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AI endeavours

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TUK020
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Re: AI endeavours

#108455

Postby TUK020 » January 7th, 2018, 9:58 am

The description from onthemove (another great post by the way) of multiple layers on AI reminds me a lot about the Multiple Drafts theory of Consciousness about how the human brain works. Except the human brain can decide if it needs new layers, and invent them.

It appears that this all means that AI/engineered systems have become much more capable in certain defined activities (eg vision recognition) in recent years.

In addition to self driving cars, what other fields of economic activity will this have a profound transformative effect?

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Re: AI endeavours

#108459

Postby onthemove » January 7th, 2018, 10:06 am

tjh290633 wrote:What happens when two self guided vehicles meet in a narrow lane? Which one backs up to the nearest passing place? What about any other vehicles behind, which may also be self guided?


I suspect a self driving car will probably be far better at reversing than a normal human driver.

I suspect that a self driving car will also be faster at applying the brakes when meeting an oncoming car on a single track lane.

It is then simply a higher level navigation issue as to how to deal with the deadlock.

There are already deadlock detection strategies in computer programming. For example wait a random time, and if the obstruction hasn't moved, then at that point invoke a reverse.

Deciding whether the obstruction is likely to be just another car that wants to pass, or whether it's a permanent obstruction like an accident which means you need to find another route entirely, is probably slightly more challenging - but not insurmountable. Clearly any obstruction where the is width to pass would indicate permanent obstruction. So it should be easy to identify if it is on a narrow lane that might require passing places, etc. Also clearly if as soon as you start reversing, the oncoming car moves closer towards you, it is probably an issue of wanting to pass.

With the deadlock timeout above, it would probably be beneficial for all cars to be autonomous - autonomous cars won't stubbornly dig their heel in and have a stand off demanding the other move back. You are more likely to find a queue of 10 or 20 autonomous cars, all reversing comfortably backwards, than you are to find 10 to 20 human car drivers all willing to reverse together any distance - and having the driving skill for them all to do that without reversing into a hedge!

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Re: AI endeavours

#108468

Postby johnhemming » January 7th, 2018, 11:09 am

TUK020 wrote:The description from onthemove (another great post by the way) of multiple layers on AI reminds me a lot about the Multiple Drafts theory of Consciousness about how the human brain works. Except the human brain can decide if it needs new layers, and invent them.

It appears that this all means that AI/engineered systems have become much more capable in certain defined activities (eg vision recognition) in recent years.

In addition to self driving cars, what other fields of economic activity will this have a profound transformative effect?


Speech recognition is now a lot better. That is already resulting in people buying speech interfaces for their homes (Alexa, Google Home etc). Speech interfaces to computer will have an impact in the call centre area.

Image analysis is already relevant in the medical world and textual analysis is being used in complex legal cases.

In other areas it is more a question of further development of the use of tech rather than AI per se.

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Re: AI endeavours

#108481

Postby onthemove » January 7th, 2018, 11:36 am

odysseus2000 wrote:Hi Onthemove,

Sure computers since their invention have been much faster than humans, the difference now is that at some level they can think or perhaps more correctly mimic thought. That is new.


I'd strongly disagree with that.

In terms of thought, the brute force trying out all paths methods of 'good old fashioned AI', as used in the original chess programs that beat the grandmasters, and that you find in your typical chess computer, are probably actually more akin to 'thinking'. These actually do consider many paths into the future, and evaluate them.

On the other hand, deep learning / convolution networks are (when used e.g. for vision applications) more closely related to the optic nerve and visual cortex. These aren't areas of the brain that would ordinarily be considered as dealing with 'thinking'. Rather they are areas of the brain which perform subconscious / unconscious processing of input data.

I suspect neuroscience has come on a bit since I was at uni, but back then one of our course text books was actually a neuro science book that described the workings of the visual cortex, and the experiments people had done on (live) monkeys to identify what parts of the visual cortex responded to what types of visual stimulus.

