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Beginners portfolio

A helpful place to also put any annual reports etc, of your own portfolios
Pipsmum
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Beginners portfolio

#48881

Postby Pipsmum » April 26th, 2017, 2:37 pm

It is probably a good idea to display this beginners portfolio for critical appraisal.
It would be appreciated if more experienced peeps might give it a crit with maybe some suggestions for directional thoughts. It's been going only since December 16. The funds were opened at each launch and added to just after, plus will have monthly additions made. They were what made me start looking really.

These all began within an ordinary HL account and upon realising they could be the same within an ISA, then operated from within that.

HL Select UK shares (accumulation)
HL Select UK income shares (accumulation)
CF Woodford Income focus (equal accumulation and income, to compare the two performances)
Sirius minerals
Hurricane Energy
Boohoo
Plus a smidgeon of shares held in AMP for donkeys years. (not with HL)

Am learning how to set up a spreadsheet with shares properly from this
http://education.howthemarketworks.com/ ... portfolio/

Will happily listen to the experienced. I am a real newb at this.

Alaric
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Re: Beginners portfolio

#48908

Postby Alaric » April 26th, 2017, 3:46 pm

Pipsmum wrote:CF Woodford Income focus (equal accumulation and income, to compare the two performances)


I would hope you can trust their accounting systems that the performance will differ only by the distributed dividend.

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#48914

Postby kiloran » April 26th, 2017, 4:14 pm

Pipsmum wrote:Am learning how to set up a spreadsheet with shares properly from this
http://education.howthemarketworks.com/ ... portfolio/

Will happily listen to the experienced. I am a real newb at this.

If you are mucking about with spreadsheets, you might have a gander at this site: http://lemonfoolfinancialsoftware.weebly.com/

--kiloran

Pipsmum
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Re: Beginners portfolio

#48920

Postby Pipsmum » April 26th, 2017, 4:34 pm

Alaric wrote:I would hope you can trust their accounting systems that the performance will differ only by the distributed dividend.


Having passed them a considerable chunk of ackers. I hope so too. However one is getting accumulated so it ought to exponentially grow larger as far as I'm understanding things so far.

kiloran wrote:If you are mucking about with spreadsheets, you might have a gander at this site: http://lemonfoolfinancialsoftware.weebly.com/

--kiloran


Thank you and have just set one up from it. I didn't understand the other tutorial enough.

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#50373

Postby dspp » May 1st, 2017, 3:56 pm

It is unusual for a beginner to hold Hurricane which I see you hold. I hold it (see viewtopic.php?f=16&t=796) but I most definitely would not describe it as an obvious selection for a beginner. Unless (or even if) they have a considerable understanding of the sector.

Regards, and good luck, dspp

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#54364

Postby Pipsmum » May 16th, 2017, 11:05 pm

dspp wrote:It is unusual for a beginner to hold Hurricane which I see you hold. I hold it (see viewtopic.php?f=16&t=796) but I most definitely would not describe it as an obvious selection for a beginner. Unless (or even if) they have a considerable understanding of the sector.

Regards, and good luck, dspp


Thank you for the good wishes.

Choices by reading and reading stuff everywhere until something catches the attention, a note or a tip, someone who knows about these things maybe recommended something, and then go off and research it. Look at the past % history and the graph patterns. In this case it was someone called the Oil man. Can't remember where. Sirius research probably led there.

Then a safety alert set up either way to help protect my ignorance a bit, but this morning they had plummeted way below by the time I got to it. So I bought some more instead. It evened out the price of the ones I had already.

Mostly staying safely within funds as a newb, but with the odd tester punt. Here is the full folio as it stands so far. It's just a start so it isn't diverse yet. Watching loads before doing anything and just trying to learn. It's like watching wobbly jelly.

