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Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

The home for all non-political Coronavirus (Covid-19) discussions on The Lemon Fool
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This is the home for all non-political Coronavirus (Covid-19) discussions on The Lemon Fool
scotia
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Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593785

Postby scotia » June 7th, 2023, 10:14 pm

The Covid Spring 2023 Booster program in Scotland seems to being operated in a different manner to that in England, and I have found it near impossible to determine which vaccines are being used. Starting from https://www.nhsinform.scot/spring-coronavirus-covid-19-booster/
I seem to be led around in circles without receiving definite information. I checked up my vaccination record for my March 2023 Booster and found it was listed as Moderna Spikevax. This is strange - My Autumn Booster was Moderna Spikevax Bivalent - which includes the original vaccine plus one targeted on Omicron. Surely they have not jumped back to the original Spikevax which does not include the Omicron component - or is it just sloppy record-keeping, and it actually was a bivalent version.
Are there any other Elderly Scots out there who have received the Spring Booster - and do they know which version was used?

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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593814

Postby Julian » June 8th, 2023, 8:44 am

I suppose another possibility is that Moderna, maybe after running down stocks of the original vaccine, has now discontinued its monovalent booster so, if it is now the case that all doses are bivalent, it might have dropped the Spikevax vs Spikevax bivalent terminology and is simply calling its latest bivalent vaccine Spikevax if that's the only one now being used.

If true then that does seem a bit confusing that the name no longer indicates whether it was mono or bivalent that someone got. I suppose the counters to that concern would be (1) the batch numbers are there to look up the exact formulation that any given recipient got and (2) the terminology "Spikevax bivalent" wasn't good enough (not future proof) anyway since if Moderna tweaked one or both of the strains in some future Spikevax variant what would it then call that one - "Spikevax differently bivalent"? - so one probably does end up needing to look at batch numbers for the ultimate reading on what's in it.

Does your record include the batch number? If yes then I wonder if there is a publicly accessible tool, maybe on Moderna's site, to enter a batch number and get to a document describing the exact details probably the PIL (Pationt Instruction Leaflet) and maybe also the SPC (Summary of Product Characteristics which is a more technical document aimed at medical professionals rather than patients). Also shouldn't you have been given a patient information leaflet when you got the booster? That is a tightly controlled and regulated document that has a what's-in-it section that should confirm what you were given. Admittedly those sorts of pieces of paper stuffed into one's hands in a busy clinic during a brief consultation can all too easily be misplaced.

- Julian

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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593820

Postby Dod101 » June 8th, 2023, 9:00 am

scotia wrote:The Covid Spring 2023 Booster program in Scotland seems to being operated in a different manner to that in England, and I have found it near impossible to determine which vaccines are being used. Starting from https://www.nhsinform.scot/spring-coronavirus-covid-19-booster/
I seem to be led around in circles without receiving definite information. I checked up my vaccination record for my March 2023 Booster and found it was listed as Moderna Spikevax. This is strange - My Autumn Booster was Moderna Spikevax Bivalent - which includes the original vaccine plus one targeted on Omicron. Surely they have not jumped back to the original Spikevax which does not include the Omicron component - or is it just sloppy record-keeping, and it actually was a bivalent version.
Are there any other Elderly Scots out there who have received the Spring Booster - and do they know which version was used?


I am an elderly Scot these days and I had my spring booster on 23 May. They told me it was a Pfizer one. What is the problem? Why did you not aske at the time?

Dod

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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593824

Postby XFool » June 8th, 2023, 9:24 am

Julian wrote:Also shouldn't you have been given a patient information leaflet when you got the booster? That is a tightly controlled and regulated document that has a what's-in-it section that should confirm what you were given. Admittedly those sorts of pieces of paper stuffed into one's hands in a busy clinic during a brief consultation can all too easily be misplaced.

