Musk endeavours

[Howard]

Our KIA BEV just has a standard boot at the back. Like the VW ID.4, the engine etc is under the front bonnet. To be absolutely honest, I haven't looked under the bonnet apart from the day the car was delivered. In my younger days, I might have admired the front mechanics more frequently but now I don't open the bonnet of either of our cars more than perhaps once a year. Even with the ICE cars I have owned I rely on the electronic warning systems to monitor oil level, washer levels etc and can't remember when I have had to top up between services. Perhaps once or twice a year to top up the washer fluid when I was regularly driving longer distances?

Yes, I have stowed the "Granny Charger" with its 13 amp plug for the KIA in the bottom of the boot under the floor. I guess the only time this might be used is if we stay with a friend (without a fast charger) and I'd like to charge the car overnight. Otherwise any charging would be done using the charging lead attached to a charger. I noticed, incidentally, that the one time I have used a public charger it had what I believe to be a water cooled cable as it was delivering around 50Kw. It isn't possible to use your own cable in this situation.

Personally speaking I like a hatchback with one boot as a second car. Most of the time the boot space is more than I need and having just one place to store everything is optimal. Our BEV will take a couple of bikes in the back with the seats folded so it's versatile. I couldn't be bothered packing two boots for a journey and can't see any advantage in this.

After test drives, my neighbours chose a VW ID.3 instead of a Tesla Model 3 because it was a lot more spacious for passengers in the back and more versatile. Maybe a Model Y would have suited them if it had been available. But they also didn't like the touchscreen controls of a Tesla - too fiddly!

regards

Howard

[BobbyD]

Ody you are trying to undermine the ID.4 on the grounds that

The basic idea of a car is that it transports the driver and his/her stuff and any passengers from where they are to where they want to be.

Adding as much space as possible for stuff is what drivers and their passengers want.

by citing a review that:

• found the ID.4 had more usable room than not just the Model 3 and Model Y but the old Model S, the new Model S, The model X 6 seater and the e-tron.

• explained why MEB allows more spacious cars to be built on smaller footprints

• highly recommended the ID.4

You are constantly banging on about the advantages of BEV, and the disadvantages of the ICE mindset, yet can't acknowledge that not needing to leave a space for the engine under the bonnet is an advantage of BEV's!

Either this is a work of extraordinary self satire, or great desperation.

[BobbyD]

InsideEVs contributor and Tesla owner Kyle Conner quite likes the ID.4...

Everyone should buy one that's what I'm trying to say. It does everything for everyone ...in terms of price point, in terms of usability, in terms of comfort, in terms of dynamics, in terms of space, this does everything that a $60,000 car should for $20,000 less.

- https://insideevs.com/features/499802/v ... is-review/

[odysseus2000]

Ody you are trying to undermine the ID.4 on the grounds that

The basic idea of a car is that it transports the driver and his/her stuff and any passengers from where they are to where they want to be.

Adding as much space as possible for stuff is what drivers and their passengers want.

by citing a review that:

• found the ID.4 had more usable room than not just the Model 3 and Model Y but the old Model S, the new Model S, The model X 6 seater and the e-tron.

• explained why MEB allows more spacious cars to be built on smaller footprints

• highly recommended the ID.4

You are constantly banging on about the advantages of BEV, and the disadvantages of the ICE mindset, yet can't acknowledge that not needing to leave a space for the engine under the bonnet is an advantage of BEV's!

Either this is a work of extraordinary self satire, or great desperation.

I am simply pointing out what I see to be flaws in the ID4.

Folk who have a genuine interest in the subject should welcome such comments rather than the bland, you must buy one that many of the sponsored commentators are saying.

Regards,

[BobbyD]

Ody you are trying to undermine the ID.4 on the grounds that

The basic idea of a car is that it transports the driver and his/her stuff and any passengers from where they are to where they want to be.

Adding as much space as possible for stuff is what drivers and their passengers want.

by citing a review that:

• found the ID.4 had more usable room than not just the Model 3 and Model Y but the old Model S, the new Model S, The model X 6 seater and the e-tron.

• explained why MEB allows more spacious cars to be built on smaller footprints

• highly recommended the ID.4

You are constantly banging on about the advantages of BEV, and the disadvantages of the ICE mindset, yet can't acknowledge that not needing to leave a space for the engine under the bonnet is an advantage of BEV's!