Woodford CF Woodford Income Focus Class Z 21.5% acc
Woodford CF Woodford Income Focus Class Z 21.5% inc
Jupiter India Class X 17.9%
Hargreaves Lansdown Select UK Shares Class A 17.7%
Hargreaves Lansdown Select UK Income Shares Class A 8.6%
Hurricane Energy 5.5%
Sirius Minerals 3.1%
Kier Group 2.2%
Phoenix Group Holdings 1.5%
boohoo.com 0.6%

Beginning to watch high yield shares for the long term income, which is where Kier and Phoenix came in. Boohoo on performance but admittedly that was probably daft. I hope beginners lucky daft and not daft daft.

I've set up some dummy watch folios to learn from such as:-
1 based on other Lemons examples from on here to see what it is they are seeming to look for.
2 various areas to compare like index trackers V high flyer predictions
3 top tips when I find them
4 interesting things I like the look of
5 minnows mentioned by others
6 copying a fund managers choices to see what they do
there are more but you get the drift.

It's really a massively huge arena to learn in. Very, very interesting and with a frisson too.

I'm a beginner and will no doubt make mistakes.

dspp
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Re: Beginners portfolio

#54414

Postby dspp » May 17th, 2017, 9:36 am

Most of your picks are sensible middle-of-the-road type stuff.

Re stocks like HUR there are different ownership patterns. Some people will trade in and out hourly, relishing the volatility and seeking to create as much volatility as they can, and knowing nothing (and caring even less) about the underlying technology/business. Others will hold for years expecting & hoping their "hole in the ground" to one day become a valuable gold mine, by which time they may have been fleeced for a pile of dirt, but in between times reading every technical report in detail. Others sit between trying to understand what is the correct value and being prepared to trade partially in or out if they think it is too out of kilter, and being prepared to be hugely wrong-footed either way. I am sure HUR will give you plenty of learning experiences, just as it will be giving them to me. Be careful about your exposure as not every dip is a buying opportunity - some may be the end of the road.

Once again good luck.

regards, dspp

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#54541

Postby Pipsmum » May 17th, 2017, 7:00 pm

dspp wrote:Most of your picks are sensible middle-of-the-road type stuff.


That is very reassuring comment indeed. I like the word sensible in this context.

For immediate satisfaction, I'd like to see a marginally better overall performance than a 3% bank account.
In for the long haul, looking for some with good growth, plus seeking some HY divis to ease the old bones later on.

For the short term, some to actually play with, I do like a little mischief if there is any to be had. Buying in the dip was impetuous behaviour. Maybe rash. I shall be guilty of that again no doubt, until I've learned to read share information correctly. If it wasn't so expensive to trade in and out then I expect I would enjoy that sort of behaviour (I'm currently using HL and find them very user friendly for a newb).

In this early ignorance I'm looking favourably at a graph that goes up to the right constantly over 5-10 years, spurning any with mountains and valley behaviour unless it's got a good divi yield and an overall upwards incline. Then at the % over the years/months/days, to see if they are all blue and positive. Then checking out what others say about them from wherever I find info.

Mostly just watching for now. I think I'll go and get the watch list of those I have on the radar. I haven't yet learned which are in what sector yet. I've been learning about the Beatty share management ways of not putting all the eggs in one basket and not messing with them.

Pipsmum
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Re: Beginners portfolio

#54547

Postby Pipsmum » May 17th, 2017, 7:34 pm

I made this watch list the other day of shares with good yields to try and identify any pattern of behaviour to indicate a good share.

green I liked the look of their performance
blue looked ok-ish
dark green was a fund
orange looked iffy
red was a not

This is as far as my understanding goes as yet. I realise today that the yield is also jelly-wobble too so this list order is already redundant. There are also more to add. I got so far..... I need a live list really.

http://postimg.org/image/6u1kokhl7/

Pipsmum
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Re: Beginners portfolio

#54757

Postby Pipsmum » May 18th, 2017, 4:38 pm

And I did the same with CF Woodfords list. Interesting how my green rating occurs more often in his more experienced list. Also interesting that I don't like some either in red or orange. I wonder what section of information I'm not understanding to do that.