Here in England, I wasn't given any paperwork with my Spring Booster vaccination. I see from my medical records online that it was the Sanofi one.

https://www.gavi.org/vaccineswork/sanofi-vaccine-what-know-about-protein-based-covid-booster-being-offered-uk

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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593826

Postby monabri » June 8th, 2023, 9:31 am

From the UK Government site.
Edit..smallprint says ' applies to England '...I doubt if there's a special Scottish variant ;)

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... his-spring

"You will be given a booster dose of a vaccine made by Pfizer, Moderna or Sanofi and approved in the UK. These vaccines have been updated since the original vaccines and target different COVID-19 variants. For a very small number of people another vaccine product may be advised by your doctor.

These updated vaccines boost protection well, and give slightly higher levels of antibody against the more recent strains of COVID-19 (Omicron) than the vaccines you would have received previously.'

scotia
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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593827

Postby scotia » June 8th, 2023, 9:38 am

Dod101 wrote:
scotia wrote:The Covid Spring 2023 Booster program in Scotland seems to being operated in a different manner to that in England, and I have found it near impossible to determine which vaccines are being used. Starting from https://www.nhsinform.scot/spring-coronavirus-covid-19-booster/
I seem to be led around in circles without receiving definite information. I checked up my vaccination record for my March 2023 Booster and found it was listed as Moderna Spikevax. This is strange - My Autumn Booster was Moderna Spikevax Bivalent - which includes the original vaccine plus one targeted on Omicron. Surely they have not jumped back to the original Spikevax which does not include the Omicron component - or is it just sloppy record-keeping, and it actually was a bivalent version.
Are there any other Elderly Scots out there who have received the Spring Booster - and do they know which version was used?


I am an elderly Scot these days and I had my spring booster on 23 May. They told me it was a Pfizer one. What is the problem? Why did you not aske at the time?

Dod

But which Pfizer one was it? There is the original Pfizer vaccine which is based on the original Wuhan genetic sequence. This was also effective against the Alpha, Beta and Delta variants, but was much less effective against Omicron. Hence for the Autumn 2022 Booster they produced Pfizer "bivalent" which included the original vaccine plus one targeted at Omicron BA.1. For the Spring 2023 Booster they produced Pfizer bivalent mark 2 which included the original vaccine plus one targeted on Omicron BA.4-5 variants. The same is true for the Moderna vaccines. So in my vaccination record, the Autumn 2022 vaccine is noted as Moderna bivalent. But in my Spring 2023 record it is simply marked as Moderna - no mention of bivalent. The same is true of my wife's record. I would hope that this is simply sloppy record keeping - but if it is accurate, then my Spring 2023 booster is largely ineffective against the Omicron variants.
Have you looked at your NHS Inform Covid Vaccination record?

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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593828

Postby monabri » June 8th, 2023, 9:39 am

I'd hazard a guess it will be one from the following list....with 'added Omicron' protection.

https://www.nhsinform.scot/covid-19-vac ... oronavirus
Image


Just lie back and think of Eng....err Scotland ;)

scotia
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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593832

Postby scotia » June 8th, 2023, 9:57 am

monabri wrote:From the UK Government site.
Edit..smallprint says ' applies to England '...I doubt if there's a special Scottish variant ;)

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... his-spring

"You will be given a booster dose of a vaccine made by Pfizer, Moderna or Sanofi and approved in the UK. These vaccines have been updated since the original vaccines and target different COVID-19 variants. For a very small number of people another vaccine product may be advised by your doctor.

These updated vaccines boost protection well, and give slightly higher levels of antibody against the more recent strains of COVID-19 (Omicron) than the vaccines you would have received previously.'

Yes - I was fully aware of the document which you quote - but it is specific to what is being used in England. Under the Devolution agreement the NHS in Scotland is effectively a separate organisation, run by the Scottish Government, which in many healthcare areas makes quite different choices to those made in England by the Westminster Government. For details of healthcare in Scotland, go to NHS Inform at https://www.nhsinform.scot. I could not find any detail at this site on what vaccines will be used for the Spring Boosters - apart from some vague statement that they would be chosen to be "suitable".

scotia
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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593836

Postby scotia » June 8th, 2023, 10:10 am

monabri wrote:I'd hazard a guess it will be one from the following list....with 'added Omicron' protection.

https://www.nhsinform.scot/covid-19-vac ... oronavirus
Image


Just lie back and think of Eng....err Scotland ;)


Yes - I think this is probably the closest that the Scottish NHS Inform site gets to indicating which vaccines are to be used, by simply listing manufacturer leaflets. So I probably received the "Spikevax bivalent Original/Omicron BA.4-5"
And it is simply sloppy record keeping which misses out any mention of the bivalent for the Spring 2023 booster in my Covid record file.
Interesting that there is no mention of the Sanofi vaccine which seems to be a choice for the elderly in England.
Many thanks for your detective work.

