Degradation of Teletext

[ten0rman]

Hi folks,

I'm using the term "teletext" as a generic term covering those text services which were, or are, supplied by the broadcasters along with the normal on-air television channels. I am aware that originally the different companies used different terms - teletext, oracle etc.

A long time ago, teletext services, particularly finance, news and readers letters, were supplied, from memory, by BBC, ITV & Sky. Gradually ITV & Sky dropped out, presumably on the grounds of cost, leaving just the BBC, which in turn dropped its readers letters section leaving just the basic finance and news service.

A few weeks I noticed that they had dropped the Market Report from the Business section, referring readers instead to the internet, but they did keep the prices sections and the FTSE100 (& others) levels albeit delayed by 15 or so minutes.

Recently, on reading the local news section, I discovered that the regions were all out of place. Hitherto they had been listed in alphabetical order. Eventually I realised that in fact they had re-ordered the regions in geographical order starting with the northern most regions and working down towards the southernmost regions. Furthermore I discovered that whoever was adding in the news items had no knowledge of geography - why else would Bradford (situated in West Yorkshire) appear under Lancashire? And finally, I now find that the vast majority of items are football related. Do they think that we, the readers, are only interested in overpaid people kicking an inflated bladder around?

And one final point. I have a Humax DTR2100T DVR (rebadged as a BT device) connected to a Samsung non-smart tv which itself has an in-built digital tuner. I find that the teletext service via the tv is different to that via the DVR, eg, via the tv I can get share prices, albeit delayed, but via the DVR I cannot, yet both services are provided by the BBC. What is the difference? Could it be that the DVR is using the internet?

So, what is going on? Could it be that the BBC is trying to make things as difficult as possible so that people stop using the service, hence the BBC can ultimately shut down the service on the grounds that no-one is using it? Has anyone else noticed this? And if so, what are your thoughts?

Regards,

ten0rman

ps. The real irony, for me, is that a few weeks ago, one of the large quality newspapers, which I buy every Saturday and Sunday, contacted me with an offer, eg for an extra 80p per week, I could have full 7 day papers. Unfortunately, they don't do local news!

[swill453]

You learn something new every day. I was amazed that teletext still exists, and that someone uses it.

On a bit of research I see that it's not the old Ceefax, which was on analogue only and was abolished ages ago.

What you've got is actually now branded "BBC Red Button" or maybe "BBC Red Button+" I believe. http://www.bbc.co.uk/corporate2/insidet ... buttonfaq/

I wouldn't hold out too much hope of getting what you want out of it though:

On the BBC Red Button, we have a limited capacity and while our top priority is major events like Sports and Music Festivals we try to cater for as wide a range of tastes as possible.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/faqs/redbutton_nonsport_choice

Scott.

[ten0rman]

Thanks for that swill.

It looks as if my tv uses the original red button service whilst the dvr uses the red button + service. Which explains the discrepancy re financial info, but does not explain why they have rearranged the local info into a geographic listing rather than the more obvious alphabetical listing. Nor why there's so much sport on the local channels or the lack of geographical knowledge.

ten0rman

[SalvorHardin]

The BBC still has a substantial teletext service on BBC News channel (503) on the Sky+ box. It includes weather forecasts, cricket scorecards from around the world and scores (and sometimes reports) from a wide variety of sports leagues.

Given that it covers WRU National League 1 East, where my club Brynmawr are topping the table, I suspect that there is a lot of fairly obscure stuff covered on there in some depth.

I suspect that some of the boxes that people use are picking up bits of it, perhaps because the box isn't properly configure by the service provider.

[Stompa]

It says here (Item 2):

http://www.live.bbc.co.uk/corporate2/in ... aqitem-3-8

The original Red Button is still available on most TVs. If you’re in/on? Red Button+ you can access the original red button just by pressing the ‘text’ key on your television remote control.

I also have a BT T2100, but I can't get this to work.