I posted it on the HY thread too but perhaps I should have stuck with this beginner thread. A mod will take it off if it isn't suitable there as there will be mistakes on it.

http://postimg.org/image/5w6nxxm6l/

dspp
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Re: Beginners portfolio

#54867

Postby dspp » May 19th, 2017, 9:52 am

You may find it worth looking into Luniversal's concept of Zones over on TMF (now closed). Luniversal decided to call it a day when TMF>TLF but he had to his satisfaction 'proved' the zone theory. Others very much disagreed. Personally I think there is an efficient risk/reward frontier and so his concept has some legs, but I find it very difficult to find the frontier in practice, let alone decide where a share might be on it, or whether it is below it (i.e. below = extra risk for no extra reward).

Some random Luniversal posts - have a rootle around for more:

http://boards.fool.co.uk/the-dubious-di ... mendations
http://boards.fool.co.uk/renaissance-hy ... t=postdate

Efficient frontier:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Efficient_frontier

Regards, dspp

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#55171

Postby Hariseldon58 » May 20th, 2017, 9:55 pm

Pipsmum

It looks like your having fun researching and picking shares but you might wish to consider if you have an 'edge' over all the other investors out there ?

You might wish to read this article and watch the video link http://monevator.com/video-warren-buffe ... s-overall/

Pipsmum
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Re: Beginners portfolio

#55182

Postby Pipsmum » May 20th, 2017, 11:23 pm

I am having fun doing research. Just very interested really. No edges here. It's a bit like playing financial solitaire with lots to learn.

I was making another list of managed funds V index trackers today to try and see what is happening between one and another. I'm only scratching at the surface. I've found a huge list to wade through if I can be bothered to enter them all in excel. Its not as if I've got fortunes to invest, so i'd quite like what little I do have to do something much better than nothing. My mini portfolio overall has been swinging between 1.33% and 2.39% so far, so nearly keeping up with inflation level. That's fine so far as it hasn't been long.

It's where the folio goes next that will the interesting part and I'm open to all suggestions.

Thanks for the links. I shall read those in a mo.

Pipsmum
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Re: Beginners portfolio

#55188

Postby Pipsmum » May 20th, 2017, 11:47 pm

Thank you. I had been reading that one about the passive investing. That's why I made this comparison chart today.

http://postimg.org/image/ypfa8bsrn/

(Mods - it is my own chart made in excel and not copied from anywhere.)

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#59923

Postby Pipsmum » June 13th, 2017, 5:42 pm

After reading and reading, and looking and looking. I'd like to thank you so far for all the help and guidance so far. The golden guides seem to hint at having around 20 holdings, with 10% max to one share/sector or subsector, with no more than 20% to one industry and no tinkering unless necessary.

Here is the portfolio so far..... 13 shares and funds as yet...I'll have to wait to be able to improve the variety much further. This will be a slow, steady build over time. Yield% as of todays summary sheet.

1 - Woodford income focus = 17.7% inc
2 - Woodford income focus = 17.7% acc
3 - HL select UK = 14.9%
4 - Jupiter India = 14.5% (YLD 0.3%)
5 - HL select UK income = 8.8%
6 - Hurricane energy = 7% = Oil & Gas
7 - Petrofac = 6.3% = Oil & Gas (YLD 12.91%)
8 - First derivatives = 5.1% = Technology (YLD 0.66%)
9 - Sirius minerals = 3.2% = Basic Materials
10 - Kier group = 1.7% = Industrials (YLD 5.35%)
11 - Sirius Real estate = 1.3% = Financials (YLD 3.76%)
12 - Phoenix Group Holdings = 1.3% = Financials (YLD 5.95%)
13 - Boohoo.com = 0.6% = Consumer Services

Areas to look at next would be appreciated. I was shortlisting these amongst others. Any strong feelings about a don't go near with a bargepole?

