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Alkaline diet -

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brightncheerful
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Alkaline diet -

#60571

Postby brightncheerful » June 16th, 2017, 2:19 pm

On TMF, I posted my approach to losing weight based on my body shape; basically not needing as much carbohydrate for energy as others might. Well, it worked until the comfort-eating returned and by Christmas last my weight had reverted to over-weight.

To cut a long story, Mrs Bnc has (for her health-reasons) been a strict alkaline diet since 1 January 2017 and has now lost so much weight that she's exceeded the target weight loss that her 'normal' eating means of dieting used to achieve before she started on this path and is now down to a level that she was at in her 20s without any adverse side-effects. Yours truly has also been on the same diet but as not as strict and having lost more than half-a-stone in weight since January I have experienced so many changes for the better that I wish I'd known about the alkaline diet years ago. Mrs Bnc too although she would like her health to return to the stage where she would have the choice is also enthusiastic about the benefits of having moved on. In the meantime, our local food bank has benefited from our clearing out several boxes of grocery items that would otherwise have gone to waste.

The word 'diet' having been commandeered by the slimming industry and nowadays popularly associated with weight loss, I think it essential to remember that it really means the kind of food that a person eats habitually. As a habitual wholefood organic vegetarian, I am perhaps most of the way there which is why I've been able to understand and apply the principles immediately but where my habitual diet was going wrong was in including foods that were over acidic so far as my body is concerned.

Arguably the alkaline diet should be called the 'alkaline-forming diet' because it's not what the food might be before eaten but when it forms acid or alkaline the moment it goes into a person's mouth where the digestive process starts. (Thinking of one's mouth as the opening to the stomach and chewing all food into a liquid slurry before swallowing is a useful way to remember what you can to reduce dependence for processing on the stomach alone.) If you're unfamiliar with the concept - and I forgive myself for my limited knowledge of biology - then basically the body's natural pH balance is slightly alkaline so it makes sense to eat food that is more alkaline-forming in the body so it digested more easily, unlike acid-forming food which takes longer and is harder to digest. The ideal food ratio is 80% alkaline, 20% acid, and typically 70/20% but the typical Western diet is 70% acid, 30% alkaline. 100% extreme either way is not recommended: some acidity is necessary.

There is a limit to the amount of food that the stomach acid can process in one go so whilst the food is queuing to be processed, the fat is stored in the body, and nutrients and constituents are distributed via the blood stream etc around the body. The acidity especially finds its way into the connective tissues between joints and muscles, etc. Generally, inflammation, aches and pains are symptomatic of too much acid build-up in the connective tissues. So by reducing the acidity-forming foods, the surplus fat is converted into energy, and acidity can shift from the connective issues and elsewhere.

Amongst the changes I have experienced are no comfort eating, healthier skin tone, less eye strain, etc. My trouser bely notch test is excellent: at the start of the year the belt on my trousers felt tight at the first notch. Now, I have to pull the belt past the fifth notch before it feels tight. I am also 50% stronger as measured by the weights I can lift at the gym. Actually i do not think I am 50% strong: but what's happened is that the acidity build-up in the connective tissues between the muscles was impeding the flow of energy between the muscles. The muscular strength was there already but it was effort to access it. I am also now able to lift slightly heavier weights than before.

There's a lot of information on line about the alkaline diet but I'd recommend (no connection at all) -

FX Mayr Health Centre in Austria -http://www.original-mayr.com/en/fx-mayr-health-cure-at-lake-woerth.html - which contains a lot of useful info including a free mailing list. Also: "The alkaline cure" by Dr Stephan Domenig (of FX Mayr health centre) is a good book; he and Heinz Erlacher, chef at FX, have written two cookbooks as well - (1) "The Alkaline Cookbook". 100 recipes arranged by seasons; (2) aline Juices & Smoothies" 75 recipes

http://www.energiseforlife.com/list_of_alkaline_foods

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkaline_diet


Bnc

AleisterCrowley
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Re: Alkaline diet -

#60574

Postby AleisterCrowley » June 16th, 2017, 2:39 pm

Isn't a normal stomach strongly acid though ? About 5% hydrochloric acid IIRC
I vaguely recall the agents involved in digestion need an acid environment to work correctly, and would assume alkaline ingestion would be balanced out by some sort of homeostasis to maintain acidity
(Failed A level biology in 1985....)

