The Lemon Fool

BobbyD wrote:It's possible, but most the electric busses I've seen have had enough charge to get through the day, although BYD have recently had to install a few wirelss charging points because their busses weren't delivering stated range, but early days etc.

BobbyD wrote:
I'm fairly sure I remember a driver of the new London electric taxi saying in an interview that they hold enough charge to get through the day...

U.S. denies Tesla, GM, Uber 25% Chinese tariff relief

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Trump administration is expanding efforts to block the use of Chinese technology in advanced vehicles, denying additional requests by Tesla Inc for tariff relief on key components of its electric vehicles, and rejecting ride-hailing company Uber’s petition to waive tariffs on electric scooters and at least 50 separate requests by General Motors Co.

After the United States slapped 25 percent tariffs on $50 billion of Chinese imports last year under the two countries’ trade dispute, the U.S. Trade Representative (USTR) allowed companies to petition for exemptions.

Government documents show the USTR rejected requests to exempt Tesla’s Model 3 car computer and center screen in May 29 letters, saying they both concern “a product strategically important or related to ‘Made in China 2025,’ or other Chinese industrial programs.”

In May, Reuters reported that USTR had rejected a separate request by Tesla to exempt the company’s Autopilot “brain” from the tariffs.

odysseus2000 wrote:Trump's tariffs will imho likely lead to more US manufacturing which with automation is likely as low cost as China cost + tariff.

Although many are saying that next president, if not Trump, will reverse these tariffs I doubt it & so I expect more US manufacturing & a reversal of the movement of US jobs to China & elsewhere.

All of this will raise US consumer prices & may set off some product inflation.

Regards,

BobbyD wrote:

odysseus2000 wrote:Trump's tariffs will imho likely lead to more US manufacturing which with automation is likely as low cost as China cost + tariff.

Although many are saying that next president, if not Trump, will reverse these tariffs I doubt it & so I expect more US manufacturing & a reversal of the movement of US jobs to China & elsewhere.

All of this will raise US consumer prices & may set off some product inflation.

Regards,

Even if you are right, and it will no doubt shock you to find out I don't think you are, that doesn't really help Tesla does it?

Short on cash, being increasingly undercut, and seeing their components getting more expensive for the short/medium term...

odysseus2000 wrote:

BobbyD wrote:

odysseus2000 wrote:Trump's tariffs will imho likely lead to more US manufacturing which with automation is likely as low cost as China cost + tariff.

Although many are saying that next president, if not Trump, will reverse these tariffs I doubt it & so I expect more US manufacturing & a reversal of the movement of US jobs to China & elsewhere.

All of this will raise US consumer prices & may set off some product inflation.

Regards,

Even if you are right, and it will no doubt shock you to find out I don't think you are, that doesn't really help Tesla does it?

Short on cash, being increasingly undercut, and seeing their components getting more expensive for the short/medium term...

Tesla have their own, or essentially their own depending on Panasonic/Tesla relationship, battery fab plant in the US & therefore control the source & are non tariff for US batteries, unlike all their competitors, for one of the major costs of a BEV & expect to have similar in China for that market, again unlike many of their competitors.

Currently competitors can't make cars through lack of batteries, the Korean's for example have no ability to deliver their BEV cars till at least next year.

One can read about all the competition, but it is all technically inferior & starved of batteries. Once governments begin to ratchet up taxes on co2 emitting ice engines the revenue stream for legacy auto gets in trouble.

Regards,

BobbyD wrote:

odysseus2000 wrote:

BobbyD wrote:
Even if you are right, and it will no doubt shock you to find out I don't think you are, that doesn't really help Tesla does it?

Short on cash, being increasingly undercut, and seeing their components getting more expensive for the short/medium term...

Tesla have their own, or essentially their own depending on Panasonic/Tesla relationship, battery fab plant in the US & therefore control the source & are non tariff for US batteries, unlike all their competitors, for one of the major costs of a BEV & expect to have similar in China for that market, again unlike many of their competitors.

Currently competitors can't make cars through lack of batteries, the Korean's for example have no ability to deliver their BEV cars till at least next year.

