC or whatever. A 1-hour boost button might be nice.

It's a Potterton Promax Combi if that makes any difference

--kiloran

[paulnumbers]

Surprisingly, being supposedly the most high tech, I think Nest might work well. It needs power, but connects wirelessly to a receiver at the boiler.

The control is very obvious, it’s suppose to learn from your schedule, turning on/off when you’re likely to want it on.

Does your mum have dementia or just old? I suspect if the former then she probably wouldn’t adjust to it.

[kiloran]

Surprisingly, being supposedly the most high tech, I think Nest might work well. It needs power, but connects wirelessly to a receiver at the boiler.

The control is very obvious, it’s suppose to learn from your schedule, turning on/off when you’re likely to want it on.

Does your mum have dementia or just old? I suspect if the former then she probably wouldn’t adjust to it.

A bold suggestion!
I'd automatically discounted fancy things like Nest, without knowing much about it. I've had a quick look and watched a few videos and I'm not convinced so far. Looks like a simple press puts it into setting mode..... there lies danger, mum would be very confused (as would I, trying to help her from 300 miles away!). And the poor thing would get very confused trying to learn from mum's schedule, she's totally random.
Mum doesn't have dementia, though she does get more confused these days, which might be early signs of dementia.

Thanks for the idea, I'll investigate it further.

--kiloran

[paulnumbers]

I’ve only ever used one in an airbnb and was blown away by the simplicity, but perhaps it’s not as obvious to a 95 year old with the unusual mechanism

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ETv1i1YA8-0

I suppose one advantage is that *you* can control it remotely, but I assume you probably wouldnt want to get that minutely involved, and i assume she does not have an internet connection which is a requirement

[Stompa]

I'm no expert on these things, but perhaps something like:

https://www.screwfix.com/p/honeywell-y6 ... stat/84067

Of course you'd then have the problem of what happens should the batteries fail, or the thermostat were to become 'unbound' from the receiver (I don't know if that can happen?).

[AJC5001]

Any thoughts or recommendations? She's not keen on digital displays, but if we have to go that way it will have to be a big clear display. A rotary knob would probably be best for her. Or maybe 5-6 buttons we could preset... 1=off, 2=19degC, 3=21degC or whatever. A 1-hour boost button might be nice.

--kiloran

From https://www.hivehome.com/connects-with/alexa
Hive Active Heating
Set the temperature of your heating (We currently only support whole number degree requests)
Alexa, tell Hive to turn the heating on
Alexa, tell Hive to turn the heating on to 20 degrees
Alexa, tell Hive to turn the heating off
Alexa, tell Hive to boost my heating (Currently boosts to a default 22 degrees for 1 hour)

Adrian

[jfgw]

Without being told otherwise, I would place the probability of her having any form of internet connection to be close to zero.

I'm no expert on these things, but perhaps something like:

https://www.screwfix.com/p/honeywell-y6 ... stat/84067

Of course you'd then have the problem of what happens should the batteries fail, or the thermostat were to become 'unbound' from the receiver (I don't know if that can happen?).

These, in my experience, work well. The receiver needs a mains connection which may or may not be present at the existing thermostat. Even if it is present, you may find that the earth wire in the cable feeding it is used as one of the live (line or neutral) conductors so should not be used as is. You may find it easiest to fit the receiver close to the boiler. Remove the old thermostat to avoid confusion.

Fitting new batteries every couple of years should prevent unexpected failure.

Julian F. G. W.

[kiloran]

From https://www.hivehome.com/connects-with/alexa
Hive Active Heating
Set the temperature of your heating (We currently only support whole number degree requests)
Alexa, tell Hive to turn the heating on
Alexa, tell Hive to turn the heating on to 20 degrees
Alexa, tell Hive to turn the heating off
Alexa, tell Hive to boost my heating (Currently boosts to a default 22 degrees for 1 hour)

Adrian

Are you mad
Getting my mum to shout at Alexa and understand any response (with her two hearing aids) would either send her to an early(?) grave, or me! She always has trouble phoning companies with an automated switchboard (press 1 for this, press two for that....)

Good idea in theory, but it gives me the shudders!

--kiloran

[kiloran]

Without being told otherwise, I would place the probability of her having any form of internet connection to be close to zero.

I'm no expert on these things, but perhaps something like:

https://www.screwfix.com/p/honeywell-y6 ... stat/84067

Of course you'd then have the problem of what happens should the batteries fail, or the thermostat were to become 'unbound' from the receiver (I don't know if that can happen?).

These, in my experience, work well. The receiver needs a mains connection which may or may not be present at the existing thermostat. Even if it is present, you may find that the earth wire in the cable feeding it is used as one of the live (line or neutral) conductors so should not be used as is. You may find it easiest to fit the receiver close to the boiler. Remove the old thermostat to avoid confusion.

Fitting new batteries every couple of years should prevent unexpected failure.

Julian F. G. W.

