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New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

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Itsallaguess
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New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140116

Postby Itsallaguess » May 20th, 2018, 6:49 am

Changes to the MOT test come into force on Sunday, which introduce new categories under which a vehicle can fail or pass.

The categories include "dangerous", "major" and "minor" which determine whether a car, van or motorcycle must be taken off the road or can be driven as long as repairs are carried out.

The MOT will also be tougher on diesel emissions.

Vehicles with a diesel particulate filter will now have to pass new tests.

That filter captures and stores exhaust soot to reduce emissions.

A diesel vehicle will fail its MOT if there is smoke of any colour coming from the exhaust or there is any evidence that the diesel particulate filter has been tampered with.

These faults will be classed as "major" under the new categories.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-44167243

The full list of rule-changes can be found here, on the Government website -

The MOT test changed on 20 May 2018, with new defect types, stricter rules for diesel car emissions, and some vehicles over 40 years old becoming exempt.

The way that the MOT test works in England, Scotland and Wales changed on Sunday 20 May 2018.

(The MOT test works differently in Northern Ireland)

The changes affect cars, vans, motorcycles and other light passenger vehicles.

There are 5 main changes you need to know...
.(continued)

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/mot- ... 0-may-2018

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140214

Postby didds » May 20th, 2018, 10:03 pm

I heard something about "dangerous" fails meaning the vehicle isn't permitted to leave the test centre.

not all test centres are garages/mechanics.

What happens then - does the vehicle just sit at th test centre until it rots away?

Or is that (likely) rubbish?

didds

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140226

Postby jfgw » May 20th, 2018, 11:33 pm

didds wrote:I heard something about "dangerous" fails meaning the vehicle isn't permitted to leave the test centre.

not all test centres are garages/mechanics.

What happens then - does the vehicle just sit at th test centre until it rots away?

Or is that (likely) rubbish?

didds


Presumably either transport it on a trailer or wait until it is 40 years old and drive it away.

Julian F. G. W.

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140227

Postby didds » May 20th, 2018, 11:45 pm

From what I heard on R4 today it isn;t allowed to leave the test centre, so sticking it on a trailer wouldn;t "work".

It has to be rubbish? One of the "dangerous" criteria is under inflated tyres (R4 again). Why not the test centre just pump the things up and stick a tenner on the bill?

didds

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140230

Postby supremetwo » May 21st, 2018, 2:32 am

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/mot- ... 0-may-2018

Some new items are tested during the MOT.

They include checking:
----
if brake pads or discs are missing
----
I am astonished that this was not included in the old MOT!

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140270

Postby tsr2 » May 21st, 2018, 9:55 am

supremetwo wrote:https://www.gov.uk/government/news/mot-changes-20-may-2018

Some new items are tested during the MOT.

They include checking:
----
if brake pads or discs are missing
----
I am astonished that this was not included in the old MOT!


Given that the brakes' effectiveness has been tested for as long as I have been having cars tested, it seems unlikely that a car with missing disks and/or pads would have passed anyway. I guess this was included to deal with some exceptionally unusual situation that has been observed, but maybe it's just someone in Whitehall trying to justify their job?

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140292

Postby jfgw » May 21st, 2018, 11:00 am

didds wrote:From what I heard on R4 today it isn;t allowed to leave the test centre, so sticking it on a trailer wouldn;t "work".
didds

I can see test centres who do not do repairs (or who do a limited range of repairs) or those with very limited parking being a bit lenient with some of the major fail items. If we see cars being driven out of test centres puffing out smoke, we will know why. I suspect that some centres will do some basic pre-checks before logging the vehicle in.

Why should smoke be a major fail? This may be a much bigger job than your average tyres/exhaust/MOT type shop with only a dozen parking spaces would want to undertake.

I can see why a failure on tyres or brakes would make a vehicle unroadworthy, and these are usually simple to fix. I suspect that the government may backtrack on the non-safety related items though.

There is also an opportunity for unscrupulous test centres to profit. If a recently fitted brake is failed, how do you get a second opinion?

Anyone for a pre-test?


Julian F. G. W.

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140294

Postby bungeejumper » May 21st, 2018, 11:06 am

Let's all shed a sympathetic tear for all those dieselheads who've been having their particulate filters removed because it's cheaper than shelling out £1,200 for a new one, and c'mon, no-one will ever know it's missing anyway, will they?