Either this is a work of extraordinary self satire, or great desperation.

I am simply pointing out what I see to be flaws in the ID4.

Folk who have a genuine interest in the subject should welcome such comments rather than the bland, you must buy one that many of the sponsored commentators are saying.

Regards,

You explicitly called out the ID.4 on it's lack of capacity, having previously described it as too small for the American market, and then cited a source which demonstrated how it has a larger usable capacity than cars with bigger footprints including all the Teslas bar one, yet somehow believe that despite this Teslas are set to dominate the American market...

It's not that you are expressing an opinion, which is your right however wrong that opinion maybe, it's that you are citing evidence which shows the opposite to be true...

[odysseus2000]

BobbyD
You explicitly called out the ID.4 on it's lack of capacity, having previously described it as too small for the American market, and then cited a source which demonstrated how it has a larger usable capacity than cars with bigger footprints including all the Teslas bar one, yet somehow believe that despite this Teslas are set to dominate the American market...

It's not that you are expressing an opinion, which is your right however wrong that opinion maybe, it's that you are citing evidence which shows the opposite to be true...

I am arguing that measuring the space inside a car using Banana boxes is not a measure that is of interest to almost any prospective punter. I am further arguing that the lack of user friendly stowage on the ID4 makes it too small and pokey for typical US buyers.

Regards,

[BobbyD]

I am arguing that measuring the space inside a car using Banana boxes is not a measure that is of interest to almost any prospective punter. I am further arguing that the lack of user friendly stowage on the ID4 makes it too small and pokey for typical US buyers.

It doesn't matter how you measure it the ID.4 yields more useful capacity in a 'smaller' car then the model 3. If the ID.4 is too small and pokey, then the model 3 must be simply unbearable.

The model 3 is a longer car, but it has a shorter cabin than the ID.4.

Yes because the cabin of a car is in no way as user friendly as a wicker basket you have to get out of the car in the pissing rain and pop the hood to access...

Meanwhile...

The single radar sensor won’t be used anymore and Musk confirmed that Tesla will be dropping it from production and won’t use it as a backup. Musk is known for not wanting to use lidar sensors and that’s now the case with radar sensors. It seems Musk and his team are adamant about just using cameras.

- https://insideevs.com/news/500100/elon- ... -fsd-v9.0/

[BobbyD]

American battery supply predictably back on track:

SK Innovation To Pay $1.8 Billion To LG Energy To Avert Ban

- https://insideevs.com/news/500287/sk-in ... y-lg-chem/

[odysseus2000]

Cathay Wood argues that in the late 1800 the markets were much more expensive compared to GDP than they are now:

https://seekingalpha.com/news/3680853-a ... king_alpha

Regards,

[BobbyD]

Looks like Tesla have been putting some serious thought in about their customer relations and brand reputation and decided they simply aren't nearly bad enough yet...

Tesla hikes solar roof price on contracts signed over a year ago

Over the weekend, reports have come in of the recent massive Tesla solar roof price increase hitting several customers, some of whom have been waiting about a year with signed installation contracts. The price increase seems to apply to Tesla Powerwall installations, too, with the cost of those increasing by about 30%.

Some customers have even already spent thousands of dollars in preparation for the job, and yet are being told that their solar roof installation will cost tens of thousands of dollars more than anticipated.

...Here’s the text of the email that’s been sent out:

We have increased the price of Solar Roof and have added adjustments for individual roof complexity. Learn More

You will receive an email in the next 1-2 days when your new agreement is ready for your review and acceptance before moving forward. If you are no longer interested in moving forward with Solar Roof, you can cancel your order by logging into your Tesla Account and your deposit will automatically be refunded.

We will be prioritizing customers based on the order in which they accept their updated agreements.

...One customer we spoke to placed their order nine months ago, and signed a revised contract in February. They have already signed a loan agreement for the original amount. The original “system price,” prior to credits and including Powerwalls, was $77,019.92 ...Now, the system shows up in their Tesla account as having a “system price” of $118,870.33, before credits are applied (but after the combined roof + Powerwall discount, which has been reduced from $2,500 to $2,000):

...For this customer, this represents a price increase of a staggering 54.3%. Beyond the loan agreement that was signed months ago, this customer already spent about $5,000 for home improvement preparations, including tree and stump removal to reduce shade on their roof.

