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Crypto Bubble

How to buy, profit and invest in crypto currencies or NFTs
Urbandreamer
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Re: Cryptoscamology

#413222

Postby Urbandreamer » May 19th, 2021, 1:57 pm

absolutezero wrote:
Urbandreamer wrote:
absolutezero wrote:Currencies have value because the State that issued them backs them up.
Commodities have value because they are used for industrial processes.
....
What are crypto currencies backed by? What gives them value?
Other than someone else being (temporarily) willing to pay you more than you paid?


Sure.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuelan_bol%C3%ADvar
2008, devalued
2018. devalued
Does that currency have value because the state backs it?

Excellent. Pick a failed state as an example.
How about Weimar Germany or Zimbabwe next?
Let's use proper countries, thanks.


I take it that you haven't read this book.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/This-Time-Diff ... 0691152640

The problem is FAR more common than you presume. China devalued recently. Italy in 1992. The UK did it in the 60's. Clearly non of them were "proper" countries.

As it happens I do feel that Venezuela, Zimbabwe and China are good examples though not Welmar Germany, Italy or the UK. The difference is that in each of these cases it would not have been too difficult for people to use a cryptocurrency to limit reliance on the state currency. I'm not the one who claimed that state backing gave a currency value. I simply pointed out an example where it clearly wasn't true.

By the way, I'm not sure that many of the examples are "failed states", they still enforce laws.

Greece actually defaulted on it's debt in 2015, clearly another "failed state" and not a "proper country".

There may indeed be many better investments than crypto. Personally I don't own any crypto. That fact however has nothing to do with the "value" of a states currency or for that matter if crypto's are a valid investment.

Itsallaguess
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Re: Cryptoscamology

#413232

Postby Itsallaguess » May 19th, 2021, 2:21 pm

murraypaul wrote:
So now the price of crypto is falling because the price of crypto is falling.


Down another 27% in the last 24 hours, and down 43% in a week.

If it's supposed to be some sort of new-age currency then it must be difficult to plan any purchases with that type of volatility...

https://coinranking.com/coin/bitcoin-btc

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

Bubblesofearth
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Re: Cryptoscamology

#413276

Postby Bubblesofearth » May 19th, 2021, 5:22 pm

Urbandreamer wrote:There may indeed be many better investments than crypto. Personally I don't own any crypto. That fact however has nothing to do with the "value" of a states currency or for that matter if crypto's are a valid investment.


Agreed, believing Bitcoin has value because it has limited supply is a bonkers argument. The value or otherwise of fiat currencies is completely irrelevant.

BoE

dealtn
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Re: Cryptoscamology

#413277

Postby dealtn » May 19th, 2021, 5:23 pm

Itsallaguess wrote:Down another 27% in the last 24 hours, and down 43% in a week.

If it's supposed to be some sort of new-age currency then it must be difficult to plan any purchases with that type of volatility...



And yet I have seen it claimed by some of its advocates as a "store of wealth". Not as defined in my dictionary it isn't.

Itsallaguess
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Re: Cryptoscamology

#413282

Postby Itsallaguess » May 19th, 2021, 5:46 pm

dealtn wrote:
Itsallaguess wrote:
Down another 27% in the last 24 hours, and down 43% in a week.

If it's supposed to be some sort of new-age currency then it must be difficult to plan any purchases with that type of volatility...


And yet I have seen it claimed by some of its advocates as a "store of wealth". Not as defined in my dictionary it isn't.


I mean, I suppose someone might argue that whoever sold when it was 43% higher might have 'stored' some wealth, but I'm not quite sure that's what those advocates might mean when they say that....

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

airbus330
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#413296

Postby airbus330 » May 19th, 2021, 6:35 pm

BTC is up 300% in a year, I doubt that anyone who got in early will be crying much. The late comers to the party might be a bit glum though.. Should have known when Ruffer got out that something was up!

Adamski
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#413335

Postby Adamski » May 19th, 2021, 8:40 pm

Amazed by power of Elon Musk. Today Bitcoin was down 31%, then Elon tweeted Tesla diamond hands, and is bounced back, so was only 10% down in the day. Insane.

On today's drama

"Bitcoin fell 53% in five weeks, and then it rallied 35% in four hours. Two observations for now:
1) Nobody in their rate mind would enter into a transaction denominated in bitcoin
2) It's too early to say the bubble's burst "

GrahamPlatt
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#413342

Postby GrahamPlatt » May 19th, 2021, 8:58 pm

Adamski wrote:Amazed by power of Elon Musk. Today Bitcoin was down 31%, then Elon tweeted Tesla diamond hands, and is bounced back, so was only 10% down in the day. Insane.

On today's drama

"Bitcoin fell 53% in five weeks, and then it rallied 35% in four hours. Two observations for now:
1) Nobody in their rate mind would enter into a transaction denominated in bitcoin
2) It's too early to say the bubble's burst "


HUR rallied 86% today.

StillFedUp
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Re: Cryptoscamology

#414385

Postby StillFedUp » May 23rd, 2021, 1:07 pm

Urbandreamer wrote:The only value that art has is what people attribute. It's certainly backed by nothing. Hence by your argument its "value" (I think that you mean price) depends upon a greater fool.


If there were 21 million identical copies of the Mona Lisa I doubt they would be quite so valuable as the original.

SFU

airbus330
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#414448

Postby airbus330 » May 23rd, 2021, 5:10 pm

airbus330 wrote:BTC is up 300% in a year, I doubt that anyone who got in early will be crying much. The late comers to the party might be a bit glum though.. Should have known when Ruffer got out that something was up!


WRT my earlier comment, I would think that there may well be a few more tears being spilt today than 3 days ago.