On second thoughts, maybe not. ;)

Quite a lot of nine year old cars will presumably be getting closer to the scrapper now that a working DPF is mandatory. (On Euro 5 models, from Sept 2009 to Sept 2014.) Especially since many of those cars have also had their EGR valves (£1,000) removed. And now it's all got to be put back. :?

BJ

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140452

Postby MonsterMork » May 21st, 2018, 11:05 pm

I heard something about "dangerous" fails meaning the vehicle isn't permitted to leave the test centre.

What happens then - does the vehicle just sit at th test centre until it rots away?


Not quite true. The owner may, should they wish, drive the vehicle away even with either a Major or Dangerous fail against it. However, the owner would be committing an offence under the Road Traffic Act of knowingly driving a vehicle in a dangerous condition. The MoT station has no right in law to prevent an owner removing the vehicle from the premises if it has failed a test, as long as no other liens or other dues etc are in force (eg: you ain't paid the bill, you ain't leaving, if you have then crack on sunshine, ain't my problem). How the owner removes the vehicle is up to them. This is no different to the old testing system, other than making it more apparent that a dangerous fault exists on the vehicle than it was previously.

They include checking:
----
if brake pads or discs are missing
----
I am astonished that this was not included in the old MOT!


Not true. Was always in the old test, just as it is in the new test. It has been mentioned in press briefings and so on (and therefore commented on by the media) because it is a statistic which has come up as a surprisingly regular occurrence - indeed, on one forum a tester posted a pic of a van presented for a test today with exactly that, a brake caliper removed from the hub and just tied up out of the way!

Why should smoke be a major fail?

Environmental reasons (see ending comment).

But the empty shell of the DPF and the EGR can be in place with the engine management system tweaked to not display EGR/DPF issues. I can't see this being so easy to enforce.

Not quite true, but not far off. A DPF obviously welded or otherwise tampered with is a Major fail, and the onus is on the vehicle presenter to prove that it was for repairs. This from the testers manual:
"If a diesel particulate filter has clearly been cut open and rewelded, you should reject it unless the vehicle presenter can show evidence that there was a valid reason to cut it open, such as for filter cleaning."
A cut and shut DPF may, on some vehicles, still not show an MIL fault, even without recourse to a spot of electronic jiggery pokery to prevent the light from coming on. Similarly, a missing or obviously tampered with EGR Valve is also a Major fail.
As for the enforcement of it, this is down to primarily a visual check, but many EGR Valves, for example, are invisible due to the presence of engine covers and the like, which testers are not allowed to remove. Ditto a DPF, for example high temperature exhaust wrap cannot be removed by a tester to check if it has been cut and shut. However, a DPF that has been gutted may well chuck some smoke out of the exhaust, in which case that is a Major fail, even if the DPF has been covered over to prevent proper visual inspection. Also, it is likely to fail the emissions test.

Many of these changes are being brought about by those nice folks from the EU, courtesy of directive 2014/45, the main gist of which is to bring the disparate testing regimes of all EU member states (including us until the divorce is finalised) closer to a common standard, and for environmental reasons (ie: we theoretically start to reduce the amount of emissions (CO, CO2, and soot and so on) from exhausts).

MM (MoT Tester)

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140485

Postby bionichamster » May 22nd, 2018, 10:18 am

I had a car in for an MOT three weeks ago, it failed on a number of things, I drove it home and spent the weekend replacing parts and cleaning and lubricating others. None of the parts where expensive but it took a lot of time due to siezed bolts and the like. While a Garage could have done most things quicker than myself I suspect the bill would have been closer to £500 rather than the £100 it actually cost me for parts (probably more than the car is actually worth). My main concern is that I might not be able to do that in the future depending on the definition of 'dangerous' and how it is applied. Some things are dangerous, but some are more dangerous than others and some are much more dangerous in certain circumstances than others e.g. brakes that are just (eg. slightly siezed calliper pins) under the required efficiency could be relatively safe if driven cautiously at a moderately low speed, but extremely dangerous under hard braking at 60+ on a winding B-road, same with a number of steering and suspension parts.

I asked the chap at the garage what effect he thought the new rules would have, and if I'd be able to take my cars home in future, he shook his head and had a rant to the effect that the new rules were like to be a "******* disaster" and words to that effect.

Well we'll see, the other car is due in July.....