- https://electrek.co/2021/04/11/tesla-hi ... -year-ago/

I was going to say I wish I could say I was shocked, then I noticed I actually was. Even by Tesla's standards this is incredible.

The TMC thread is here: https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads ... se.225429/

[odysseus2000]

Binance launches traceable stock tokens, starting off with Tesla:

https://seekingalpha.com/news/3680926-b ... king_alpha

Regards,

[odysseus2000]

17K BMW recalled over fire risk:

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/recalls/ ... -c-2573529

Regards,

[BobbyD]

Mercedes move in to modern BEV era with frunkless design

Mercedes-Benz EQS Will Not Have A Frunk, As This Image Shows

- https://insideevs.com/news/500416/merce ... -no-frunk/

[TUK020]

Frunk

Surely in British English, this should be referred to as a Froot?

[Howard]

17K BMW recalled over fire risk:

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/recalls/ ... -c-2573529

Regards,

Amusing that you should feature this example of good customer service, Ody.

You didn't mention that the cars involved are between 11 and 14 years old and, unlike Teslas, none have caught fire because of this issue.

We'll have to wait and see if Tesla improve their after sales service to reach this level of care. At the moment there have been several examples of them being very reluctant to address safety issues in much newer cars.

regards

Howard

[odysseus2000]

17K BMW recalled over fire risk:

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/recalls/ ... -c-2573529

Regards,

Amusing that you should feature this example of good customer service, Ody.

You didn't mention that the cars involved are between 11 and 14 years old and, unlike Teslas, none have caught fire because of this issue.

We'll have to wait and see if Tesla improve their after sales service to reach this level of care. At the moment there have been several examples of them being very reluctant to address safety issues in much newer cars.

regards

Howard

Its a legal requirement in the US.

Regards,

[odysseus2000]

Munro looks underneath the ID4 and finds issues:

https://youtu.be/HkJXkWC9G_0

I have no idea why VW have gone along the various routes they have in the forward and aft suspension and I am still mystified about why they have gone backwards and more expensively with the rear drum brake.

Regards,

[BobbyD]

...and I am still mystified about why they have gone backwards and more expensively with the rear drum brake.

Your memory is failing then because it has been explained to you several times...

[odysseus2000]

BobbyD
Your memory is failing then because it has been explained to you several times...

No, all I have heard are prejudice and hand waving about how a drum break will not suffer the corrosion of a disk brake.

Outweighing such comments are my own personal experience of working on drum brakes and those of many other people who have worked on them.

Drum brakes are hideous things, prone to getting full or water, having poor braking characteristics, corroding and being a total pain. Sure one can argue that it is possible to make drum brakes for less than disk brakes suggesting the only reason for putting a drum brake on is to save a few pennies.

If you can find some quantitative analysis of the ID4 drum brake that shows it is an engineering choice not a penny savers choice then please post.

Regards,

[BobbyD]

BobbyD
Your memory is failing then because it has been explained to you several times...

No, all I have heard are prejudice and hand waving about how a drum break will not suffer the corrosion of a disk brake.

Outweighing such comments are my own personal experience of working on drum brakes and those of many other people who have worked on them.

Drum brakes are hideous things, prone to getting full or water, having poor braking characteristics, corroding and being a total pain. Sure one can argue that it is possible to make drum brakes for less than disk brakes suggesting the only reason for putting a drum brake on is to save a few pennies.

If you can find some quantitative analysis of the ID4 drum brake that shows it is an engineering choice not a penny savers choice then please post.

Regards,

The ID.4 is a RWD electric car designed to be used as a family car.

It has a regen/disk/drum breaking system.

Most of the 'braking' will actually be regen from the drive wheels, eg. the rear wheels.

Most of the actual breaking will be done by the front disks, partly because they are at the front, and partly because on a RWD BEV there is no front end regen assistance.

The rear brakes are there for infrequent use. Drum brakes react better after prolonged periods of inactivity than disk brakes, their infrequent use means that their inferior heat dissipation isn't a disadvantage, and they are both lighter and cheaper than disks. VW use them for the same reason they don't use a frunk because they are a better design choice.

If you are building a car designed to go from 0-60-0 between all 13 sets of lights on the one way system, sure fit disk/disk. This isn't that car.