Catalyst thefts and what to do about them

[yyuryyub]

I live in North East London and there are two really major car crime problems here : keyless car theft and catalyst removal. As my wife and I both have 17 year old vehicles, we have been untroubled by the first of these - but our local social media reports a sorry tale of prestige new cars disappearing from their owner's driveway in the middle of the night. However, I was always aware that my wife's Honda was a target for catalyst theft. The security devices on offer seemed to be of dubious effectiveness or designed to fit Toyota Prius (initially the main target).

Sure enough, my wife's car had its catalyst cut out last week. This left a vehicle that was impractical to drive and cost £600 in total to fit a new catalyst + two new O2 sensors + minor welding & pipework. Would probably cost more at a main dealer in London. Now we are left with decisions about how to use our two cars in future and maybe somebody on this board can advise?

The first question is : is the replacement catalyst as big a target for theft as the original? I have heard conflicting stories here. Some people have been victims more than once, but possibly they had an expensive new OEM catalyst fitted. I had read that certain old catalysts contained larger quantities of the rare metals (as the price per ounce was much lower 15 to 20 years ago) and that the current scrap value could be hundreds of pounds. This clearly couldn't be the case for a modern aftermarket cat with an online price of sub £150. My mechanic also suggested that the older cats presented the rare metals in a way that made reprocessing easy, whilst modern cats maybe had ceramic bits that were more difficult to deal with. If this is true, there is at least a decent chance that the thieves would look at the replacement unit and decide not to bother. Does anyone know the facts here?

As my wife is an NHS worker at an inner London hospital, she needs to park a car in the area where the theft occurred. One option is for her to use my old Mondeo. You don't read about Mondeos being targetted - why is this? It seems to me that access is easy enough - the cat isn't hidden away in the engine compartment. It is possible that the catalyst is more difficult to cut out, due to how it is mounted. As the thieves do the job in a few minutes, they presumably target the same models that give the easiest steal - bad news for Honda Jazz owners. Does anybody have better info than me?

We have given more thought about finding safer parking, but options are limited. The worst place for cat thefts seems to be supermarket car parks. The thieves like places that are easy to get away from. My wife had parked in a residential street, but at the end of the road - one of those spots that is not directly outside somebody's front door. A convenient parking spot, but doubly vulnerable : not overlooked by residents and with a quick getaway route.

You can watch a catalyst theft here, recorded in East London.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoikldsTdsI

[MonsterMork]

... However, I was always aware that my wife's Honda was a target for catalyst theft. ...

Sure enough, my wife's car had its catalyst cut out last week...

The first question is : is the replacement catalyst as big a target for theft as the original? You don't read about Mondeos being targetted - why is this? It seems to me that access is easy enough - the cat isn't hidden away in the engine compartment. It is possible that the catalyst is more difficult to cut out, due to how it is mounted. As the thieves do the job in a few minutes, they presumably target the same models that give the easiest steal - bad news for Honda Jazz owners.

Before you even mentioned it is a Jazz that was my immediate guess. Yes, Jazz owners are specifically targeted - the cat is relatively easy to get to, takes 45 seconds from drive up to drive away and worth its weight. Mondeo is a different set up, takes 45 minutes and worth stuff all. We had a spate of Jazz cat thefts round our way last year, one of our customers getting nailed twice in about 6 weeks All told I think we repaired six vehicles in about three months until the scrotes responsible got nailed by plod - sadly I suspect the little expletives will be due out by about now so it will start all over again

Funnily enough I had a Jazz in for MoT this morning and the first thing me and the gaffer said was "Sounds a bit quiet for one of them, must still have the cat fitted".

MM

[Mike4]

What do they use to cut them out? It was making a terrible racket. Cordless grinder I imagine.

I'm puzzled now. I'm sure I heard a few years back that Mercedes Sprinter vans were terribly prone to this but surely diesel car and vans don't have them...


(Grammar edit.)

[MonsterMork]

What do they use to cut them out? It was making a terrible racket. Cordless grinder I imagine.

(Grammar edit.)

Yes, battery powered hacksaw jobbie like these:

https://www.sgs-engineering.com/c18hz-5 ... saw-bundle

https://www.sgs-engineering.com/m18bsx- ... es-charger

Although, naturally, they won't have bought them

Not excessively noisy when you are underneath a car in a noisy car park and your mates have their car stereo turned up loud. That and the fact that it only takes seconds to do the job.

