Smart meters

[didds]

It was merely an idle thought. Though I would be surprised if somebody somewhere didn't want to suppress the signals because the government would use it to send messages to their subconscious brain. prob'ly.

didds

[gryffron]

should you choose such a tariff you'd probably want it to work for you.

And should you choose not to comply with smart metering, I predict a future where you'll be charged the highest possible tariff for all your usage, plus a surcharge for manual meter reading. Which rather answers didds question of why you wouldn't block the radio signal.

Gryff

[swill453]

a surcharge for manual meter reading

So going off at a slight tangent, do smart meters actually get manually read/checked any less than dumb meters?

In my experience, for quite a long time the providers have relied on customer-provided readings or estimates for the majority of the time, with someone visiting maybe every couple of years to make sure things are not completely out of whack. And this visit has been justified by the providers as a "safety" check (though in reality probably just checking you're not bypassing the meter with a big cable and crocodile clips).

In my last house I had a smart meter for the last couple of years, and still had one of these visits. So the smart meter might give them more accurate and up-to-date readings, but do they actually visit any less?

Scott.

[gryffron]

do smart meters actually get manually read/checked any less than dumb meters?

I don't know. If the reader is there anyway for the neighbours, it costs very little to check. I would expect meter readers to become increasingly rare as smart meters become universal. But it doesn't actually matter, does it? Even if smart meters are manually checked regardless, they could still charge extra for manual reading of people who refuse to have them.

On a practical note. There is a street or block meter, which reads the total for an area. These are routinely checked against the sum of individual house readings to make sure no-one is stealing power by by-passing their meter. That happens now. I presume that could be used to trigger manual checks in an area if the sums didn't add up. Provided it does add up, no need to manually check anything.

Gryff

[modellingman]

a surcharge for manual meter reading

So going off at a slight tangent, do smart meters actually get manually read/checked any less than dumb meters?

In my experience, for quite a long time the providers have relied on customer-provided readings or estimates for the majority of the time, with someone visiting maybe every couple of years to make sure things are not completely out of whack. And this visit has been justified by the providers as a "safety" check (though in reality probably just checking you're not bypassing the meter with a big cable and crocodile clips).

In my last house I had a smart meter for the last couple of years, and still had one of these visits. So the smart meter might give them more accurate and up-to-date readings, but do they actually visit any less?

Scott.

The standard licence conditions for electricity supply did previously contain an obligation to manually visit a domestic meter every two years. In 2015 OFGEM ran a consultation (pdf) which proposed either increasing the frequency to five years or abolishing the obligation entirely. The recommendation in the consultation was for abolition. This appears to have now been implemented. The obligation was previously found in Licence Conditions 12.14-12.16 of the Standard conditions of electricity supply licence. These conditions are now shown as "not used" in the current version (pdf).

[mike]

... The recommendation in the consultation was for abolition. This appears to have now been implemented.

Well that explains why after I switched to my current supplier in Feb 2015, I still have not had a meter reading visit. I am dual fuel, non-smart meters although the elec is digital rather than a spinning wheel.

[csearle]

We used to call that "Economy 7". Useful for the grid, but only a minority of consumers.

We still do call it Economy 7.

I agree it will be a minority but there an awful lot of people still using some form of night storage with E7.

Regards,
Chris

[Infrasonic]

Its my underststanding that smart meters work off of some sort of mobile phone signal or similar "radio" signal.. ?

There must be places where such signals etc are unreachable/untenable.

If one wrapped the unit in tin foil would that block the signals ?

didds (thinking sideways cos that's how my brain works!)

I actually had that issue with my house rental, which despite being in a major town has very patchy mobile signal and the 'smart' meter wasn't having its readings consistently read automatically. It was pinged once a month according to EON, but was less than 50% successful. So I insisted the letting agent do manual readings on tenancy out and ins to stop me being stuck with the differences.

The other issue with the initial MK1 meters was they were supposed to be 'interoperable' across all the suppliers but in reality this never happened, so legislation got introduced to force the issue. I think the deadline is 2020 or 21 for all meters to be fully compatible for all suppliers.

The Mk2 meters are supposed to have more flexibility on communications, mobile and/or wifi (maybe proprietary only...) and have full interoperability for suppliers (in theory). Let's see what happens in practise. There's very little incentive for the big energy players to help the little ones, especially as they are way cheaper currently...

[production100]

There must be places where such signals etc are unreachable/untenable.

Our village for a start. We have a 'smart meter'. When they phoned to say they were installing one we told them it would not work - no mobile signal. They eventually understood and put it off. A week or so later they phone again. Same response. A week later they phoned again - we are installing a smart meter. Having told them twice I let them go ahead.


Man arrives, installs meter, does not work. He says I have installed lots of these in this village. None of them work. I told him that I had told them it would not work...

They have not had one reading from the 'smart meter' - which we call a dumb meter - in several months.

We have now changed supplier so it would probably not work anyway.

Chris