The empirical understanding that people have about how deep learning networks are working, is pretty much along the same lines as how it is believed the brain processes visual information from the eye through the optic nerve to the visual cortex at the back of the brain. But all that visual processing is considered to be 'low level' i.e. unconscious - consciously you have no awareness at all about how the brain has processed the information from your eyes. Consciously you just see the reconstructed representation of the objects in the world - much like the reconstructed representation a self driving car has of the cars around it.

Moreover, AI tends to also talk in terms of 'biological plausibility'. This means, for any algorith, or suggested approach to atificial intelligence, how plausible is it that it could be representative / modelling how the brain actually 'thinks'.

And when it comes to deep learning and convolutional neural networks ... ok, the 'deep' aspect is probably more biologically plausible than earlier 'shallow' networks. And the way the network (seems to) build up further an further aspect as you go from the inputs, also matches a lot how the visual cortex, etc, is structured.

But the 'convolutional' aspect which is now used widely in deep learning, at least when applied to vision applications, is a step back from biological plausibility. That's to say there isn't (at least not currently) any plausible explanation of how a 'convolution filter' could be trained in the brain, and then repeatedly applied across the entire visual field.

"...it seems, at least to me, not impossible to believe that many of the managers could before too long be relegated to the role of checking the AI and later to no role at all. I want to believe that AI will be nothing new, that humans will still be needed, but extrapolating forwards I am not so sure."


There is definitely a large fear of the unknown in that position :^)

It is true that some jobs will become redundant. Taxi drivers, HGV drivers, etc, are the most obvious.

But also low paid jobs that basically use the human vision system. For example, sorting rubbish for recycling. That is an incredibly difficult job for old style vision systems to do - that's why it hasn't been properly automated before now. That's why people are paid on the minimum wage to stand there all day identifying and picking particular categories of rubbish and sorting them for recycling.

But in reality, all the person is being employed for is their vision system - their eyes, optic nerve, visual cortex, that is able to classify what they can see on the conveyor in front of them, and their two manipulators (arms) that enable them to pick the identified items off of the conveyor.

That should now be definitely automatable - and with any luck we can go back to stuffing all our rubbish into a single bin and letting the AI sort through it at superhuman speed (the speed of some industrial robots these days is phenomenal - they can look like a blur when moving at full speed! You certainly could react if you had your arm in the way and it suddently started moving)

Fruit picking is another one which the new AI can now enable to be fully automated. The ability to identify fruit on the plant / tree, decide if it is ripe, then coordinate a robot arm to pick it. You could easily imagine such AI guided arms on a rail alongside the grow bags in a massive industrial greenhouse, constantly traversing, looking for the ripe fruit and picking it when found. That is a very real prospect now. There are already companies working on this.

So where jobs are dependent upon the human providing the identification / classification, etc, and / or coordination with a manipulator, there is the likelihood of them being completely taken over by AI and robotics

There will also be a loss of jobs with old style computer vision experts who think that they can demand a high salary and large respect for telling you you need to spend thousands of pounds for a very accurate lighting system to allow you to read barcodes, QCodes, etc, and identify things. We have one such guy where I work. One day the managers are going to twig that they are being spun a nonsense when they realise their £100 phone is able to read any barcode you wave in front of it in any lighting condition, yet this guy tells them they need thousands of pounds worth of highly accurate lighting. He is likely to become a victim of the current AI progress.

However...

In most other areas I genuinely believe that AI will be a partnership. That in actual fact workers will benefit from working with AI. The AI will handle the mundane or difficult stuff while allowing the human workers to be more creative. The AI is just another tool available to the worker. Or something that allows the worker to do their job in a different way.

For example, I believe Microsoft have already demonstrated AI being able to take a sketch and then infer what was being sketched and create a proper representation.... even simple things like when you are having a brainstorming session on a white board. If you use an 'AI enabled' white board, you can scribble a few really crude blocks, and the AI will transform them into proper squares with straight lines. It will read you scribbled text and translate it into proper typed text, which can then, for example, be searched for later. You are still the one providing the creative content. The AI is just making your job easier.

It may even try to do some basic analysis of your diagram so that at a later point you can ask the computer in quite vague terms to "Find you the early diagram for new widget we were developing" and it would then understand what you mean, and allow you to find the diagram even if you never properly organised it into folders, etc, yourself.