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140487

Postby Slarti » May 22nd, 2018, 10:27 am

bionichamster wrote:I had a car in for an MOT three weeks ago, it failed on a number of things, I drove it home and spent the weekend replacing parts and cleaning and lubricating others. None of the parts where expensive but it took a lot of time due to siezed bolts and the like. While a Garage could have done most things quicker than myself I suspect the bill would have been closer to £500 rather than the £100 it actually cost me for parts (probably more than the car is actually worth). My main concern is that I might not be able to do that in the future depending on the definition of 'dangerous' and how it is applied. Some things are dangerous, but some are more dangerous than others and some are much more dangerous in certain circumstances than others e.g. brakes that are just (eg. slightly siezed calliper pins) under the required efficiency could be relatively safe if driven cautiously at a moderately low speed, but extremely dangerous under hard braking at 60+ on a winding B-road, same with a number of steering and suspension parts.

I asked the chap at the garage what effect he thought the new rules would have, and if I'd be able to take my cars home in future, he shook his head and had a rant to the effect that the new rules were like to be a "******* disaster" and words to that effect.

Well we'll see, the other car is due in July.....


So DIY an MOT before you go to check that all the necessary bits are there and working, as they should be.
Which is why I've always had my garage do the annual service before the MOT, that way anything that would have caused a fail is fixed in advance of the MOT.

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#140861

Postby MonsterMork » May 23rd, 2018, 10:01 pm

Hello again Bundies (showing my LooTP heritage, ain't I? :D ).

Another new fail is the use of HID bulbs in headlamps that were not originally fitted or designed for them. This despite the fact that people have been fitting them as a "safety measure", due to their increased light output over their originally fitted halogen (or other) bulbs.

Please don't shoot the messenger when your car fails for this, us testers don't write the rules!

And for the pedants out there, yes, fitting HID bulbs in an acetylene lamp as found on veteran cars is a fail! For them wot is desperate to know, yes, I do actually know a fellow biker who regularly rides a vintage, acetylene lit bike - with working lights ....

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#141100

Postby bionichamster » May 24th, 2018, 11:10 pm

Slarti wrote:So DIY an MOT before you go to check that all the necessary bits are there and working, as they should be.
Which is why I've always had my garage do the annual service before the MOT, that way anything that would have caused a fail is fixed in advance of the MOT.


Aye, I'll just crack out my rolling brake tester..... :) You only service once a year? what if "something that could cause a fail" happens four months after the MOT? I check my car frequently for wear and tear and try to replace or repair as it arises. I do around 20k a year in one car and service it myself two to three times a year, the other one does go to the garage for a service so that I can keep the log book stamped (although why I still bother I don't know) but only every 10k and it only does around 7k pa. I usually do give my cars the once over prior to taking it for an MOT, sometimes I will put it in knowing that it is likely to fail on a particular fault for the simple reason that they may find something else and I can save myself stripping things off twice if they find some additional issue. My concern is that having done so I might be prevented from taking my car home in any economically feasible way in order to fix it. I would contend that it's not always predicatble what the exact outcome of the test will be (primarily because I'm not a qualified tester, I don't have a car lift or all the equipment that they have access to either). My experience is that different testers can sometimes have varying opinons on the severity of some car's ailments, and when it comes to advisories I've seen some right weird stuff.

However As Mork has indicated, the wording on driving vehicles home may have changed but maybe the reality hasn't so much. I hope he's right...

BH

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#141101

Postby bionichamster » May 24th, 2018, 11:13 pm

MonsterMork wrote:Hello again Bundies (showing my LooTP heritage, ain't I? :D ).
.....This despite the fact that people have been fitting them as a "safety measure", due to their increased light output over their originally fitted halogen (or other) bulbs. .


Not so sure how much safer it makes them to temporarily blind the person approaching in the opposite direction on a dark b-road..... :shock:

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#141180

Postby 88V8 » May 25th, 2018, 10:05 am

bionichamster wrote:Aye, I'll just crack out my rolling brake tester..... :)


Wasn't sure the parking brake would achieve a pass on my 63 Yank, so I bought a Tapley meter on eBay.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Tapley-Brake ... Sw-a1bAxED
Doesn't do the balance of course, but one can check that for the fronts by taking one's hands off the wheel.

That car and my 74 Land Rover no longer need MOTs. but so long as the classic-car friendly people are still around at my local garage I'll probably take them along for an annual Not-the-MOT.

