smart ,meters and faraday cages

[didds]

If person X forced into having a smart meter (only way to get a cheaper deal etc?) created in effect a faraday cage around the smart meter - wouldn't that render said meter inoperable ie cant send or recive any messages?

(This isnt a serious proposition - I am just intrigued and it may be useful for a short story one day!)

[XFool]

If person X forced into having a smart meter (only way to get a cheaper deal etc?) created in effect a faraday cage around the smart meter - wouldn't that render said meter inoperable ie cant send or recive any messages?

Presumably yes. It might need to be earthed. Might cause 'issues' if engineer came around to investigate.

[didds]

extending the fantasy ...

what right to enter do such engineers have ? (assuming said meter was internal)

who does the meter actually belong to? it presumably cant be the electricity supplier/company cos if you change suppliers the dumped ones dont come and take "their"meter back ?

[servodude]

If person X forced into having a smart meter (only way to get a cheaper deal etc?) created in effect a faraday cage around the smart meter - wouldn't that render said meter inoperable ie cant send or recive any messages?

Presumably yes. It might need to be earthed. Might cause 'issues' if engineer came around to investigate.

There's likely going to be radiated emissions on the cables that necessarily go in and out of the Faraday cage
- so while you can suppress the stuff directly radiated you might need some decent ferrite chokes also

[csearle]

who does the meter actually belong to? it presumably cant be the electricity supplier/company cos if you change suppliers the dumped ones dont come and take "their"meter back ?

Funny you should mention that. My eldest works for one of seven (I believe) companies (his ultimately owned by an Australian bank) that owns all installed gas and electricity meters in the UK and leases them to energy providers.

When you switch, the new company has to rent it (or a new one). My son is occasionally active here on TLF so I will encourage him to give you a better answer.

C.

[Redmires]

I've often thought the same thing about blocking smart meter transmissions (purely theoretical of course). I came to the conclusion that wrapping the meter in tin foil could have the desired effect, assuming no bare wires are present

[csearle]

I've often thought the same thing about blocking smart meter transmissions (purely theoretical of course). I came to the conclusion that wrapping the meter in tin foil could have the desired effect, assuming no bare wires are present

You might need to Earth your tin foil otherwise it could just pick up the signal inside and act like an aerial.

At the Faraday cage the voltage field is zero along the plane of the metal (or mesh) but the signal current can still flow in it, and then cause re-radiation outside of the cage. By Earthing the cage I believe it shorts all to Earth so disrupting also the signal current flows to the extent that nothing escapes. This is more intuition on my part than actual knowledge though. C.

[WrongLicence388]

who does the meter actually belong to? it presumably cant be the electricity supplier/company cos if you change suppliers the dumped ones dont come and take "their"meter back ?

Most of the Gas & Electricity meters in the UK are owned by MAPs (Meter Asset Providers). These are companies backed by investment banks who pay for the cost of the asset and often the cost of the installation and then lease them back to the energy suppliers over the (usually lengthy) life of the asset. If the customer churns between energy suppliers the MAP will then rent to the incoming supplier instead.

C.

[gryffron]

I know an elderly couple who live out in the sticks where there is no mobile signal. Their energy company still fitted a smartmeter, even though it cannot work, and they were told it would not work before fitting it! Govt targets are govt targets. I think they still send manual readings. Though I did wonder if the Leccy company could just park a van with a mini phone-cell in the middle of the village for half an hour?

Though note the meters do other things as well as report by phone. Such as measure net energy out for "Smart Export Guarantee", or become prepayment meters.

Also, some tariffs are conditional on having a "working" smart meter. So to answer the OPs question, it is possible the tariff could be cancelled if you block the signal. (Breach of contract terms)

Gryff

[XFool]

I know an elderly couple who live out in the sticks where there is no mobile signal. Their energy company still fitted a smartmeter, even though it cannot work, and they were told it would not work before fitting it! Govt targets are govt targets. I think they still send manual readings. Though I did wonder if the Leccy company could just park a van with a mini phone-cell in the middle of the village for half an hour?

Indeed.

Where I am we were told - rather a long time ago now - that our water meters (I still don't have a meter) were being converted to smart meters. My understanding (possibly wrong) was that these would be short range 'drive by' meters. Whether this is still the case I do not know.