There are tools in development that can use AI to quite literally listen to the engine in your car as you drive along, and it is able to tell you various things like if the air filter needs fixing, or if the head gasket is blowing - purely from the sound that you hear in the cabin. In reality, you'll probably still need to take it to a garage to have the work done. So it isn't going to put your garage mechanic out of business. But the garage mechanic may be able to use the AI to help him better diagnose what's wrong.

Similarly in medicine. There are plenty of examples now of AI systems being able to perform diagnoses faster and more reliably that leading specialists in their fields. That will help avoid misdiagnoses. The AI isn't going to do the surgery for them. The surgeon is still needed. He may even be assisted by further real-time computer vision algorithms that real time highlight areas of interest while performing surgery. You could image that the surgeon might even use an augmented reality head setup with AI providing additional analysis of what the surgeon is seeing. But it is unlikely you'd completely get rid of the surgeon... you'd always have to have someone at least supervising any 'automated' surgery.

In video processing, Adobe has created the ability to automatically segment items out and auto-fill the hole that is left. This isn't going to put people out of a job - the artist still needs to decide what bits they want to cut out, etc. It is simply now much quicker and easier for them to do that. But they won't be out of a job. In reality, the lower cost, ease, etc, of doing this editing will simply mean more people can make use of it.

In effect, rather than putting managers out of a job, my gut feeling is that in human terms we are going to see a much higher percentage of 'managerial' jobs. Whereby the 'manager' simply creates and defines tasks for the AI workers under them. I think you'll effectively see a world in future where there are more chiefs than indians - genuinely so because the humans will be providing the coordination and adaption.

"there is a clear separation between them and their less Ai powered competitors such that at some level AI seems to be doing something powerful and new."


The new AI definitely povides something new. It's definitely not something that is going to be here today gone tomorrow. It is already becoming ubiquitous. For example consumer cameras aren't going to lose the capability to identify a face and treat that as the subject.

And using deep learning to spot patterns that people haven't seen is always going to give an advantage if you use it in addition to existing techniques as well.

People who don't use it (directly or indirectly), will definitely be left behind in almost every industry.

It is going to re-structure the economy. It is going to re-structure the jobs market. There's no doubt about that.

But with (e.g.) the NHS stretched for resources, and the majority of people working all hours to earn a living ... I'd say most people would be glad of some more free time.

AI could allow people to produce the same in far less time, providing more time for family and friends while still retaining the same material standard of living.

I guess the question is how this gets handled by society. Should the eperts work 50hour weeks to pay tax, while those who don't bother then take a universal income for doing nothing but enjoying themselves?

Or perhaps instead should we move to a 4 day week, so that the jobs and workload gets shared around, and we all get more leisure time. (France on their 35hr week already manages to produce in 4 days what it takes the brits 5 days to produce, and they have more leisure time)

Or perhaps 3 months statutory holiday per year. Again so that work gets shared around, but we all gain leisure time. I'd happily have more weeks holiday per year!

Or perhaps we could retire at an earlier age.
(Double bad luck though for anyone unfortunate enough not to survive to enjoy that retirement)

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Re: AI endeavours

#108644

Postby odysseus2000 » January 7th, 2018, 9:51 pm

This is a super useful thread and here I am just adding a few points.

The responses that one would need better roads and what would happen if two AI cars met on a one track road, strongly indicate to me that if posters here who are interested in things financials have these ideas, in my humble opinion about as correct as the First War generals who had bayonet charges against machine guns, then most of the population has not got a clue about what this coming AI with robotics revolution will be like.

If you think I am am over-egging it then have a peruse of:

https://waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artifici ... ion-1.html

My fear is that I am under-egging it dramatically.

With regard to Onthemove strongly disagreeing with my ideas that AI can mimic human thought, then yes I was wrong to put it this way for the reasons outlined in the rebuttal. However, for an inventor/entrepreneur the mode of operation is mostly irrelevant, one of these folk wants to know what a technology can do. Something like

Scientist: “This can recognise human faces”

Entrepreneur: “How reliably, how much?”