MM

[yyuryyub]

... However, I was always aware that my wife's Honda was a target for catalyst theft. ...

Sure enough, my wife's car had its catalyst cut out last week...

The first question is : is the replacement catalyst as big a target for theft as the original? You don't read about Mondeos being targetted - why is this? It seems to me that access is easy enough - the cat isn't hidden away in the engine compartment. It is possible that the catalyst is more difficult to cut out, due to how it is mounted. As the thieves do the job in a few minutes, they presumably target the same models that give the easiest steal - bad news for Honda Jazz owners.

Before you even mentioned it is a Jazz that was my immediate guess. Yes, Jazz owners are specifically targeted - the cat is relatively easy to get to, takes 45 seconds from drive up to drive away and worth its weight. Mondeo is a different set up, takes 45 minutes and worth stuff all. We had a spate of Jazz cat thefts round our way last year, one of our customers getting nailed twice in about 6 weeks All told I think we repaired six vehicles in about three months until the scrotes responsible got nailed by plod - sadly I suspect the little expletives will be due out by about now so it will start all over again

Funnily enough I had a Jazz in for MoT this morning and the first thing me and the gaffer said was "Sounds a bit quiet for one of them, must still have the cat fitted".

MM

That's very helpful MonsterMork. My wife's car is actually a Honda Stream, a rather rare stretched Accord, but the Jazz is clearly the common target. Did your customer who got robbed twice have a cheap aftermarket cat fitted or some expensive OEM unit? I'm still trying to work out if our repaired Honda is still a target or not. We had been considering the Honda as the "keeper" and the Mondeo as the first to replace, but now we're not so sure.

Having looked at the bolt-on glue-on security devices being promoted, I wondered if something more creative was needed. Perhaps some kind of heat resistant kevlar or steel netting that would be very difficult to cut with a recip saw or angle grinder and too time consuming to snip off.

The car was robbed near my wife's workplace in East London. I phoned a car service/repair place nearby and they gave an estimate of £500, but then said "or if you only want to keep the car for a short term, we can do something different". I presume that this meant not fitting a catalyst at all. I declined this offer and got the car transported back to my usual local mechanic.

In retrospect, I wonder if one of the security options is to have the original cat pre-emptively removed and replaced with a much less stealable unit with original sensors.

[richlist]

Is there no insurance cover available for catalyst thefts ?

[PinkDalek]

... maybe somebody on this board can advise?

Not really a reply to the truncated question above but suggestions I've seen include fitting the replacement with third hand bits & bobs, securing with additional bolts, encasing the unit***, security markings, fitting a Cat lock, fitting a car alarm that goes off when the car is tilted etc.

Some even remove their wheels whenever they park but I don't think that helps your wife's situation nor necessarily the cars concerned!

*** I think your follow up post I've just seen may have covered that aspect.

[PinkDalek]

Is there no insurance cover available for catalyst thefts ?

I understand it might depend on the Policy. Obviously there's also the issue of losing the excess and possibly any no claims discount, unless protected etc.

[yyuryyub]

... maybe somebody on this board can advise?

Not really a reply to the truncated question above but suggestions I've seen include fitting the replacement with third hand bits & bobs, securing with additional bolts, encasing the unit***, security markings, fitting a Cat lock, fitting a car alarm that goes off when the car is tilted etc.

Some even remove their wheels whenever they park but I don't think that helps your wife's situation nor necessarily the cars concerned!

*** I think your follow up post I've just seen may have covered that aspect.

It is hard to deter a ruthless thief armed with a recip saw. Many of the security devices seem to be an invitation to just cut more bits away, doing more widespread damage. What is there to anchor to, that can't just be sawn up? Security markings seem irrelevent, when they throw away the casing and keep the honeycomb inside that's coated with the precious metals. Car alarms are of only limited use. The theft takes a few minutes and by the time the alarm activates and people notice, the thieves will probably just finish the job. Perhaps useful to deter driveway theft.

A mass of confusing looking additional fixings might just persuade them to pick a different vehicle - or they might just cut up everything in sight.

I thought of fitting a few chunky insulated wires with a "DANGER - High Voltage" sign, but that would fool nobody. Now, if I could do that for real, like those electronic mouse traps ... no, only kidding.

A sign saying "this is a dirt cheap cat and has no scrap value" might help.