Correct.... no internet

Stompa's suggestion looks like it is heading in the right direction. I'll investigate further. Mains power should not be a big issue since we already have power for the boiler and I could tap into that. Batteries are no problem.... I already have Google Calendar set up to give me reminders to change all her batteries at frequent intervals... TV remote, alarm clock, doorbell, etc

--kiloran

[AF62]

Any thoughts or recommendations? She's not keen on digital displays, but if we have to go that way it will have to be a big clear display. A rotary knob would probably be best for her. Or maybe 5-6 buttons we could preset... 1=off, 2=19degC, 3=21degC or whatever. A 1-hour boost button might be nice.

I would look at something like a Honeywell 927 if you want a wireless thermostat (I had a previous model for a number of years).
https://heatingcontrols.honeywellhome.c ... tal/CM927/

It is a programmable thermostat so you set what temperature you want the house to be at certain times of the day.

It has a couple of buttons on the front - temperature up or down - so simple to use. And what is good is that when it reaches the next programme time it goes back to that programmed temperature, so if someone forgets to turn it down or up, it doesn't matter.

It does lots of other clever stuff, but that is all hidden away with a cover so can be ignored.

Another good feature which might be important and is in the installer's menu, is you can set both a maximum temperature and a minimum temperature. Those are normally set at 35c and 5c respectively, but if you wanted you could set the maximum at (say) 25c and the minimum at (say) 16c so your mother could never overheat or get too cold.

You mentioned the difference between on and off, this can be adjusted in the CM927 but I found the 1.5c difference to be fine and I never found my house get too hot or cold.

Lastly, again in the installer's menu you can set it to fail 'on' (relay 20% on 80% off) if it loses connection, rather than fail 'off' - which my Hive does and is annoying for me when I come home to a cold house, but could be rather more serious for your mother.

[jfgw]

Another good feature which might be important and is in the installer's menu, is you can set both a maximum temperature and a minimum temperature. Those are normally set at 35c and 5c respectively, but if you wanted you could set the maximum at (say) 25c and the minimum at (say) 16c so your mother could never overheat or get too cold.

This feature is available in the thermostat suggested by Stompa. It involves fitting two pins to physically limit the movement of the wheel.

Julian F. G. W.

[bionichamster]

Sounds like she needs something simple and similar to her existing device.

Have a look at this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Salus-ERT20RF-Electronic-Thermostat-RF/dp/B00N5MIQI8

Salus ERT20RF Electronic Thermostat with RF

It's a simple Dial that can be mounted anywhere and a receiver box that replaces the original wall mounted thermostat.

I have a Salus wireless programmer with digital read out that uses a superficially identical receiver, it was relatively straightforward to replace the previous wall mounted device with the receiver mounted over the same back box, have had it several years and it's never lost signal, batteries last about a year and a half, probably more for this device I suspect


BH

[jfgw]

Have a look at this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Salus-ERT20RF-Electronic-Thermostat-RF/dp/B00N5MIQI8

Salus ERT20RF Electronic Thermostat with RF

It's a simple Dial that can be mounted anywhere and a receiver box that replaces the original wall mounted thermostat.

Another good suggestion that would probably work and look more like the one she has now. Note that this also needs a line and neutral.

It has just a single throw switch with a normally open contact that closes when it calls for heat. This suits almost all heating systems. If the system is very old, you may need a thermostat with changeover contacts. These old systems used momo valves (motor open - motor close) rather than the spring-return motorised valves that have been used for the last few decades.

Julian F. G. W.

[DrFfybes]

Radical but different solution - a TRV in the lounge?

Assuming she doesn't try and bend down and fiddle with it..

Paul

[BobbyD]

From https://www.hivehome.com/connects-with/alexa
Hive Active Heating
Set the temperature of your heating (We currently only support whole number degree requests)
Alexa, tell Hive to turn the heating on
Alexa, tell Hive to turn the heating on to 20 degrees
Alexa, tell Hive to turn the heating off
Alexa, tell Hive to boost my heating (Currently boosts to a default 22 degrees for 1 hour)

Adrian

Are you mad
Getting my mum to shout at Alexa and understand any response (with her two hearing aids) would either send her to an early(?) grave, or me! She always has trouble phoning companies with an automated switchboard (press 1 for this, press two for that....)

Good idea in theory, but it gives me the shudders!

--kiloran

Possibly the right tool, wrong application... You can set up a basic programme for your day to day with hive and supplement it with shorter boosts if say you get up in the middle of the night and want the heat on for an hour. Possibly the biggest bonus though is that you can carry the thermostat around with you, so keep it within reach of her chair and your mum will never have to get out of her chair to turn up the heat again, and of course the temperature your thermostat is working to is that of the room you are in, not the temperature at the top of the stairs so there's less disconnect between the reading on the thermostat and the temperature of the room which might limit the extreme dial turning a bit... You can get a decent deal including fitting by British Gas if you keep an eye out as well.