Scientist: “We estimate reliable enough to work in a million tries and non-id would request pin back up and better than humans and fails on dummies, photographs etc; cost is small.”

Entrepreneur: “Get Market research on how many folk would like face id.”

Market researcher: “Most would.”

Entrepreneur: “Get the production engineers to take this from proto-type to product asap. We can call it the lock with the human face recogniser or maybe human lock, or some daft name dreamt up by some focus product naming group.”

Scientist: “Its not like a human brain.”

Entrepreneur: “It does what a human can do but better, which is all the punters will care about. They couldn’t care less how it works, just that it works and that it is cheap enough.”

The issue of AI that remains to be seen, is not whether folk will accept it, but whether AI will be logical, free of emotion and whether that will work. What do I mean?

If you watch Sci-fi, Dr who for example, most of the writers make a big think about how creatures with out emotion can not beat creatures with emotion. So e.g. the Cybermen & Daleks with their emotion suppression chips always lose to the emotional creatures who find ways to beat the logic of the emotionless opponent.

If we consider car accidents, what % of these are due to human emotion? Having been close to being knocked off my bike by folk not paying attention as they were driving and looking at the accident stats for accidents caused by mobile phone/texting it is clear that if one could take out the human emotion of wanting to answer a text etc and replace it with a machine focused only on driving one stands a good chance of dramatically reducing the number of road traffic accidents. If one adds to this the ability of a machine to see better that a human and react faster then this is another potential accident reducer. Can this emotionless behaviour be applied in many other industries and if it can would it lead to improvements? if you look at the reliability of engines after the wide scale use of CNC (Computer controlled tooling) then they have been dramatically better. where at one time folk could hand make stuff to say 1/1000 of an inch, about 25 micro-meters, now machines will manufacture to 1 micro meter, routinely, day in, day out. Once upon a time 100,000 miles was a huge distance for a car engine, nowadays its trivially reached with the local taxi firm telling me that their cars regularly do 300 to 400,000 miles before being replaced. Can that sort of reliability go into other areas. Could for example robotic surgeons achieve much better results than human ones? Could robotic managers more efficiently run the NHS as it is and or with many AI tools replacing nurses, doctors etc. Would an AI fighter aircraft be able to shoot down human pilots, some research says that AI pilots are better than human ones. Or could one make a thousand AI fighters for the price of training one human pilot. Then what about more complicated tasks. Could AI better run local services than Councils? Or run countries better than politicians? Or is the human emotional element somehow more important than non emotional decision making.

You may argue that humans will never accept being run by AI, just as folk didn’t like Google glass, but we are in an arms race. If US, Russia, China etc are actively developing AI weapons which as far as I can tell they are, then we will either have to assume that these things won’t work or develop them ourselves and that kind of thought will run through every business.

It may never happen, it may happen and we get to live like the Royals, machines doing every thing or we may be about to enter a world where machines become our masters, where human skills are so inferior that AI takes over. Clearly as things now are that is a joke, an impossibility, but the world keeps changing and as far as I can tell we have hardly entered the AI revolution.

Regards,

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Re: AI endeavours

#108674

Postby Itsallaguess » January 8th, 2018, 5:40 am

odysseus2000 wrote:
The responses that one would need better roads and what would happen if two AI cars met on a one track road, strongly indicate to me that if posters here who are interested in things financials have these ideas, in my humble opinion about as correct as the First War generals who had bayonet charges against machine guns, then most of the population has not got a clue about what this coming AI with robotics revolution will be like.

If you think I am am over-egging it then have a peruse of:

https://waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artifici ... ion-1.html


Hi Ody,

Just had a read of the above link, and I've got to be honest that it quickly started to remind me of the Tomorrow's World episode of around 1976, which took me right back, I can tell you....

Wasn't Santa meant to bring me a hover-board by now?

Joking aside, I think there's a great deal of technological merit in discussing this AI aspect, but given that a lot of the drip-down of this type of technology is going to benefit established industries and companies anyway, then I have to ask if this is all too much effort from an investment point of view?

