Smart Meters - E.on says I have to have one

[Fluke]

Since renewing my tariff with E.on I've been receiving letters telling me that I "agreed" to have a smart meter put in and can I please tell them when would be convenient. I agreed to no such thing but no doubt legally I did if it was somewhere in the small print on an inaccessible Ts&Cs page somewhere on their website.

My energy usage is low and my bills perfectly manageable, it seems that the disadvantages of not really knowing what can go wrong or what my data might be used for outweigh any possible advantages.

a) Am I legally obliged to have it done?
b) Anyone got one, are they any good?
c) Am I just making a fuss about nothing, should I just bow to the inevitable?

Thanks.

[staffordian]

Not sure quite how relevent this is, but if you look at Martin Lewis's cheap energy club tariff comparisons, the following appears in the tariff details box for Eon's offering:

Tariff info: E.on will contact you about having smart meters (one for gas, one for elec) installed. However, it has told us you can refuse them and remain on this tariff. Smart meters are free and send automatic meter readings, so you should get exact bills and pay only for what you use.

[Laughton]

No, you are not making a fuss about nothing.

I'm sure that I've read that in the event that you have a smart meter and later change supplier that the smart meter won't work as intended with the new supplier so you'll be back to providing meter readings yourself again. Besides, how much trouble is it providing readings one a month (or however often required).

How many people actually change their usage habits long term once a smart meter has been installed? Over time we only pay for what we use anyway.

[Arborbridge]

I am quite cynical about smart meters, and have always refused the offer of one. AFAIK there is no legal reason to have one, and every time I ask an electricity company to give me a compelling reason, there isn't one.
Well, except that they say it will give me a "more accurate" bill. They never seem to know whether this is because there is some inherent systematic error in my existing meter so I am being charged for energy I haven't used, or do they simply mean it is an up to date reading.

If the latter, who cares? since I read the meter myself once a month an put the reading on line - and even that I would say is overkill. And who pays for the energy which must be used to ping off a reading every few seconds?

The other bizarre reason why I should have one, I'm told, is that it will avoid me going on my hands and knees to read the meters - in fact I don't have to anyway.

As for the supposed energy saving - I would say it's rubbish, a pure nine day wonder. I doubt there will be any data coming out which demonstrates convincingly that the consumer "body" has saved any money whatsoever.

And as for changing supplier, it is said that the second generation will allow this, but I've heard of cases in which a second gen meter has supposedly been installed but in fact a first gen one was actually fitted.

The are still (I believe) changes in the wind, and even were I interested, I wouldn't have one fitted for several years until the whole farce has been played out.

Arb.

PS I have the same feeling about cavity wall insulation. There's a good reason why walls have cavities and to fill them up is asking for trouble. I wouldn't have it done until I was compelled to by law.

[didds]

No, you are not making a fuss about nothing.

I'm sure that I've read that in the event that you have a smart meter and later change supplier that the smart meter won't work as intended with the new supplier so you'll be back to providing meter readings yourself again. Besides, how much trouble is it providing readings one a month (or however often required).

How many people actually change their usage habits long term once a smart meter has been installed? Over time we only pay for what we use anyway.

AIUI 1st gen smartmeters had the "swap providers" issue. 2nd gen ones shoud traverse changes of supplier.

Ive no direct expereince of either.

Again AIUI newly provided meters should ALL be 2nd gen. Allegedly.

Providers/suppliers are under pressure from central govt to push for switches as the govt made some pledge about X% of households having them by year Y - there may even be finnacial penbalties for suppliers that do not conform (I may well be wrong about that, if only because if person P never changes meter and swaps every 6 months who gets fined - all of them?).

I fully agree with the changing habits comments.

didds

[todthedog]

An interesting film on smart meters from the USA.

The video is 'take back your power'

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... your+power

The French took to the streets to protest against intrusion into privacy.


On a similar track I have just read that Brussels has halted the roll out of 5G due to fears of health risks.

The environment minister looking after the environment.

"I cannot welcome such technology if the radiation standards, which must protect the citizen, are not respected, 5G or not," Environment minister Céline Fremault (CDH) told Brussels Times. "The people of Brussels are not guinea pigs whose health I can sell at a profit. We cannot leave anything to doubt," she added

[tango2082]

If it helps, EON also told me I'd agreed to have one installed when I switched to them earlier in the year, and sent me a text asking when it was convenient to install. I completely ignored it - for no other reason than I forgot to reply, and that was the last I heard about it. That was at least 6 months ago!