1nvest
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Re: Cryptoscamology

#414849

Postby 1nvest » May 25th, 2021, 1:13 am

dealtn wrote:And yet I have seen it claimed by some of its advocates as a "store of wealth". Not as defined in my dictionary it isn't.

A generator of wealth for early adopters - as per any Ponzi. Illegal, but where the state isn't protecting people by enforcing shutting down the fraud. And where in being outside of regulation the likes of Elon can repeatedly pump and dump to their personal gain without redress.

TheMotorcycleBoy
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#415735

Postby TheMotorcycleBoy » May 28th, 2021, 8:53 am

This thread has turned out to be a big disappointment. FWIW I'm actually

1. interested in economics, money and crypto per se,
2. enjoy sensible debate and would like to discuss relative pros and cons of various crypto coins,
4. and do have a small position in one of the crypto miners

However this thread is now just a regurgitation of staid arguments between the protagonists and antagonists continously repeating themselves.

Matt

ursaminortaur
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#415802

Postby ursaminortaur » May 28th, 2021, 11:50 am

TheMotorcycleBoy wrote:This thread has turned out to be a big disappointment. FWIW I'm actually

1. interested in economics, money and crypto per se,
2. enjoy sensible debate and would like to discuss relative pros and cons of various crypto coins,
4. and do have a small position in one of the crypto miners

However this thread is now just a regurgitation of staid arguments between the protagonists and antagonists continously repeating themselves.

Matt


Then why don't you start a new thread on the "relative pros and cons of various crypto coins" ?

absolutezero
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#415826

Postby absolutezero » May 28th, 2021, 1:06 pm

TheMotorcycleBoy wrote:However this thread is now just a regurgitation of staid arguments between the protagonists and antagonists continously repeating themselves.


Welcome to the Internet.

GoSeigen
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#415857

Postby GoSeigen » May 28th, 2021, 2:58 pm

TheMotorcycleBoy wrote:This thread has turned out to be a big disappointment. FWIW I'm actually

1. interested in economics, money and crypto per se,
2. enjoy sensible debate and would like to discuss relative pros and cons of various crypto coins,
4. and do have a small position in one of the crypto miners

However this thread is now just a regurgitation of staid arguments between the protagonists and antagonists continously repeating themselves.

Matt


Perhaps you don't want to listen?

1. crypto is not money so conflating the two is a mistake.
2. there are no pros and cons to debate. crypto is a scam, a pyramid. Amazed that isn't obvious to you yet. I have asked many times what the investment case for bitcoin is and no proponent has ever offered a remotely acceptable answer.
3. is missing...
4. congratulations. You are happily investing in the conversion of high value energy (electricity) into low value energy (heat) earning a return if you're lucky from suckers who will lose everything in this scam. Perhaps you'll be like one of the other earlier winners on this board and send a few quid to a charity after retiring to your beachfront property?

If you can prove me wrong on point 2 I'm all ears.


GS

DiamondEcho
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#415954

Postby DiamondEcho » May 28th, 2021, 10:35 pm

Snorvey wrote:It might be a temporary store of value. Just long enough for it to get it across the border, seal the big coke deal and get it switched back into traditional assets again.


Yah man, I agree with Snortey^ ;;

NotSure
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#416218

Postby NotSure » May 30th, 2021, 12:34 pm

TheMotorcycleBoy wrote:This thread has turned out to be a big disappointment. FWIW I'm actually

1. interested in economics, money and crypto per se,
2. enjoy sensible debate and would like to discuss relative pros and cons of various crypto coins,
4. and do have a small position in one of the crypto miners

However this thread is now just a regurgitation of staid arguments between the protagonists and antagonists continously repeating themselves.

Matt


This thread is a merge of 'cyptobubble' and 'cryptoscamology', so maybe not likely to contain 'sensible' debate on the points you raise....

I too am interested in the pro and cons of various tokens, but not sure where to post. I can see utility in some of the 'ecosystems' that have been developed, but to me, the tokens are just tokens, not investments.

However, I'll start a thread on this board and we can see what happens.

p.s. what happened to 3? :)

TheMotorcycleBoy
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#416239

Postby TheMotorcycleBoy » May 30th, 2021, 3:11 pm

NotSure wrote:p.s. what happened to 3? :)

Hi NS,

Sorry - I was typing in a hurry! I'd only intended to write 3 points. I rarely post to TLF these days. I appreciate we can consider down and upsides to any investment. I only wrote my post really as an epitaph to this thread, which seemingly only serves as an echo chamber for antagonists.

I'm still keen to post infrequently, on other topics but not on crypto. There several other topics, where TLF also have a lack of any positive energy. Software and Tech is another one. I posted this 4 weeks ago:

viewtopic.php?f=93&t=29243

about a huge, very interesting firm. And hardly anyone bit. I'm curious about any other decent forums, may try this

http://www.traderslaboratory.com/

some time.

Matt

cockamamiephe
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#425403

Postby cockamamiephe » July 7th, 2021, 3:08 am

Cryptocurrency is our future. I think in near future there won,t be any kind of money in our hands. Everything will be virtually like cryptocurrency. :)

ursaminortaur
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Re: Crypto Bubble

#425466

Postby ursaminortaur » July 7th, 2021, 10:35 am

cockamamiephe wrote:Cryptocurrency is our future. I think in near future there won,t be any kind of money in our hands. Everything will be virtually like cryptocurrency. :)


Most transactions are already carried out virtually/digitally. Every few years the government floats the idea that they will get rid of cash and cheques in the near future but then is forced to rollback on the idea. That doesn't though mean that those virtual/digital transactions will switch to using cryptocurrencies rather than continuing to use the current government backed currencies.


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