If things are going to get cheaper due to requiring less low-level human-interaction, and they are going to get much more reliable for the same reason, then I'll just keep on investing in a wide range of industries and companies and reap the trickle-down rewards, rather than trying to chase the higher-level tech-companies developing this sort of stuff, many of which will naturally drop by the wayside whilst trying to do so.....

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

* p.s - I hope I didn't wake too many people up in my house after snorting with laughter at the 'Will it be a nice God?' question, leading into section 2 of the above link......

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Re: AI endeavours

#108902

Postby odysseus2000 » January 9th, 2018, 1:05 am

itsallaguess

If things are going to get cheaper due to requiring less low-level human-interaction, and they are going to get much more reliable for the same reason, then I'll just keep on investing in a wide range of industries and companies and reap the trickle-down rewards, rather than trying to chase the higher-level tech-companies developing this sort of stuff, many of which will naturally drop by the wayside whilst trying to do so.....


All depends on what your interests and objectives are.

I watch the markets regularly and I am happy to move in and out and hold small positions that I can afford to lose in volatile stuff that may crash to nothing or give even my small positions a good % gain. As I see this market some areas are like retailing. i.e. you buy what the punters want in small lots and sell if the punters run them up, rinse and repeat. There are opporutunities here but a lot of work and time is needed to profit from them. It is also interesting how Lord Sugar occasionally tweets out how his 50/50 business "Climb on Line" is doing very well compared to all his other ones. How much of that business uses AI I don't know, perhaps none, but it does illustrate the power of targeted advertising and that is where AI seems to be powerful.

There is a lot to be said for holding the main players and letting the benefits of AI filter down to them. The danger with this is that if one major player finds a way to undercut their competitors they could damage what currently seem rock solid business very quickly. We have all seen, e.g. how Aldi & Lidl have hurt the big establish supermarket brands. With AI one is potentially not talking about a lot of capex as Aldi & Lidl have done but small capex producing disproportionate advantages.

its all a guess

Wasn't Santa meant to bring me a hover-board by now?


There is danger in this kind of thinking, extrapolating the failures of the past to the market of today. Sure AI may be hype, may produce no competitive advantages beyond what we see now, but the world is very different to that of "Tomorrow's World." Over on Bert's now deceased Macro-Santuary board I was almost always ridiculed for things like: iPad's, 3D printing, Drones, Musk electric cars, electric storage, Apple's growing moat, but all of these things have mostly happened. True 3D printing has become a commodity business, but additive manufacture as it is called is now more or less essential for all manufacturing business, Drones have not taken off (pun) as I thought they would but still might. It took around 15 years for the potential of clicks to dominate much of retailing and now we have a well developed and fast internet. The next big advances will likely happen much more quickly. We may not get hover boards, but it looks to me like we will get robots in the next few years. How these will impact the existing established business I don't know, but I don't think one can just assume all the big business will simply get bigger. The ones who don't adapt, currently e.g. one business that looks to be not understanding how important AI is appears to be Intel, are likely heading for a Kodak moment.

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Re: AI endeavours

#111133

Postby odysseus2000 » January 16th, 2018, 11:45 pm

This is an interesting movie of the alphago v Lee Sedol games last year:

https://youtu.be/4dGZaLWpQEM

The most interesting thing to me is that Lee Sedol is at the zenith of 2000+ years of human learning of the game, whereas alphago is like a new born child growing daily in power & ability.

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Re: AI endeavours

#111818

Postby odysseus2000 » January 19th, 2018, 10:07 am

Chinese AI, just beating humans, hat tip to Musk for link:

https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/arti ... ssion=true

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Re: AI endeavours

#112507

Postby odysseus2000 » January 22nd, 2018, 11:24 am

I believe this store opens today:

https://mobile.twitter.com/smartertrade ... gr%5Eother

Using AI technology, checkouts & checkout staff are gone. The savings for business if this works reliably will be enormous, but of course for the folk who operates checkouts, & the folk who make the equipment it will be an unhappy development. Winners here will be the AI companies with the cloud resources to make this work & the retailers and while this kind of detailed spending habit data is already available the move to pure smart phone operation is another potential swipe at the traditional print & TV advertisers.

