Study finds Vitamin D reduces Covid deaths by 60%

[Bouleversee]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/health/medica ... d=msedgntp

I wonder how much they gave them and whether they tested everyone's Vit D level on admission.

I don't think the 400iu per day the NHS recommends and has given clinically highly vulnerable people will cut the mustard.

Edit: I also wonder how many care home residents take Vitamin D. Interestingly, a study at some English university found there was no connection between Vitamin D and Covid which I found surprising, though without checking I can't be sure whether that was just related to preventing catching the virus which would seem a rather narrow brief as being able to cope with and survive it is just as important.

[UncleEbenezer]

Some of the meeja were reporting on this right back in the early days, though that was probably speculation.

Research funding will've been plentiful. It has a bearing not just on seasonality, but on politically-sensitive issues like correlation with skin colour.

[Mike4]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/health/medical/study-finds-vitamin-d-reduces-covid-deaths-by-60/ar-BB1dEOBZ?ocid=msedgntp

I wonder how much they gave them and whether they tested everyone's Vit D level on admission.

I don't think the 400iu per day the NHS recommends and has given clinically highly vulnerable people will cut the mustard.

Edit: I also wonder how many care home residents take Vitamin D. Interestingly, a study at some English university found there was no connection between Vitamin D and Covid which I found surprising, though without checking I can't be sure whether that was just related to preventing catching the virus which would seem a rather narrow brief as being able to cope with and survive it is just as important.

Did you see Dr John's video yesterday on the Spanish Vitamin D study?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYK9-zv ... hnCampbell

[Bouleversee]

No, I didn't. Thanks for the link. Will have a look now.

[Lanark]

532 ug on day one and 266 ug on day 3, 7, 15, and 30
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm ... id=3771318

532 ug is about 22,000 IU

I should be surprised that this isn't getting more publicity, but then vitamin D is cheap and generic so nobody is writing press releases about it.

[Bouleversee]

I watched Dr John's video, which was more informative than the article. I also watched another one about his own tests. It will be interesting to see whether the lab result differs from the one at home which gave an instant result which he found surprisingly low after having taken 3000 iu a day for much of this winter. Is that result still awaited?

One of them listed various other illnesses thought to be caused by Vit D deficiency. I was surprised that the list didn't include lung diseases which Johns Hopkins Uni., Baltimore, said was connected with the deficiency though they didn't know which was cause and which effect. I feel pretty sure my IPF was caused by a serious deficiency but the research of the Prof. I referred to earlier thought it was the other way round. Whichever, I think Dr John is absolutely right that it would save a hell of a lot of illness and money if levels were monitored and treated as necessary before irreversible damage occurs. As he said, the cost is nothing compared with the horrendous cost of treatments which in many cases only give people a bit longer but don't cure and are often proscribed by NICE because of the high price and we've known for a long time about the effects on the immune system etc. so why don't they do it?

[GrahamPlatt]

I’ve been taking 800iu D3 (Fultium) per day for most of the past 12 months. Levels measured last month showed me to be still deficient, so I’ve doubled up.

[Adamski]

I thought for a good while fresh air and sunshine (vit D) can curb covid19. And for immunity and overall health. We (UK) spend too much time indoors. Add ageing population and health conditions. But easier psychologically to put blame the government

[Mike4]

I’ve been taking 800iu D3 (Fultium) per day for most of the past 12 months. Levels measured last month showed me to be still deficient, so I’ve doubled up.

I've been taking 5,000iu per day since March last year. ISTR Dr Fauci said in an interview recently he takes the same. I can't imagine why he is not making more of a fuss about Vitamin D.

In addition I've fixed boilers for perhaps half a dozen hospital doctors in the last year and every single one has said they too take a large dose daily. The doc I fixed about a month ago said it is just as important to take a high dose of Vit C too but it doesn't get the same publicity. He takes 1 gram per day, and so do I now. 1g chewable tabs from Boots.

