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People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

Genealogy, Local, General
Slarti
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People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#186362

Postby Slarti » December 12th, 2018, 12:50 pm

The money users pay for these tests is the smallest part of the tester's business model.

https://www.businessinsider.com/dna-tes ... &r=US&IR=T


Slarti

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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#186483

Postby XFool » December 12th, 2018, 9:47 pm

And another reason is: "What do the results actually mean?"

I am afraid I can't give accurate details but, after hearing a discussion on a R4 science programme, the answer appears to be: "Not quite what the people who pay for them think."

In general terms people think: "It's all about ME!"

Reality is yes, in the sense that it tells you various genes you have are common in this or that given population. Interesting-ish, but doesn't necessarily tell you as much as you like to think it does about you...

kempiejon
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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#186535

Postby kempiejon » December 13th, 2018, 9:50 am

Who would willingly give up their DNA to anyone? It's a privacy and safety issue to. I have been reading https://www.amazon.co.uk/Brief-History- ... 0297609378 by Dr Adam Rutherford, a R4 presenter and he is uncomplimentary about testing.

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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#187287

Postby stevensfo » December 16th, 2018, 6:02 pm

kempiejon wrote:Who would willingly give up their DNA to anyone? It's a privacy and safety issue to. I have been reading https://www.amazon.co.uk/Brief-History- ... 0297609378 by Dr Adam Rutherford, a R4 presenter and he is uncomplimentary about testing.


I've just had a look at the 23and Me website and the list of diseases and genetic traits listed is indeed impressive, and I can see why big pharma companies would be interested.

However, I think that concerns about privacy may be exaggerated. You simply buy the kit, then send the spit back for analysis, for which they simply need a name and address. There is no mention of other data such as DOB, which 'would' send alarm bells ringing, and to be honest, if anyone's worried, they can just make a small alteration in the way their name is spelt, get it paid for by someone else, sent to another address..etc..etc. I've done this before. :-)

I find the privacy concerns and computer trails left by debit cards and store loyalty cards far more worrying than this.

Steve

PS Of course there is always the chance that someone will leave your DNA sample at the scene of a crime. ;)

Slarti
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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#187291

Postby Slarti » December 16th, 2018, 6:17 pm

stevensfo wrote:I find the privacy concerns and computer trails left by debit cards and store loyalty cards far more worrying than this.

Steve

PS Of course there is always the chance that someone will leave your DNA sample at the scene of a crime. ;)



Or that life/health insurance firms will start asking if you've ever had a DNA test and then demanding access to it to decide if they're going to cover you.

Possibly other types of insurance also? Markers for possible dementia, no motor/household insurance?

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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#187309

Postby stevensfo » December 16th, 2018, 7:52 pm

Slarti wrote:
stevensfo wrote:I find the privacy concerns and computer trails left by debit cards and store loyalty cards far more worrying than this.

Steve

PS Of course there is always the chance that someone will leave your DNA sample at the scene of a crime. ;)



Or that life/health insurance firms will start asking if you've ever had a DNA test and then demanding access to it to decide if they're going to cover you.

Possibly other types of insurance also? Markers for possible dementia, no motor/household insurance?

Slarti


Asking someone 'Have you ever had a DNA test?' is a bit like asking 'Have you ever gone to the Doctor?' It means absolutely nothing without more specific questioning. DNA is very easy to extract from cells and when you precipitate with alcohol at a low pH, the DNA looks like pieces of cotton wool. That's a simple DNA test. "Yes sir, you do have DNA!" :-) Not all the tests are as detailed as others. The Ancestry DNA test is relatively simple.

Where you could get caught is 'Have you ever been asked by the police to have a DNA test?' which is quite different.

I haven't heard of any insurance companies asking for the results of tests totally unconnected with a policy. But I can imagine that they could insist on such tests to be performed at a clinic when you're having the medical check-up for that policy.