ReformedCharacter
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Re: Alkaline diet -

#60580

Postby ReformedCharacter » June 16th, 2017, 3:06 pm

Thanks for an interesting post. I have an interest in diet too but I am extremely averse to pseudo-science or quackery both of which seem to hover around the commercialisation of food and diets like flies around a dung heap.

Of the three links you post, Wikipedia states:

'The idea that these diets can materially affect blood pH for the purpose of treating a range of diseases is not supported by scientific research and makes incorrect assumptions about how alkaline diets function that are contrary to human physiology.'

The other two links appear (from only a brief look) to have services to sell in the diet and wellbeing sector and thus cannot, in my view, be trusted as reliable sources.

Having said that, I'm very pleased to hear that both you and your wife have found improvements to your health. However, I would suggest that this is due to a healthier diet rather than the alkalinity\acidity that the diet purports to provide. No doubt in my opinion that most of us in the developed world eat unhealthily and eventually suffer the consequences but I remain unconvinced about the alkaline diet theory.

RC

brightncheerful
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Re: Alkaline diet -

#60581

Postby brightncheerful » June 16th, 2017, 3:18 pm

The other two links appear (from only a brief look) to have services to sell in the diet and wellbeing sector and thus cannot, in my view, be trusted as reliable sources.


Science the new religion. Whose beliefs include avoid people thinking for themselves, let alone conduct their own research.

The FX Mayr Centre is run by medical doctors.

Origins here: http://www.original-mayr.com/en/history-fx-mayr.html

Science info here http://www.original-mayr.com/en/enzymes-mitochondria.html

brightncheerful
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Re: Alkaline diet -

#60583

Postby brightncheerful » June 16th, 2017, 3:25 pm

AleisterCrowley wrote:Isn't a normal stomach strongly acid though ? About 5% hydrochloric acid IIRC


Try this?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3195546/

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Re: Alkaline diet -

#60589

Postby ReformedCharacter » June 16th, 2017, 3:44 pm

brightncheerful wrote:
The other two links appear (from only a brief look) to have services to sell in the diet and wellbeing sector and thus cannot, in my view, be trusted as reliable sources.


Science the new religion. Whose beliefs include avoid people thinking for themselves, let alone conduct their own research.

I prefer science to the alternatives and don't apologise for that. In fact science continues to reveal much about the consequences of diet on health. A case in point is the effect of gut bacteria on health and wellbeing which was until recently almost completely ignored or unknown.

As to your point about people conducting their own research, I agree and have been doing exactly that for over 35 years.

brightncheerful wrote:The FX Mayr Centre is run by medical doctors.

Origins here: http://www.original-mayr.com/en/history-fx-mayr.html

Science info here http://www.original-mayr.com/en/enzymes-mitochondria.html


Even the most cursory Internet search on almost any health related subject will provide results advocated by 'medical doctors' however implausible and unlikely. Unfortunately the fact that a theory is advocated by a medical doctor provides little guarantee of veracity. Andrew Wakefield?

And you can find plenty of 'medical doctors' who claim new insights to cancer cures, Alzheimers etc. Most have vested interests (£/$) such as those who work for the Mayr Centre.

Despite my scepticism I am pleased that you have found a diet that improves your health - but as I said I suspect it has nothing to do with alkalinity.

RC

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Re: Alkaline diet -

#60591

Postby ReformedCharacter » June 16th, 2017, 3:57 pm

brightncheerful wrote:
AleisterCrowley wrote:Isn't a normal stomach strongly acid though ? About 5% hydrochloric acid IIRC


Try this?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3195546/

Some excerpts:

'There may be some value in considering an alkaline diet in reducing morbidity and mortality from chronic diseases and further studies are warranted in this area of medicine.'