[9873210]

That's very helpful MonsterMork. My wife's car is actually a Honda Stream, a rather rare stretched Accord, but the Jazz is clearly the common target. Did your customer who got robbed twice have a cheap aftermarket cat fitted or some expensive OEM unit? I'm still trying to work out if our repaired Honda is still a target or not. We had been considering the Honda as the "keeper" and the Mondeo as the first to replace, but now we're not so sure.

I suspect you're still a target.

Have you ever tried to read a part number under a car? Much easier to take the part out, wipe it off, and look at it in good light.

If the replacement cat is worthless to the thief they will cut it out, check the make and model, and throw it into the nearest bin or ditch. Doesn't do them any good, but it does you harm. This will continue until a large fraction of the model have been robbed and retrofitted. To be fair there are some thieves who will check the type first, but there are many who will not.

[jfgw]

I think an alarm would have to have its sounder under the car and be above the pain threshold, preferably even with ear plugs. It could well be effective, however, if suitably protected against deactivation. Maybe a non-resettable, Sparklet cartridge-powered whistle would cause a bruised head and a few cuts and grazes.

I'm not sure how legal this sort of thing would be. I'm sure some people wouldn't care if something similar went off a few inches above a thief's face. I am not recommending it, however,
https://www.welovecycling.com/wide/2017 ... y-cycling/

Here is a safer alternative,
https://www.skunklock.com/


Julian F. G. W.

[MonsterMork]

Did your customer who got robbed twice have a cheap aftermarket cat fitted or some expensive OEM unit?

Having looked at the bolt-on glue-on security devices being promoted, I wondered if something more creative was needed. Perhaps some kind of heat resistant kevlar or steel netting that would be very difficult to cut with a recip saw or angle grinder and too time consuming to snip off.

In retrospect, I wonder if one of the security options is to have the original cat pre-emptively removed and replaced with a much less stealable unit with original sensors.

Customer had expensive aftermarket each time.

Not really sure if these cat theft preventers are any good, indeed I am yet to actually see one fitted to a vehicle despite them having been around for a few years now!

Don't waste your time swapping to a "less stealable" one - even an attempted theft will still stuff the thing anyway, thus leaving you with the same garage bill as you would have had if the original had been taken.

The best way to stop the theft of a catalytic converter is to buy a diesel They have a DPF instead Besides which the things are considerably heavier than cats thus leading to the possibility of it falling on the smegwit's head and leaving them spark out

MM

[Mike4]

The best way to stop the theft of a catalytic converter is to buy a diesel They have a DPF instead

Really? I had a goggle and discovered my Vito diesel seems to have a cat, as well as a DPF. Or is this man talking bobbins?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Apalm5- ... tallations

[MonsterMork]

The best way to stop the theft of a catalytic converter is to buy a diesel They have a DPF instead

Really? I had a goggle and discovered my Vito diesel seems to have a cat, as well as a DPF. Or is this man talking bobbins?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Apalm5- ... tallations

No idea, as far as I can remember I have never been underneath a Vito so for all I know they could fitted with mermaids!

MM

[bungeejumper]

Really? I had a goggle and discovered my Vito diesel seems to have a cat, as well as a DPF. Or is this man talking bobbins?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Apalm5- ... tallations

No idea, as far as I can remember I have never been underneath a Vito so for all I know they could fitted with mermaids!

They all have cats - certainly since 2009 - but they contain different things. Diesel cats are based on platinum, but newer petrol cars, including hybrids, use palladium, which is more than twice the price. A typical hybrid cat contains 3 to 7 grams of palladium, which would currently be worth sixty quid per gram in its pure state.

Even in February 2019, the Wall Street Journal said that the going scrapyard price for cat from a Toyota Prius hybrid was $450. (Lesser cars' units were worth closer to $200, it said.) https://www.wsj.com/articles/thieves-mi ... 1549803601 And the palladium price has nearly doubled since then. No wonder people nick them.

BJ

[richlist]

That'll give you another strong negotiating point when it's time to scrap your car.
I guess the cat is likely to be worth more than the car itself in some instances.

[MonsterMork]

I guess the cat is likely to be worth more than the car itself in some instances.

Given the state of some cars I have MoT'd recently the air in the tyres is worth more than the car!

MM (sweeping transits off the ramp since 1967)

[DrFfybes]

The best way to stop the theft of a catalytic converter is to buy a diesel They have a DPF instead Besides which the things are considerably heavier than cats thus leading to the possibility of it falling on the smegwit's head and leaving them spark out

MM

Or pre 1994 cars. It's the future

Paul