[AsleepInYorkshire]

I thought for a good while fresh air and sunshine (vit D) can curb covid19. And for immunity and overall health. We (UK) spend too much time indoors. Add ageing population and health conditions. But easier psychologically to put blame the government

Vitamin D3 is as big a problem for those who live in Florida as it is the UK. However, that may have changed in recent years. I have taken 5,000 iu's of D3 since March 2014. I recall when I told my GP she said that much could harm me. I'm still here, albeit I have reduced to 3,000 iu's very recently when it has become apparent that most of my lethargy and fatigue problems were probably more to do with a "secondary" sleep condition and three food "intolerances".

I think I'm in recovery. But I have some weight to lose and a routine to re-establish.

I digress. I cannot recall where I read the information I'm about to trawl out. It was some time ago during a time when I was barely awake. The Canadians have been aware for many years about "cabin fever". The modern term is SAD (Seasonal Affective Disorder). I think during the 90's and 00's they generally felt that the underlying cause could be a lack of vitamin D3 as they have short dark days during winter. The Canadian researchers decided to speak to their counterparts in Florida to find some like for like figures on levels of vitamin D3 an occurrences of depression.

And what they found out was surprising. Florida had lower average levels of D3 and higher rates of depression. Which completely stuffed the Canadians theory that low sunlight was causing D3 deficiency and subsequent levels of SAD/depression. So the Canadian teams gathered around the meeting table. During the meeting an unknown young researcher suggested that vitamin D3 might only be made certain times of the day and that the residents of Florida were not outside at that time. The suggestion was greeted with laughter. After the meeting one senior member of the team spoke to his counterpart in Florida.

Over time they worked out that the population of Florida was told to walk their dogs before 9am and after 5pm in the day and to stay out of strong sunlight unless the were covered up or had sunscreen on. And that's what all good Floridians were doing. Further research proved that we only make D3 between 10.30am and 3.30pm. Which makes absolute evolutionary sense as our forefathers wandered in Africa where the abundance of sun allowed the body to maximise the return on making D3 during peak hours. I should note that anyone who has a darker skin will take longer than those with lighter skins to make D3 from natural sunlight.

It is highly likely that taking 400 iu's per day in the UK is not sufficient to raise the levels of those who have a deficiency. It's more of a maintenance dose in my opinion.

But I would also like to suggest that those of you who are over 50 also look at your B12 & B6 intake. I take 6,000 mcg's of B12 every other day. I take tablets sublingually. I also take B6 in small amounts as low B6 will stop B12 being formed in the body.

Do not, and I repeat this do not believe your GP or any member of the NHS who tells you they have done a blood test on your B12 and it's above the lower limit.

The test does not differentiate between active and inactive B12 in the blood. But don't believe me - read it here on the NHS website please

B12 Blood Tests

A particular drawback of testing vitamin B12 levels is that the current widely used blood test only measures the total amount of vitamin B12 in your blood.
This means it measures forms of vitamin B12 that are "active" and can be used by your body, as well as the "inactive" forms, which cannot.

Before I go can I also point out that those of you who think you may be suffering with Winter Blues or SAD should consider, D3, B12, B6, bright light therapy and dawn simulators. As well as severe obstructive apnea I have both winter and summer SAD (and have just discovered I am non-celiac gluten hypertensive, lactose intolerant and can't eat oats as they contain avenin which is similar in chemical structure to gluten and has a negative impact upon me)

They're not taking me alive, I have a war to win

AiY

[Mike4]

It is highly likely that taking 400 iu's per day in the UK is not sufficient to raise the levels of those who have a deficiency. It's more of a maintenance dose in my opinion.

Its not a maintenance dose, it is the supplementary dose research in the 1920s found was the minimum guaranteed to prevent rickets.

So this historic dose of 400iu is nothing to do with the modulation needs of our immune system, and everything to do with proper bone development.

[Bouleversee]

Mike 4:

But rickets is not the current problem. Why are they sending out small packs of 400iu to people shielding from Covid? Why is it up to us to ask for a Vit. D test? I had assumed that as I am out in the garden an awful lot, without using a sunscreen other than occasionally on my face, eat all the right foods, took a supplement in the winter my level would be OK but it wasn't. 400iu is not even adequate for a maintenance dose and it really is time they got up to date. It's getting to the stage where patients know more than the doctors.

