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Choice of Global Growth IT

Closed-end funds and OEICs
richfool
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Choice of Global Growth IT

#142576

Postby richfool » May 31st, 2018, 4:02 pm

I am considering increasing my exposure to global growth and (in particular) technology, but still maintaining as broad a spread as possible in terms of sectors and geographically. Thus I don't want to invest in Scottish Mortgage or trusts like Polar Technology, as they are too focussed on technology.

(So) I am thinking of either adding to my holding of Witan, or to add Foreign & Colonial (FRCL) as a new holding, to my existing portfolio. Witan and FRCL would give me a modest dividend and embrace other sectors (as opposed to a trust solely targetting technology). I am aware I already have some exposure to technology through other existing holdings like JAI and JPGI. (JP Morgan Asian Inc and JP Morgan Global Growth & Income).

I would welcome any suggestions on a suitable IT, or indeed on FRCL as an alternative to Witan?

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142586

Postby Dod101 » May 31st, 2018, 4:30 pm

you want to increase your exposure.....(in particular) to technology and yet you do not want Scottish Mortgage or trusts like Polar Technology as they are too focussed on technology.......Pardon? SMT does not solely embrace technology as I am sure you know.

As we do not know what percentage of a trust's assets constitute your requirement that is a hard one. In any case technology covers a very wide field.

Dod

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142597

Postby richfool » May 31st, 2018, 4:58 pm

Dod, to be clear, what I said was: "increasing my exposure to global growth and (in particular) technology," and: "but still maintaining as broad a spread as possible in terms of sectors and geographically".

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142602

Postby FredBloggs » May 31st, 2018, 5:08 pm

richfool wrote:Dod, to be clear, what I said was: "increasing my exposure to global growth and (in particular) technology," and: "but still maintaining as broad a spread as possible in terms of sectors and geographically".

Sounds like a whole of market, worldwide tracker fund of some description to me. That will have a market weight n technology stock.

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142603

Postby OLTB » May 31st, 2018, 5:09 pm

Hi richfool - I have a couple of ITs that are focussed in the tech'ish' world (ATT/HRI/IBT) as that's (probably) a decent future growth area and it may be that you can't have both a global IT with only a little tech exposure. You may have to opt for two ITs - one for global growth only and the other specialising in tech (with the percentage allocation down to your preference).

Cheers, OLTB.

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142608

Postby StOmer » May 31st, 2018, 5:22 pm

Perhaps Edinburgh Worldwide (EWI) may fit the bill. A stablemate of SMT so that may rule it out for you but I hold SMT & EWI alongside some other core (less techy) IT's. (Brunner, F&C IT, F&C Smaller Co's, Scottish, Caledonia and Witan)

WTAN has been a bit of a plodder whilst FRCL is benefitting from its centenary year and all that goes with that, eg. discount narrowed, lots of publicity and a name change :-)

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142617

Postby Longtermyieldman » May 31st, 2018, 6:07 pm

Scottish Mortgage is a global growth trust with a bias toward tech, but plenty of non-tech holdings. Fits the brief.

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142721

Postby richfool » June 1st, 2018, 9:40 am

Thanks for the suggestions everyone..

As said, I really wanted to avoid Scottish Mortgage, or ATT & HRI as I see them too exposed to technology. Upon a rough count of SMT's top 20 holdings I made it at least 40% exposed to technology stocks (plus being at a premium of 2.8% and minimal yield of 0.60%). I am trying to avoid picking something that will fall dramatically if technology has a setback. Thus I had the same thoughts about the technology trusts ATT & HRI.

Thanks LTYM, I did look at EWI, but noting it focusses on immature entrepreneurial stocks, had no dividend and was at a premium of 2.4% I decided against it.

I do take the point that perhaps a small holding in SMT and a separate holding in a general global growth trust could well be the answer, however I am trying to limit, (if not reduce!) the already significant number of IT's I hold, and am really looking to pick something that has a broad enough spread & mandate that it will provide better protection in the event of market falls. For example, where the manager has scope to switch sectors if he feels it justified and not be predominantly confined to a more limited brief or sector. So far all my research seems to come back to FRCL. FRCL is at a modest discount, provides a modest yield and is broadly based whilst still giving some exposure to technology stocks.