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Re: AI endeavours

#112559

Postby JamesMuenchen » January 22nd, 2018, 1:37 pm

Any thoughts on the iShares Automation & Robotics UCITS ETF
https://www.ishares.com/uk/individual/en/products/284219/?searchText=ISHARES+TECDAX
as a means of cashing-in on AI endeavours?

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Re: AI endeavours

#112574

Postby odysseus2000 » January 22nd, 2018, 2:36 pm

I am not familiar with rbot which is currently not showing on my charting package, so can't comment.

However the ai equity etf is doing well:

http://stockcharts.com/h-sc/ui?s=Aieq

It has not been running for that long, but if it performs as alphago did against Lee Sedol, that will be interesting.

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Re: AI endeavours

#118918

Postby odysseus2000 » February 18th, 2018, 1:47 pm

INTeresting comments by Elon Musk over his concerns about AI, making the point that we are all super human now with respect to our capabilities due to the technology we have access to & that the rate of advancement is growing exponentially both in terms of electronics & students studying AI:

https://youtu.be/elM4jgnHrKU

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Re: AI endeavours

#124177

Postby odysseus2000 » March 12th, 2018, 10:26 am

Interesting comments by Musk on the dangers of AI. The video repeats itself towards the end so no intelligence in its production, but his belief that AI is far more dangerous to the human species than nuclear weapons is interesting:

https://youtu.be/huvBxnVNTww

Musk again calls for regulation of AI, the issue with this is who would go the regulation & how. Sure you can regulate say the development of nuclear weapons by restricting access to e.g. Uranium, but how do you regulate the use of neural networks by a computer/software company & how could one know exactly what folk are doing. The potential for one or a few individual to circumvent any controls or principles of approved objectives or more troubling to control an AI intent on covering its own tracks seems very limited.

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Re: AI endeavours

#124477

Postby JamesMuenchen » March 13th, 2018, 9:51 am

http://www2.bryangarnier.fr/himedia/Consumer_Electronics_%20Show_2018_White_Paper_WEB.pdf
We attended the latest Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in Las Vegas to get a better view of the megatrends affecting the automotive and semiconductor industries, and to see the latest solutions from tech start-ups. In this report, we review the most important innovations in these two tech sectors.

CES 2018 was a record-breaker, especially for the auto and components sectors: This year, over 3,900 exhibitors showcased world-changing technologies. CES is now clearly seen by the auto industry as the best place to unveil and promote innovation as well as new products. Interestingly, the number of auto suppliers attending the fair was up significantly compared with 2017 while the number of carmakers remained stable. This confirms our view that the most high-tech suppliers will tend to gain further share in the entire vehicle value chain, to the detriment of their end customers (carmakers) who are losing market share in the value of the car. Most innovation comes from tech suppliers rather than automakers.

The cockpit of the future: While self-driving technologies and electric cars were the focus of attention at last year’s CES, most of 2018’s auto and parts innovations were focused on the “cockpit of the future” and infotainment solutions to entertain the “driver” during self-driven trips. The race to develop the best ADAS hardware solutions (e.g. radar and Lidar) was also clearly visible. We assume at some point that only two or three players will remain in Lidar tech.

AI on everyone’s lips: For semiconductors, the main topic at the 2018 show was undoubtedly artificial intelligence. We saw numerous initiatives from major players, ranging from Intel to STMicroelectronics, which unveiled its new artificial neural network SoC in 28nm FD-SOI, dedicated to computer vision applications. However, we also saw many start-ups showcasing new AI technologies, from a lightweight voice control assistant to a surprisingly powerful “Brain Processing Unit” from Horizon Robotics that is scaring semiconductor giants. While the larger players flex their muscles, some start-ups really appear to have found the right way first – this is why we believe AI will be a major M&A theme this year. Overall, the current focus on AI tends to be driven by tangible customer applications, which in turn leads us to believe that it has potential to be the next big growth driver.

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Re: AI endeavours

#130479

Postby odysseus2000 » April 6th, 2018, 9:56 pm

This documentary on AI is free to watch till Sunday (hat tip to Elon Musk on Twitter) :

http://doyoutrustthiscomputer.org/watch

I found it remarkably interesting and worth the over an hour viewing time.