One can read about all the competition, but it is all technically inferior & starved of batteries. Once governments begin to ratchet up taxes on co2 emitting ice engines the revenue stream for legacy auto gets in trouble.

Regards,

Tesla have literally months of cash left in the bank, the immediate impact of 25% tariffs on the 'brain' of their AP, and other computing and display components is hurting them in the here and now.

It's not going to matter how technically inferior the competition is if Tesla doesn't remain solvent...

They opted against American manufacture because it would have set the Model 3 back 18 months. So 18 months and wodges of cash they don't have to rectify, just in time for the Presidential election....

odysseus2000 wrote:

BobbyD wrote:

odysseus2000 wrote:
Tesla have their own, or essentially their own depending on Panasonic/Tesla relationship, battery fab plant in the US & therefore control the source & are non tariff for US batteries, unlike all their competitors, for one of the major costs of a BEV & expect to have similar in China for that market, again unlike many of their competitors.

Currently competitors can't make cars through lack of batteries, the Korean's for example have no ability to deliver their BEV cars till at least next year.

One can read about all the competition, but it is all technically inferior & starved of batteries. Once governments begin to ratchet up taxes on co2 emitting ice engines the revenue stream for legacy auto gets in trouble.

Regards,

Tesla have literally months of cash left in the bank, the immediate impact of 25% tariffs on the 'brain' of their AP, and other computing and display components is hurting them in the here and now.

It's not going to matter how technically inferior the competition is if Tesla doesn't remain solvent...

They opted against American manufacture because it would have set the Model 3 back 18 months. So 18 months and wodges of cash they don't have to rectify, just in time for the Presidential election....

Tesla can raise cash if needed, but if your so confident they can't then short them.

Regards,

BobbyD
You are going a very long way to try to avoid admitting the blatantly obvious, tariffs are bad for Tesla....

Tesla loses key Autopilot engineer to self-driving truck start-up Embark

Tesla Autopilot perception lead Zeljko Popovic is leaving Elon Musk’s car company for Embark, a self-driving trucking start-up.

Popovic managed the development of highly accurate maps of U.S. highways for Tesla, and created a “sensor fusion system” which combines data from the many cameras, radars and ultrasonic sensors that Tesla vehicles employ.

Embark integrates its self-driving systems into Peterbilt semis rather than building its own vehicles completely from scratch, and has delivered packages for Amazon, among others.

odysseus2000 wrote:Imho tariffs that put more money into US workers pockets are good for Tesla.

odysseus2000 wrote:Trump's tariffs will imho likely lead to more US manufacturing which with automation is likely as low cost as China cost + tariff.

redsturgeon wrote:
Very interesting to see some of the close up shots where you can see the paintwork...the orange peel looks awful and I doubt whether most decent car makers would put up with such a bad paint job.

John

BobbyD wrote:

odysseus2000 wrote:Imho tariffs that put more money into US workers pockets are good for Tesla.

odysseus2000 wrote:Trump's tariffs will imho likely lead to more US manufacturing which with automation is likely as low cost as China cost + tariff.

EssDeeAitch wrote:

redsturgeon wrote:
Very interesting to see some of the close up shots where you can see the paintwork...the orange peel looks awful and I doubt whether most decent car makers would put up with such a bad paint job.

John

One shot towards the end of the vid showed what could have been orange peel effect (caused by the presence of silicone) but I am not sure that it was.

I was intimately involved in paintshop management with three manufacturers and know how stringent they are in the prevention of contamination. I have trouble imagining their paintshop team would allow that for one minute. Even in the 90's, orange peel would caused an immediate shut down of operations.

EssDeeAitch wrote:Even in the 90's, orange peel would caused an immediate shut down of operations.

EssDeeAitch wrote:

redsturgeon wrote:
Very interesting to see some of the close up shots where you can see the paintwork...the orange peel looks awful and I doubt whether most decent car makers would put up with such a bad paint job.

John

One shot towards the end of the vid showed what could have been orange peel effect (caused by the presence of silicone) but I am not sure that it was.

I was intimately involved in paintshop management with three manufacturers and know how stringent they are in the prevention of contamination. I have trouble imagining their paintshop team would allow that for one minute. Even in the 90's, orange peel would caused an immediate shut down of operations.