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142725

Postby Dod101 » June 1st, 2018, 10:05 am

Alliance Trust is never mentioned on these Boards. Despite its troubles from governance issues, it does not have a bad record although that is irrelevant now as it has totally changed the way its investment management works. I held it for many years and sold in the midst of its problems with Elliot, but bought in again last year and it is doing fine. It is emulating the style of Lee Freeman-Shor, as the best of the best. OTOH in total it has a very diversified portfolio. Might be worth looking at although it is a bit short on technology, (which of covers a wide variety of shares)

Dod

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142739

Postby scotia » June 1st, 2018, 10:34 am

FRCL is at a modest discount, provides a modest yield and is broadly based whilst still giving some exposure to technology stocks.

Way back in my youth, it used to be said - you'll never get sacked for buying IBM equipment - i.e. it was the safe choice. And I suppose that I see my FRCL holding in that light. But my EWI holding certainly offers a bit more excitement. As to Fund managers cleverly switching out of areas that are about to bomb, I suspect that is wishful thinking! Looking back a long time, I seem to remember a Fund Manager switching to bonds before a substantial market correction, and getting back into equity after the fall. At the time, he received great plaudits for his clever action, but a number of years later he needlessly carried out the same action, fearing that there would be another correction - which didn't happen, and he lost substantial potential gains in the equity market.

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142767

Postby toofast2live » June 1st, 2018, 11:42 am

StOmer wrote:Perhaps Edinburgh Worldwide (EWI) may fit the bill. A stablemate of SMT so that may rule it out for you but I hold SMT & EWI alongside some other core (less techy) IT's. (Brunner, F&C IT, F&C Smaller Co's, Scottish, Caledonia and Witan)

WTAN has been a bit of a plodder whilst FRCL is benefitting from its centenary year and all that goes with that, eg. discount narrowed, lots of publicity and a name change :-)


FRCL is a lot older than that. I think you’ll find it’s 150 years old!

Way back when Argentina was an emerging market. Hang on - it still is!

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142809

Postby bluedonkey » June 1st, 2018, 1:12 pm

FredBloggs wrote:
richfool wrote:Dod, to be clear, what I said was: "increasing my exposure to global growth and (in particular) technology," and: "but still maintaining as broad a spread as possible in terms of sectors and geographically".

Sounds like a whole of market, worldwide tracker fund of some description to me. That will have a market weight n technology stock.

I agree.

After looking at both Witan and F&C recently, I concluded that I might as well buy a low cost (e.g.Vanguard) World Index ETF. Last time I looked F&C had 400 holdings, 41% allocated to USA versus 51% per the index, etc. My suspicion is that they tweak the portfolio towards the UK slightly to provide more yield to cover their fees. No point paying them to do that.

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142815

Postby FredBloggs » June 1st, 2018, 1:19 pm

bluedonkey wrote:
FredBloggs wrote:
richfool wrote:Dod, to be clear, what I said was: "increasing my exposure to global growth and (in particular) technology," and: "but still maintaining as broad a spread as possible in terms of sectors and geographically".

Sounds like a whole of market, worldwide tracker fund of some description to me. That will have a market weight n technology stock.

I agree.

After looking at both Witan and F&C recently, I concluded that I might as well buy a low cost (e.g.Vanguard) World Index ETF. Last time I looked F&C had 400 holdings, 41% allocated to USA versus 51% per the index, etc. My suspicion is that they tweak the portfolio towards the UK slightly to provide more yield to cover their fees. No point paying them to do that.

I broadly agree. The reason I don't agree 100% is that by coincidence I looked at F&C this morning and was quite surprised how over the last five years it has trounced the FTSE World Index. Food for thought.

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142849

Postby richfool » June 1st, 2018, 2:21 pm

As mentioned in my OP, I am aware I already have some exposure to technology through other existing holdings like Witan, JAI and JPGI. (JP Morgan Asian Inc and JP Morgan Global Growth & Income).

(So) Another option could be to top-up one or more of those. Witan is of course in the same global growth sector as F&C (FRCL), which is what I was wanting to also increase my exposure to, and is of a similar style. When I "Bed & ISA'd" my existing holding of Witan in early April this year, my holding was up 40% (I bought into it in March 2016), so it had done quite well. Whilst it seems to have a little less inertia currently, I am quite happy to take the long term view.