If it were me, I'd just the dog to spit in a tube for me. Low premiums and they pay for someone to take me walkies. :-)

Steve

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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#187494

Postby Slarti » December 17th, 2018, 4:39 pm

stevensfo wrote:Asking someone 'Have you ever had a DNA test?' is a bit like asking 'Have you ever gone to the Doctor?' It means absolutely nothing without more specific questioning.


The follow up question, if you say yes, is "Who with and what is your reference number?"
Then they contact that company who will have done all the tests known at the time of your donation, so as to sell on that data. They're really not that interested in where people came from.

Slarti

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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#187498

Postby chas49 » December 17th, 2018, 5:06 pm

Slarti wrote:
stevensfo wrote:Asking someone 'Have you ever had a DNA test?' is a bit like asking 'Have you ever gone to the Doctor?' It means absolutely nothing without more specific questioning.


The follow up question, if you say yes, is "Who with and what is your reference number?"
Then they contact that company who will have done all the tests known at the time of your donation, so as to sell on that data. They're really not that interested in where people came from.

Slarti


But the testing company don't have your permission to disclose your personal data do they? So they would fall foul of GDPR. Unless you tick the box without reading the T&Cs of course.

(N.B. By "you" I mean a foolish person rather than a reader of this board! - and not actually "you")

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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#187505

Postby Slarti » December 17th, 2018, 5:31 pm

chas49 wrote:But the testing company don't have your permission to disclose your personal data do they? So they would fall foul of GDPR. Unless you tick the box without reading the T&Cs of course.

(N.B. By "you" I mean a foolish person rather than a reader of this board! - and not actually "you")


I think that they are all American companies doing this at the moment and will be playing fast and loose with GDPR.
But the insurance companies will insist on you giving permission, if you've had a DNA test done.

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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#187524

Postby stevensfo » December 17th, 2018, 6:31 pm

Slarti wrote:
chas49 wrote:But the testing company don't have your permission to disclose your personal data do they? So they would fall foul of GDPR. Unless you tick the box without reading the T&Cs of course.

(N.B. By "you" I mean a foolish person rather than a reader of this board! - and not actually "you")


I think that they are all American companies doing this at the moment and will be playing fast and loose with GDPR.
But the insurance companies will insist on you giving permission, if you've had a DNA test done.

Slarti


If a DNA test is performed in a European hospital, that lab will be accredited. Instrument calibration reports, staff training certificates, statistical analyses of data.

If you send your sample to the USA, unless done in a genuine hospital lab, I doubt that the results would be accepted. How were the samples delivered? How long? What temperature? What sort of packaging? What sort of instruments, repeatability of results, a recognised quality system in place. accreditation etc. What controls do they use to avoid false positives? The pipettes used in aliquoting samples become contaminated very easily.

I think that these online tests are just gimmicks. I'm sure that somewhere in the T&C you'll read that they take no responsibility... etc.

So I can't see this happening, though as I said, they may still ask you for a simple test in a UK hospital or clinic when you do your check-up for the insurance.

But as true LBLYM, TLF and ex-TMF guys, couldn't we use it to our advantage? Send a few scrapings from an Egyptian mummy and confess you're a 60 Rothmans a day man but only after your daily bottle of vodka. That should get the premiums down to 1p or thereabouts. :-)

Steve


Steve

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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#187968

Postby bungeejumper » December 19th, 2018, 10:35 am

stevensfo wrote:If it were me, I'd just the dog to spit in a tube for me. Low premiums and they pay for someone to take me walkies. :-)

Oh great. So back comes the report. Your grandfather was your grandmother's brother, you have a good coat of body hair, you need to cut back urgently on your red meat consumption, and you're within five years of your projected life expectancy. And by the way, you're pregnant. :?

BJ

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Re: People wonder why I won't have a DNA test

#188312

Postby Slarti » December 20th, 2018, 12:50 pm

And another reason why not to do them https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-46600325

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