Ah, all is explained by Item 4:

If your TV or Set Top Box supported the original Red Button service then you can continue to use this by pressing the ‘text’ button instead of ‘red’ on your remote control. Note that the original Red Button was not available on TiVo or YouView devices.

[ten0rman]

Stompa,

I can only get what I now know to be the Red Button + service on the T2100. I think I press the actual red button to get it. Certainly the text button does not do anything.To get the original Red Button only service, I have to use the tv.

SalvorHardin,

Yes there is a lot of stuff available via either service. Unfortunately, most of it is of no interest to me, hence I only mentioned those bits I was interested in - national news, local news for Yorkshire, Cumbria, and various parts of Scotland where we have spent holidays, and financial such as FTSE100 & my one remaining share (all the others being IT's)

ten0rman

[swill453]

Yes there is a lot of stuff available via either service. Unfortunately, most of it is of no interest to me, hence I only mentioned those bits I was interested in - national news, local news for Yorkshire, Cumbria, and various parts of Scotland where we have spent holidays, and financial such as FTSE100 & my one remaining share (all the others being IT's)

Dare one ask, in all seriousness, in what way it was better than using the WWW?

Scott.

[ten0rman]

swill,

In a word, idleitis!

Seriously though, even now, for my requirements, I find teletext rather easier to navigate than using the computer, especially for quick looks. I do use the internet on a weekly basis when I do a full check of how our shares, and a lot others which might be used when that rich maiden aunt leaves me a small fortune, are doing. I actually have a spreadsheet going back many years for tracking them. Using the computer involves sitting at my desk, setting the computer up, accessing the required data, ok on a weekly basis but not two or three times a day. And that also includes reading the news, national & local. Also, my main computer is in our dining room so if Mrs T is clattering about in the kitchen, it can be rather annoying.

Incidently, in case anyone is wondering why I want to read the news rather than listen to it, I am, I'm sorry to say, losing my hearing such that it is now very difficult trying to follow announcers on the tv. I do usually have subtitles on, but occasionally, eg in weather forecasts, they get in the way. I can see a time coming when I may well have to use the internet. The hearing loss, by the way, is mainly bass frequencies, so if as mentioned above Mrs T is clattering in the kitchen, I can hear those sounds quite well, in fact too well.

FWIW, I don't have a smart 'phone and can't really see the need for one.

Does that explain things?

ten0rman

[Stompa]

Eureka, I've discovered how to get Red Button rather than Red Button + on the T2100. All you have to do is select a BBC radio station (e.g. 704) rather than a BBC TV channel prior to pressing the red button.

I'm also led to believe (though I've not tested it), that disconnecting the box from the internet causes it to revert back to Red Button rather than Red Button +, which seems logical.

[cinelli]

You can contact the technical people at the BBC at digital.text@bbc.co.uk for help/complaints. I have done this a few times. I am still using this service: page 230 for indices, 220 for FT350 share prices and winners/losers. They dropped the market report a few months ago. Coverage of sport is very good.

Cinelli

[ten0rman]

ap8889,

FWIW, I have Infinity1, or whatever it is these days. Last time I checked it was working somewhere around 67Mbps d/l. So as I said earlier, it's a matter of idleitis coupled with convenience for quick looks. Full shares checking is via the computer & web, and frankly is no good for just the quick look (takes too long to fire up and access the relative pages).

Now I know what I've said sounds daft, but although I do have this high speed internet, I'm reasonably certain that I'm now being hampered by the ancient computer I'm using (Celeron M CPU 520 @ 1.6GHz) and about 9 or 10 years old. Unfortunately, it and its colleagues used for backup & other things like carting into the garage (don't ask), work quite well and do what I want, ok, maybe slowly compared to new, but at my age, mid-70's, I'm not about to replace it (or them) unless they do actually become irrepairable. It isn't a case of can't afford - it's more a case of don't see the point of replacing something that does what I want, even if it is slow by modern standards. If, as I said it did become irrepairable, then I would consider new, or at least reasonably new s/h.

ten0rman