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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593838

Postby Dod101 » June 8th, 2023, 10:19 am

scotia wrote:
Dod101 wrote:
I am an elderly Scot these days and I had my spring booster on 23 May. They told me it was a Pfizer one. What is the problem? Why did you not aske at the time?

Dod

But which Pfizer one was it? There is the original Pfizer vaccine which is based on the original Wuhan genetic sequence. This was also effective against the Alpha, Beta and Delta variants, but was much less effective against Omicron. Hence for the Autumn 2022 Booster they produced Pfizer "bivalent" which included the original vaccine plus one targeted at Omicron BA.1. For the Spring 2023 Booster they produced Pfizer bivalent mark 2 which included the original vaccine plus one targeted on Omicron BA.4-5 variants. The same is true for the Moderna vaccines. So in my vaccination record, the Autumn 2022 vaccine is noted as Moderna bivalent. But in my Spring 2023 record it is simply marked as Moderna - no mention of bivalent. The same is true of my wife's record. I would hope that this is simply sloppy record keeping - but if it is accurate, then my Spring 2023 booster is largely ineffective against the Omicron variants.
Have you looked at your NHS Inform Covid Vaccination record?


Sorry. As you were. I have for the first time, looked up my record on the NHS Scotland site. It tells me that on 23 May 2023, I had the Biontech Comirnaty vaccine, the same one as I had in April 2022. The Autumn booster was a Moderna one.

I really do not pay any attention to this sort of thing as it all means nothing to me.

Dod

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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593851

Postby scotia » June 8th, 2023, 11:03 am

Dod101 wrote:
Sorry. As you were. I have for the first time, looked up my record on the NHS Scotland site. It tells me that on 23 May 2023, I had the Biontech Comirnaty vaccine, the same one as I had in April 2022. The Autumn booster was a Moderna one.

I really do not pay any attention to this sort of thing as it all means nothing to me.

Dod

Interesting. I suspect the Pfizer Comirnaty vaccine you received in April 22 was the original Pfizer vaccine. I suspect in Autumn 2022 you received the Pfizer Comirnaty bivalent vaccine (or the Moderna Spikevax bivalent) which included protection from Omicron BA.1 - and the word "bivalent" was probably included in the vaccine name on your record. However it now appears that the word "bivalent" has been dropped out of the wording in your ( and my) record for the Spring 2023 vaccination - although it almost certainly is a bivalent vaccine with protection for Omicron.
I you are interested in the full designations - see the note on Manufacturer Leaflets which were discovered by monabri
posting.php?mode=quote&f=98&t=39426&p=593838#pr593828

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Re: Covid Spring 2023 Booster in Scotland

#593871

Postby scotia » June 8th, 2023, 12:00 pm

Julian wrote:I suppose another possibility is that Moderna, maybe after running down stocks of the original vaccine, has now discontinued its monovalent booster so, if it is now the case that all doses are bivalent, it might have dropped the Spikevax vs Spikevax bivalent terminology and is simply calling its latest bivalent vaccine Spikevax if that's the only one now being used.

That's possibly the case

Does your record include the batch number?

I'm afraid not - here is the record for my recent Booster

Manufacturer Moderna Biotech Spain S.L.
Vaccine medicinal product Spikevax
Vaccine/Prophylaxis SARS-CoV-2 mRNA vaccine
Country of vaccination Scotland

It seems likely (from the Manufacturer Leaflet list which was discovered by monabri) that it was
Spikevax bivalent Original/Omicron BA.4-5
I find it difficult to understand why they simply did not include this detail in my vaccination record


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