BAE systems (BA) (might be the next choice)
Henry Boot (BOOT) (or this but a bit young for informative stats)
Fevertree (FEVR) (nice growth but low divi)
Keywords Studios (KWS) (nice growth but low divi)
Air Partner (AIR) ( thought i saw a contra somewhere but have lost it)
Persimmon (PSN) (slight contra - house builders hit by a hung parliament newsline)
Marstons (MARS) (nice divi, slow growth)
Ascential Group (ASCL) (young stats)
RPC Group (RPC) (very interested in this one)
Allied Minds (ALM) (restructuring company)
Standard Life (SL) and Aberdeen Asset Management (ADN) (undergoing merger so might be a while but are both sturdy companies)
Spirax-Sarco Engineering (SPX) (got downgraded in a broker roundup)

Pipsmum
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Re: Beginners portfolio

#59992

Postby Pipsmum » June 13th, 2017, 10:32 pm

That Vanguard thing you mention. On the 14th of last year the cost per unit was £46.34 and today, exactly a year on, it is £61.16, so in one year a single unit has made £14.82 and was assumedly market led dependent. So obtaining a 31.981% increase on a single investment in one year is pretty marvellous. I didn't notice the fees. Am I right in my understanding of the percentage there? It seems very high for a mere tracker, unless it isn't.

Are managed funds not considered better than a working tracker? As trundlers? Are they the same or similar to Investment Trusts? I am a bit muddled as to the IT's, ETF's, funds and others with initials that aren't shares. There seem to be oodles of them in varying forms, all a shade or two different from their neighbours.

Then the HYP folios. I get the income yield bit of course, but not why someone would choose a wobbly HYP line with lots of red negative performance figures over that straight upwards line over ten years with the large blue profit figures? What is being sought there?

It's very challenging just trying to understand the basics from scratch.

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#59997

Postby tjh290633 » June 13th, 2017, 10:56 pm

Pipsmum wrote:Then the HYP folios. I get the income yield bit of course, but not why someone would choose a wobbly HYP line with lots of red negative performance figures over that straight upwards line over ten years with the large blue profit figures? What is being sought there?

It's very challenging just trying to understand the basics from scratch.


The object of the HYP is to obtain a high and growing income from the dividends. You are looking at market movements, which will affect all shares and funds. The dividend income is not affected by such market movements, although changes in dividend income can influence the movement of certain share prices.

The general advice is not to pay too much attention to the value of the portfolio, as long as the dividend income is rising steadily. It is always worth while keeping an eye on the values of the holdings in the portfolio, particularly to the way in which they vary relative to each other. Some will fall, some will rise, often for no obvious reason. The level of the dividends will often offer a clue.

TJH

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#60000

Postby Pipsmum » June 13th, 2017, 11:02 pm

Thank you. I realise they are separate issues but why not have both long term growth as well as a high divi yield? From what i could see there did seem to be the odd share that could follow both paths. Maybe they don't stay like that.

Forgive the beginner questions.

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#60002

Postby tjh290633 » June 13th, 2017, 11:10 pm

Pipsmum wrote:Thank you. I realise they are separate issues but why not have both long term growth as well as a high divi yield? From what i could see there did seem to be the odd share that could follow both paths. Maybe they don't stay like that.

Forgive the beginner questions.


Ideally you can. However the market is a fickle beast and so the share price will often go its own sweet way, despite the dividend being raised. If you have time, just see how share prices react on the day when a dividend is announced. Often the price will fall on an increase, and rise on a held or reduced dividend. That is one of the joys of investing, trying to understand why the market is illogical.

TJH

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Re: Beginners portfolio

#60003

Postby Pipsmum » June 13th, 2017, 11:20 pm

Up until now I've been taking notice of the graph pattern over ten years as shown on the HL site. If it continues upwards in a nice neat angled line, then it appears more attractive to my lack of other knowledge compared to one that wobbles anywhere at all. That straight upwards seems to indicate a lack of share price fluctuation over the long term. Coupling that with a high yield seemed a good way for a beginner to begin to sift the many.

A bit simplistic maybe... but then I go over the choices made by respected others using my simple criteria to try and understand, and they don't follow that at all. There is a such lot to learn. Good job I'm only messing with small amounts.


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