My own view is that Artificial Super Intelligence (ASI) is an evolutionary event that will likely lead to human extinction.

As to a time scale, I expect we wake up to it within the next few years. Currently I believe it can not be stopped.

The only escape options I can see are that we take control now, before ASI comes into being, or we interface with the machines, either just at a bandwidth level through brain implants, retaining our human bodies or by being uploaded into the computer and becoming potentially immortal, although easily delete-able.

I am often wrong and hopefully this is one of those cases, but if you watch this movie you will be much better informed and able to reach your own view.

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Re: AI endeavours

#130558

Postby odysseus2000 » April 7th, 2018, 2:21 pm

One of the claims in the movie I linked was that AI lead to the election of Donald Trump & Brexit.

By chance I came across a polarising speech by Mrs. Thatcher on why the EU super state would not work & how she intended to renegotiate several aspects:

https://twitter.com/darrengrimes_/statu ... 45888?s=21

It is kind of interesting to me that Thatcher's speech did nothing whereas the supposed power of AI may have swung the balance to Brexit, but only produced a Brexit by a relatively small margin. If all of this analysis & conjecture is correct one ends up with the well known result that money & resources targeted to a specific result can influence minds.

More interesting from the investor perspective is how effective is AI at selling you something at a better margin. Comparing & contrasting Amazon prices for various stuff I have bought recently to eBay prices I rarely ever buy off Amazon as Ebay is mostly a lot cheaper. If one says this is mitigated by the reduced risk on Amazon, one of my no show buys was on Amazon, the other on eBay, so zero difference in numbers lost & most favourable to ebay as I buy much more off them.

Still the relentless increase in Amazon sales tells me that most folk don't care much about price & the claim that AI now knows more about someone than their Mother & can influence spending may have some validity. If this is true the potential extra duties to be put on Amazon by Trump will have likely no effect.

Regards,

odysseus2000
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Re: AI endeavours

#130817

Postby odysseus2000 » April 8th, 2018, 8:39 pm

Interesting video on US AI military capability:

https://youtu.be/BrNs0M77Pd4

The ability to have wide angle views over a city & still have resolution down to the size of a person along with multiple time periods so that it can determine daily routines is amazing.

The jet powered successor to Predator drones that can fly 2000 miles with kg of weapons, be nearly invisible from below as top cameras photograph the sky & put the image on the underside & the ability to land on a carrier is a remarkable weapon system.

It is not surprising how US defence suppliers like Boeing have been great investments.

Some of the comments reveal how clueless a lot of the commentators are.

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Re: AI endeavours

#131221

Postby odysseus2000 » April 10th, 2018, 3:39 pm

California plans to allow robot cars to transport passengers, but for free as part of testing and move towards legalisation of robot cars:

https://www.engadget.com/2018/04/07/cal ... less-cars/

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Re: AI endeavours

#134021

Postby odysseus2000 » April 23rd, 2018, 7:40 am

The Lord's AI report has been published with the usual self centred publicity as to speed of publishing etc.

My view:

If you want to know the thought process that sent infantry against machine guns in the first World War this is a good start. It first goes over 50 year ago failures of AI, then outlines a future AI world which is available now, then notes how the UK has endlessly failed to capitalise on its research base, but still believes it needs more funding. It worries that bad press may give the public a negative view of AI and notes how predominantly US corporations lead in AI, but believes small UK ones can be effective except they have neither data or funds. It then notes how AI can reduce privacy and suggest legislation before arguing that it is unclear how you legislate for software that creates itself and meanwhile noting how the National Health Service (NHS) has more data than most on all of us but that if made available it should be made nameless before pointing out that AI has been super good at assigning names to such un-named data and then saying the data is not very useful as its mostly on paper that AI can’t read. Are they sure? It dislikes the UK definition of autonomous Weapons that would decide to kill on their own and believes we should standardise with the rest of the world. Adopting international standards would make the weapons safer? Perhaps I have it wrong, but reading this I thought they haven’t a clue. Still they got paid and they are proud of what they have.

Here is the link, so you can make your own study:

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/l ... 00/100.pdf

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