So if you don't want one, just ignore them!

Regards
Tango

[Fluke]

Great! That's really helpful. It's annoying that they keep sending letters, they have my email address and phone, the last one was in the manner of an overdue bill, all red with the word 'Reminder' across the top. There are no obvious advantages (to me) and quite a few potential disadvantages, so if it ain't broke I ain't gonna fix it just so they can achieve some government imposed target. My main concern was whether I'd inadvertently signed up for one and couldn't get out of it, but if they want to call me or provide me with an email address I'll happily explain why I don't want one and neither did I "agree" to having one.

Thanks.

[quelquod]

Realistically the only thing they could do is move you onto a worse tariff on the basis that you’ve broken the agreement on the current one. You could then go elsewhere which likely isn’t what they want. I ignore the smart meter communications I get, I suggest you do too.

[Lanark]

The other thing you can do is surround the meter with some doubled up tin foil or sheet metal - that will prevent it from getting a mobile phone signal and dialling home.

[UncleEbenezer]

I'm sure that I've read that in the event that you have a smart meter and later change supplier that the smart meter won't work as intended with the new supplier

How long ago did you hear that? Some stories just refuse to die.

I'm not aware of any actual benefits to consumers from smart meters. But on the anti-side there's a lot of complete nonsense, much of which has surfaced on this very thread. Your story (unlike some of them) was at least once true in the UK - though not in countries with more sensible regimes.

[richlist]

Isn't the advantage for consumers of having a smart meter :
* Don't have to read the meters and send the readings to the supplier.
* Accurate bills that reflect usage instead of either estimated or monthly flat rate.

Smart meters can be a fit and forget event.......Once fitted the consumer needs to do absolutely nothing.

[PrefInvestor]

Hi All, Well,everything I have read on this issue (including from OFGEM) says that you are quite within your rights to refuse to have a smart meter installed, see link below:-

https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/consumers/hous ... our-rights

Where they work well they provide useful information, accurate meter readings and bills. But unfortunately that situation is far from universally the case and many people find that the smart meter that they get does not work properly and some (like a neighbour of mine) say that it is useless. And once you have one going back to where you were can prove very difficult if not impossible, or so I’ve read.

If you provide accurate and timely meter readings to your supplier then your bills should be accurate, a smart meter merely automates that process and saves the supplier having to send people out just to read meters. Information on usage which you get with get with a smart meter might be useful to some people, but not if you don’t use it to reduce your consumption and hence reduce your bills.

As you are probably aware the government has given energy companies targets with a view to trying to rollout smart meters to everyone as soon as possible. The energy companies have noted consumer resistance to having smart meters installed and are starting to introduce new cheaper tariffs that you can only get on if you have (or agree to have ?) a smart meter installed. In the end then unless you are prepared to pay not to hsve a smart meter (and stay on a more expensive tariff) then you are probably going to end up with one.

Right now I am resisting having a smart meter as I have solar panels installed as I have read of many cases where people have had major problems with having a smart meter installed when you have solar panels. You absolutely MUST have to have a SMETS2 meter AND the meter needs to properly connected to your household solar installation AND the meter needs to be specially configured to correctly deal with the power exported to the grid - to avoid you being incorrectly charged for the electricity you are exporting. I’m not happy to trust someone coming from the supplier who likely will have no knowledge of these issues to come and install a smart meter in my house as I do not want to run the risk of it all going wrong and having no easy way to fix it (especially if, as has been reported, you might end up much higher bills because of the incorrect measurement of power exported to the grid).

But at some point In the future I expect to come under pressure to have a smart meter when the only tariffs you can apply for without a smart meter become significantly more expensive than those for smart meter customers.....not the case yet though.

ATB

Pref

[SPURLEY]

I am not sure if this is correct , but for none payment of bill for energy usage the supplier in the extreme would send an engineer to cut off your supply . A costly exercise . However , if you have a mart meter , they simply cut you off remotely . No need for engineer . Plus I suppose , as it constantly monitors your usage , you will eventually pay a higher tariff when using the most. So for me until I have no choice , I wont have one .