[onthemove]

Some of the meeja were reporting on this right back in the early days, though that was probably speculation.

Research funding will've been plentiful. It has a bearing not just on seasonality, but on politically-sensitive issues like correlation with skin colour.

Early on in the pandemic, I seem to recall reading some reports on science daily that suggested a possible correlation between countries with known vitamin D deficiency and Covid hospitalisation rates.

e.g.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 134426.htm
"Vitamin D determines severity in COVID-19 so government advice needs to change, experts urge" 12th May 2020

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 121353.htm
"Vitamin D levels appear to play role in COVID-19 mortality rates" 7th May 2020

The hypothesis, I believe, is not that vitamin D prevents infection. Rather that one of the known problems with severe covid is that the immune system overreacts. And it's known that vitamin D can help the immune system regulate itself better.

From second link above, 7th May 2020

""Instead, we saw a significant correlation with vitamin D deficiency," he said.

By analyzing publicly available patient data from around the globe, Backman and his team discovered a strong correlation between vitamin D levels and cytokine storm -- a hyperinflammatory condition caused by an overactive immune system -- as well as a correlation between vitamin D deficiency and mortality.

"Cytokine storm can severely damage lungs and lead to acute respiratory distress syndrome and death in patients," Daneshkhah said. "This is what seems to kill a majority of COVID-19 patients, not the destruction of the lungs by the virus itself. It is the complications from the misdirected fire from the immune system."

This is exactly where Backman believes vitamin D plays a major role. Not only does vitamin D enhance our innate immune systems, it also prevents our immune systems from becoming dangerously overactive. This means that having healthy levels of vitamin D could protect patients against severe complications, including death, from COVID-19.

"Our analysis shows that it might be as high as cutting the mortality rate in half," Backman said. "It will not prevent a patient from contracting the virus, but it may reduce complications and prevent death in those who are infected.""

I've been taking a regular multivitamin containing vitamin D throughout the pandemic after reading those papers. The packet says 100% RDA for vitamin D, but when I read an article on the BBC about vitamin D, that suggested the RDA was twice the amount of what's in the multivitamins that I've been taking. But apparently long term overdose can do more harm than good, so I'm just going to stick with what the packet says.

I dare say more research has subsequently been done. Multivitamins are already widely used in general, so even if it turns out not to be significantly beneficial for covid, taking multivitamins should still be generally at least a little beneficial overall and they cost next to nothing.

But there do seem to be valid scientific grounds to at least look to vitamin D as potentially helping fight covid - rather than just speculation.

[Mike4]

Mike 4:

But rickets is not the current problem. Why are they sending out small packs of 400iu to people shielding from Covid?

Nobody knows!

All the doctors I know are taking ten times that amount. Best guess is that Big Pharma doesn't want Vitamin D to be widely used as they will sell less Ivermectin, Methylprednisolone, Heparin etc.

Cynical, moi?

[AsleepInYorkshire]

Mike 4:

But rickets is not the current problem. Why are they sending out small packs of 400iu to people shielding from Covid? Why is it up to us to ask for a Vit. D test? I had assumed that as I am out in the garden an awful lot, without using a sunscreen other than occasionally on my face, eat all the right foods, took a supplement in the winter my level would be OK but it wasn't. 400iu is not even adequate for a maintenance dose and it really is time they got up to date. It's getting to the stage where patients know more than the doctors.

Hi Bouleversee,

Please try this link

It may help?

As I've said I've taken 5000 iu's of D3 per day for 7 years now. Never done me any harm. I've had some serious health problems over four decades. I can't look back. I can look forward though. As Sir Captain Tom Moore said "Tomorrow will be a good day". Do take the time to review what I've said on your B12 please. It may not apply to you but it's worth checking this sort of thing.

I hope things get better for you.

Take care

AiY

[Bouleversee]

Mike 4:

But rickets is not the current problem. Why are they sending out small packs of 400iu to people shielding from Covid?

Nobody knows!