[servodude]

I know an elderly couple who live out in the sticks where there is no mobile signal. Their energy company still fitted a smartmeter, even though it cannot work, and they were told it would not work before fitting it! Govt targets are govt targets. I think they still send manual readings. Though I did wonder if the Leccy company could just park a van with a mini phone-cell in the middle of the village for half an hour?

Indeed.

Where I am we were told - rather a long time ago now - that our water meters (I still don't have a meter) were being converted to smart meters. My understanding (possibly wrong) was that these would be short range 'drive by' meters. Whether this is still the case I do not know.

There's smart meters and there's smart meters.

In the worst case scenario you read a smart meters the same way you read a dumb one - and you might be able to read more from it when you do.

[didds]

Also, some tariffs are conditional on having a "working" smart meter. So to answer the OPs question, it is possible the tariff could be cancelled if you block the signal. (Breach of contract terms)

Gryff

yeah that was taken as read TBH.

Though coming back to your couple in a village with no signal etc would that have meant they also couldnt have the cheper tarriff even though the lack of working smart meter was nothing they could affect ?

[gryffron]

Though coming back to your couple in a village with no signal etc would that have meant they also couldnt have the cheper tarriff even though the lack of working smart meter was nothing they could affect ?

Almost certainly yes. Another cost of country life.

And likely to become a bigger problem as "dynamic" charging tariffs become more a popular means to manage demand.

Gryff

[AF62]

If person X forced into having a smart meter (only way to get a cheaper deal etc?) created in effect a faraday cage around the smart meter - wouldn't that render said meter inoperable ie cant send or recive any messages?

No idea, but perhaps you could ask the ‘tin foil hat’ customers buying this company’s products - https://emfessentials.com/ (and there are plenty of other companies selling similar!).

[XFool]

There's smart meters and there's smart meters.

In the worst case scenario you read a smart meters the same way you read a dumb one - and you might be able to read more from it when you do.

I first encountered a smart(?) meter when a friend moved into a new flat, she asked for my help with her electricity smart meter.
There was no manual, there were no instructions. I looked it up online. There was still no manual or instructions! But some dude on some website had managed to cobble together information from somewhere, which I used to make up a sheet of instruction which I gave her (Hah!). I pushed various buttons and read the meter - golly! It was like bootstrapping a 1960s mainframe computer...

Smart or not smart, user friendly it wasn't!

[DrFfybes]

Where I am we were told - rather a long time ago now - that our water meters (I still don't have a meter) were being converted to smart meters. My understanding (possibly wrong) was that these would be short range 'drive by' meters. Whether this is still the case I do not know.

There's smart meters and there's smart meters.

In the worst case scenario you read a smart meters the same way you read a dumb one - and you might be able to read more from it when you do.

Our water meter was converted last year - we see the chap come up the drive and set off across the lawn waving his reader trying to find it at the edge of the garden where the pipe comes in through the woods behind. Sadly the 'smart' adapter sits on top of the meter so you can't actually see the numbers of spinning indicator any more.

Paul

[servodude]

Where I am we were told - rather a long time ago now - that our water meters (I still don't have a meter) were being converted to smart meters. My understanding (possibly wrong) was that these would be short range 'drive by' meters. Whether this is still the case I do not know.

There's smart meters and there's smart meters.

In the worst case scenario you read a smart meters the same way you read a dumb one - and you might be able to read more from it when you do.

Our water meter was converted last year - we see the chap come up the drive and set off across the lawn waving his reader trying to find it at the edge of the garden where the pipe comes in through the woods behind. Sadly the 'smart' adapter sits on top of the meter so you can't actually see the numbers of spinning indicator any more.

Paul

True, and I've seen dumb meters rendered inaccessible with similar muppetry . Even if you try to make something idiot proof we've been breeding better idiots for generations.

[XFool]

I was caught off guard this morning while on the phone...

The 'gas man' came to the door with a clip board (been evading them for years!) and I reluctantly agreed to an appointment to have 'new meters' installed - if you know what I mean.

Just now a though occurred to me: I am with British Gas and on quarterly billing (with no DDs).

Will it be possible to continue with this arrangement if the smart things are installed? If not I will have to be 'out' whenever they call...

[madhatter]

Just now a though occurred to me: I am with British Gas and on quarterly billing (with no DDs).

Will it be possible to continue with this arrangement if the smart things are installed? If not I will have to be 'out' whenever they call...

I am also with British Gas on quarterly billing, and it continued unchanged after the installation.

[XFool]

...That's good to hear, thanks.

I did ask online via Chat and they said the same thing, but I was still having doubts.