[swill453]

I am not sure if this is correct , but for none payment of bill for energy usage the supplier in the extreme would send an engineer to cut off your supply . A costly exercise . However , if you have a mart meter , they simply cut you off remotely . No need for engineer .

That may or may not be true, but there are a lot of protections in place before anyone's supply can be cut off.

Plus I suppose , as it constantly monitors your usage , you will eventually pay a higher tariff when using the most.

That's pure speculation, with no evidence of things going that way as yet.

Scott.

[mutantpoodle]

i agree with Scott...they allready do this in a small way with 'economy 7' ie slightly cheaper night rate as useage is lower
of course not all bother with it as the saving is so small

**

we all know the target was for all homes fitted 'free' by 2020 amd that failed miserably...i wonder why!! target is now moved to 2024

my question is, when this latest target fails as it surely will, the government will not admit its a failed plan so they will extend again???

at some point it become compulsory and no longer free??

[Arborbridge]

I'm sure that I've read that in the event that you have a smart meter and later change supplier that the smart meter won't work as intended with the new supplier

How long ago did you hear that? Some stories just refuse to die.

I'm not aware of any actual benefits to consumers from smart meters. But on the anti-side there's a lot of complete nonsense, much of which has surfaced on this very thread. Your story (unlike some of them) was at least once true in the UK - though not in countries with more sensible regimes.

Maybe you don't listen to Money Box - or read troubleshooting letters in Newsoaoers. Certainly within the past year people have complained about 1st Gen meters stills being fitted, and on occasions fitted even though the supplier claimed to be fitting a gen 2 meter. It isn't complete nonsense, and since companies are being given a great push to fit these things, one can see there's an incentive to cut corners and do so by hook or by crook.

As you rightly say, there are few benefits, and a consumer might well judge they are not worth it at the moment: better to let the system bed in before changing.

Arb.

[Arborbridge]

Isn't the advantage for consumers of having a smart meter :
* Don't have to read the meters and send the readings to the supplier.
* Accurate bills that reflect usage instead of either estimated or monthly flat rate.

Smart meters can be a fit and forget event.......Once fitted the consumer needs to do absolutely nothing.

You might think those are advantages, but I don't think they are worth the possible disadvantage of the system not working properly on switching. And where does the energy come from to send continuous unnecessary meter readings? Someone has to pay for that, and I suspect it would be me.

Once a month is good enough, and I'm quite happy to do it. The bills are therefore accurate and when I update my account online it supercedes any estimated amount automatically (an estimate only occurs if I am away or do not report a reading for a few months - even then the difference between the estimate and reality eventually revelaed is usually peanuts). If I decide I'd like to change the fixed monthly amount, I can do that easily enough. My current system works perfectly smoothly and is satisfactory - I see no reason to change it.

In my view, the whole adventure was/is an expensive farce and waste of money.

Arb.

[UncleEbenezer]

I'm sure that I've read that in the event that you have a smart meter and later change supplier that the smart meter won't work as intended with the new supplier

How long ago did you hear that? Some stories just refuse to die.

I'm not aware of any actual benefits to consumers from smart meters. But on the anti-side there's a lot of complete nonsense, much of which has surfaced on this very thread. Your story (unlike some of them) was at least once true in the UK - though not in countries with more sensible regimes.

Maybe you don't listen to Money Box - or read troubleshooting letters in Newsoaoers. Certainly within the past year people have complained about 1st Gen meters stills being fitted,
Arb.

FWIW, 1st gen meters (insofar as that means anything) are not in themselves the problem. The trouble we had in Blighty was not the technology itself, but the bizarre rules affecting its deployment here. More informed comment at http://itreallyisupsidedown.blogspot.co ... -mkay.html

[Arborbridge]

More informed comment at http://itreallyisupsidedown.blogspot.co ... -mkay.html

I'll admit that much of the information is anecdotal, and why should we believe any of it - including the link you've given?
However, on balance, given the clear uncertainty and the lack of advantage in changing, I don't see the need to get involved in changing my meter - and will not do so until I'm happy the system has bedded down, and/or the change is made compulsory, and/or there is a real financial incentive to do so.

Arb.