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142865

Postby richfool » June 1st, 2018, 3:15 pm

Dod101 wrote:Alliance Trust is never mentioned on these Boards. Despite its troubles from governance issues, it does not have a bad record although that is irrelevant now as it has totally changed the way its investment management works. I held it for many years and sold in the midst of its problems with Elliot, but bought in again last year and it is doing fine. It is emulating the style of Lee Freeman-Shor, as the best of the best. OTOH in total it has a very diversified portfolio. Might be worth looking at although it is a bit short on technology, (which of covers a wide variety of shares)

Dod

Dod, Thank you for that suggestion. I have just been having a look at Alliance. It does look interesting, as it has a diversified portfolio of varying asset classes, including property and fixed income, and holds technology stocks, and pays a dividend in the upper 1% range.

I am vaguely aware of its background and the issues surrounding its previous CEO who eventually stepped down. I believe it had lost its way, but is now back on track. The question that occurs to me is, has it sorted itself out fully now, got rid of old historic/inherited holdings (sorry I've lost the word/expression) where appropriate, and does it now have a clear direction and management? Upon a quick read of general articles, it would seem that their website & admin still have shortcomings.

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142884

Postby Dod101 » June 1st, 2018, 4:25 pm

richfool
I attended its AGM a few weeks back and I think the answer to your questions is yes, yes and yes. The whole of the past management has gone and instead of being self managed it is now taking a multi manager approach monitored by Willis Towers Watson. They had two of their eight managers give a presentation after the formal business and they were very impressive. One of the managers was from London and the other from Toronto. As it happens we sat next to each other at lunch and he was a guy about 60 or so, quiet and unassuming. I have since checked with a cousin of mine who is an accountant and lives in Hamilton Ontario. She knows of his firm and it has an excellent reputation. Lord Smith the new Chairman of Alliance has a good reputation as a no nonsense Scottish business type.

I think each of the managers is asked to invest in 10 of their best ideas but maynbe a bit more, can't remember. They have a lot of small investments in Emerging Markets which I think they manage themselves.

They I think no longer have any directly held property and are planning to dispose of other legacy assets such as private equity and the Liontrust holding which they acquired when they sold their Alliance Trust Investments to Liontrust. They have an informal Discount control mechanism and say they would like to see the discount at no more than 5%.

So it is different which I like and quite refreshing after all the comings and goings of the last few years. I am quite sceptical but came away from the AGM reassured. It holds very few of the 'usual suspects'

I am not recommending it but I bought into it again last year and again at the beginning of this year and am happy with it so far.

Dod

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142886

Postby richfool » June 1st, 2018, 4:39 pm

Dodd wrote:to dispose of other legacy assets


Ahh "legacy" that was the word. I had completely lost it, or at least misplaced it, in my memory banks. More signs of getting old.

Ok, thank you for that assessment. I will have a more detailed look at Alliance over the weekend, and also Monks which I see as a slightly scaled down version of SMT.

Aside - These KID's are most frustrating. I just tried to place a trade and was unable to, because I hadn't confirmed to my investment manager that I had read the KID for the IT concerned. I am having to email them to confirm I have read the KID each time I want to trade an IT that I haven't previously traded, which also causes a delay whilst I wait for them to act upon my email. It's quite frustrating. (I am actually reading the KID's through the HL website, and HL are not my brokers!).

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#142920

Postby Dod101 » June 1st, 2018, 7:43 pm

I do not hold it but Monks is doing well these days. Baillie Gifford I think got severely embarrassed with Monks and put very senior people into it since when it has done well, so absolutely, a contender I'd say.

Dod

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#143168

Postby richfool » June 3rd, 2018, 8:49 am

I've been looking in more detail at Monks and Scottish Mortgage and can't really see much difference between them, both of which are at similar premiums and have virtually no dividend yield . At the moment, it's between those two, and Alliance or F&C (FRCL). (And all appear to hold 98%+ in equities.).

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Re: Choice of Global Growth IT

#143178

Postby tjh290633 » June 3rd, 2018, 9:49 am

richfool wrote:I've been looking in more detail at Monks and Scottish Mortgage and can't really see much difference between them, both of which are at similar premiums and have virtually no dividend yield . At the moment, it's between those two, and Alliance or F&C (FRCL). (And all appear to hold 98%+ in equities.).

One difference is that FRCL are more into private equity. From memory they are only about 15% invested in the UK. I think that ATST are also light on UK investments.

TJH


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