'However, this may not be reflective of being on an alkaline or acid diet throughout this time.'

'However, a recent systematic review of the literature looking for evidence supporting the alkaline diet for bone health found no protective role of dietary acid load in osteoporosis '

'There is no scientific literature establishing the benefit of an alkaline diet for the prevention of cancer at this time'

The article does suggest that a diet that contains adequate minerals and fruit and vegetables is a good thing but we've known that for a long time.

If the scientific evidence in favour of an 'alkaline diet' becomes evident then I will happily change my view but I've been reading about it more or less over the last couple of decades and I remain a sceptic.

RC

brightncheerful
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Re: Alkaline diet -

#60622

Postby brightncheerful » June 16th, 2017, 6:05 pm

I remain a sceptic. RC


I am not trying or wanting to impose. It's entirely up to you or anyone else reading the op, etc whether the alkaline diet makes sense for them and worth having a go at. Yours truly, an organic wholefood vegetation for more 33 years, has been eating mostly vegetables, fruit, and tofu, and occasional cheese and other standard fare But I also snacked on high acid-forming so called heath foods which meant that my weight has fluctuated enormously.

Mrs Bnc not such a purist as me went on the strict a/d because after within minutes of drinking a small glass of freshly-squeezed clementine juice that I had made for her she got blisters on the inside of her mouth and the benign hiatus hernia that she's kept under control for years flared up and resulted in severed acid reflux that needed prescription drugs every day for a month to relieve, combined with and ever since ongoing a/d. As a direct result of that experience, she has become hypersensitive to a host of products, skin creams, etc that until that clementine day she had no problem with.

Yours truly has also experienced the benefit of a a/d which might to the sceptic be simply some internal realisation of a need to finally give up on the high acid-formming foods but I reckon there is more to it than that. Which is is why regardless of any scientific evidence I continue to research, including a project I am currently working on and which I think Ive found the answer to, namely why it is easier to think negatively, rather than positively.

Anyway, I have a test for the sceptical:

Are in you in good health?
On any medication?
Visits to the doctor in the last few years (except for overseas travel vaccination and such.

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Re: Alkaline diet -

#60630

Postby ReformedCharacter » June 16th, 2017, 6:39 pm

brightncheerful wrote:
I remain a sceptic. RC


Anyway, I have a test for the sceptical:

Are in you in good health?
On any medication?
Visits to the doctor in the last few years (except for overseas travel vaccination and such.


Although I'm sceptical of the alkaline theory we probably have a fairly similar diet and share an interest in diet on health.

Anyway, to answer your questions - as my monicker suggests, I have not always looked after my health very well, but:

Yes, pretty good health. BMI 23, I weigh about half a stone lighter than I did 30 years ago and have more muscle mass. I no longer drink or smoke. Cholesterol recently tested and described by the doc as 'very good'. Blood pressure good for my age. I do a fair bit of physical work and take the odd anti-inflammatory (NSAID) for aches and pains, otherwise no regular medication.

Good luck with your diet :)

Since you've mentioned it, can I ask why it easier to think negatively rather than positively?

RC

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Re: Alkaline diet -

#60784

Postby redsturgeon » June 17th, 2017, 1:53 pm

Anyway, I have a test for the sceptical:

Are in you in good health?
On any medication?
Visits to the doctor in the last few years (except for overseas travel vaccination and such.


I am sceptical but if it works for you then that's fine by me.
I am in good health.
On no medication...never have been.
No visits to the doctor in 15 years for anything other than check ups.
I am 61, BMI under 25. I can do 50 press ups and run 5km in under 30 mins.
I follow the 5-2 diet.
On my "5" days I feel happy to eat and drink as much or little as a feel like.
I eat a varied diet including meat, cheese and fatty fried food.
I drink alcohol, sometimes to excess, I don't and never have smoked.
When people try to guess my age they never put me at more than 50.
I claim no credit for any of this...that goes to my parents (both in their mid 80s) for passing on their genes.

John


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