V8

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#141314

Postby Slarti » May 25th, 2018, 5:26 pm

bionichamster wrote:
Slarti wrote:So DIY an MOT before you go to check that all the necessary bits are there and working, as they should be.
Which is why I've always had my garage do the annual service before the MOT, that way anything that would have caused a fail is fixed in advance of the MOT.


Aye, I'll just crack out my rolling brake tester..... :) You only service once a year? what if "something that could cause a fail" happens four months after the MOT? I check my car frequently for wear and tear and try to replace or repair as it arises. I do around 20k a year in one car and service it myself two to three times a year, the other one does go to the garage for a service so that I can keep the log book stamped (although why I still bother I don't know) but only every 10k and it only does around 7k pa. I usually do give my cars the once over prior to taking it for an MOT, sometimes I will put it in knowing that it is likely to fail on a particular fault for the simple reason that they may find something else and I can save myself stripping things off twice if they find some additional issue. My concern is that having done so I might be prevented from taking my car home in any economically feasible way in order to fix it. I would contend that it's not always predicatble what the exact outcome of the test will be (primarily because I'm not a qualified tester, I don't have a car lift or all the equipment that they have access to either). My experience is that different testers can sometimes have varying opinons on the severity of some car's ailments, and when it comes to advisories I've seen some right weird stuff.

However As Mork has indicated, the wording on driving vehicles home may have changed but maybe the reality hasn't so much. I hope he's right...

BH


Do I only have it serviced once a year? Most certainly as that is all that is required in the logbook.
If something that would be an MOT failure happens between services, well it could happen the day after the service/MOT or 3 months later, or not.
I suppose it helps that I do trust my garage and that they will discuss if something needs doing, depending on my expected mileage in the next year.

A large part of the reason for driving a modern car is so that all I have to do is fuel, oil, water and tyres. And although I do check the oil and water regularly, I never have to do anything with them. Plus they just don't breakdown the way they used to.

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#141425

Postby bionichamster » May 26th, 2018, 9:35 am

88V8 wrote:Wasn't sure the parking brake would achieve a pass on my 63 Yank, so I bought a Tapley meter on eBay.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Tapley-Brake ... Sw-a1bAxED
Doesn't do the balance of course, but one can check that for the fronts by taking one's hands off the wheel.

That car and my 74 Land Rover no longer need MOTs. but so long as the classic-car friendly people are still around at my local garage I'll probably take them along for an annual Not-the-MOT.

V8


I live on top of a hill, I generally check the efficiency of my hand brake by parking on the steepest sections to make sure the car holds, however that doesn't do balance either....

The Tapley is interesting,do you know how easily do they slip out of calibration and by how much, I guess that would be my concern (although probably still much better than my hard/emergency brake test).

BH

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#141452

Postby tea42 » May 26th, 2018, 11:03 am

When I bought my 37 year old VW T25 Camper I negotiated a price I thought would leave room for a £1500 spend to make it mechanically perfect. But, I was scammed by a fibreglass expert who covered up extensive dangerous rust damage underneath and fooled the MOT inspector who tested it a month before I purchased it and me. In the event it cost me twice that sum to bring it up to the standard where it sailed through the MOT after the 20th May with no advisories whatsoever.

In 18 months my Camper wont need an MOT all. But, I will have it tested. I dont have a brake tester, an emissions meter or a hydraulic lift to properly examine the underside. I know lots of Classic vehicle owners and we are mostly a very responsible bunch who look after and cherish their vehicles. With modern Euroboxes that most of us rely on for safety and reliability we suffer eye watering costly depreciation. With an old Classic vehicle this is compensated for by no tax, very low insurance but a continuous drip drip of fondly funded renovations and enhancements. However, unlike the Euroboxes costly depreciation, the spend on a Classic vehicle is rather like spending money on your favourite grandchild. :D .

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#141627

Postby DrFfybes » May 27th, 2018, 9:17 am

MM might be able to answer this easily - with all the new rules can you still pass an MOT with a brake light unlit or faulty?

I followed 2 on Friday - very disconcerting in bright sunlight is the sun reflects off the working one.

Paul

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Re: New MOT tests come into force today (20th May 2018)

#141638

Postby bionichamster » May 27th, 2018, 10:01 am

Surely you would have failed on a faulty brake light before the new rules.....

BH


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