All the doctors I know are taking ten times that amount. Best guess is that Big Pharma doesn't want Vitamin D to be widely used as they will sell less Ivermectin, Methylprednisolone, Heparin etc.

Cynical, moi?

Big Pharma doesn't decide NHS policy. I think it is just incompetence within that.

[Bouleversee]

Mike 4:

But rickets is not the current problem. Why are they sending out small packs of 400iu to people shielding from Covid? Why is it up to us to ask for a Vit. D test? I had assumed that as I am out in the garden an awful lot, without using a sunscreen other than occasionally on my face, eat all the right foods, took a supplement in the winter my level would be OK but it wasn't. 400iu is not even adequate for a maintenance dose and it really is time they got up to date. It's getting to the stage where patients know more than the doctors.

Hi Bouleversee,

Please try this link

It may help?

As I've said I've taken 5000 iu's of D3 per day for 7 years now. Never done me any harm. I've had some serious health problems over four decades. I can't look back. I can look forward though. As Sir Captain Tom Moore said "Tomorrow will be a good day". Do take the time to review what I've said on your B12 please. It may not apply to you but it's worth checking this sort of thing.

I hope things get better for you.

Take care

AiY

I do take a high strength Vitamin B Complex (from Healthspan) every other day which also includes a few other things including Folic Acid, largely because I have reduced my intake of red meat. I have heard experts saying that Vit D is the only vitamin one needs to take and IIRC Prof. Tom Spector doesn't even recommend that or eating fish, for heaven's sake.

When my severe deficiency of Vit D was discovered after I had requested tests, my GP prescribed a crash course of 40,000 iu a day for a week or it may have been a fortnight, I forget. This was so far in excess of the amounts mentioned on the leaflet that I took slightly less at the outset but my consultant said it was Ok so I bumped it back up. It probably doesn't matter for a short period. There seem to be widely diverging opinions amongst the medics about supplements and in the end one has to use one's own judgement. I can imagine the reaction if I asked a GP to test both my D3 and D2 levels. I think my level is probably OK at present; it returned to normal pretty quickly but I will get it tested as soon as I can get around to it. I'd rather make my own arrangements for that which is why I shall be interested to know whether Dr John's diy test was accurate.

There isn't any cure for IPF. I'm hoping that a spin off from Covid will lead to some gene modulation/therapy that will reverse the lung scarring but it won't be in my lifetime. No matter, I've had quite a good innings, but some serious research into this illness is long overdue so I shall be agitating for that and also to promote knowledge about the importance of Vitamin D to prevent this and other illnesses. It should be part of the educational process. Sleep is also very important so I had better go and get some. Not enough hours in the day.

[AsleepInYorkshire]

Mike 4:

But rickets is not the current problem. Why are they sending out small packs of 400iu to people shielding from Covid? Why is it up to us to ask for a Vit. D test? I had assumed that as I am out in the garden an awful lot, without using a sunscreen other than occasionally on my face, eat all the right foods, took a supplement in the winter my level would be OK but it wasn't. 400iu is not even adequate for a maintenance dose and it really is time they got up to date. It's getting to the stage where patients know more than the doctors.

Hi Bouleversee,

Please try this link

It may help?

As I've said I've taken 5000 iu's of D3 per day for 7 years now. Never done me any harm. I've had some serious health problems over four decades. I can't look back. I can look forward though. As Sir Captain Tom Moore said "Tomorrow will be a good day". Do take the time to review what I've said on your B12 please. It may not apply to you but it's worth checking this sort of thing.

I hope things get better for you.

Take care

AiY

I do take a high strength Vitamin B Complex (from Healthspan) every other day which also includes a few other things including Folic Acid, largely because I have reduced my intake of red meat. I have heard experts saying that Vit D is the only vitamin one needs to take and IIRC Prof. Tom Spector doesn't even recommend that or eating fish, for heaven's sake.

When my severe deficiency of Vit D was discovered after I had requested tests, my GP prescribed a crash course of 40,000 iu a day for a week or it may have been a fortnight, I forget. This was so far in excess of the amounts mentioned on the leaflet that I took slightly less at the outset but my consultant said it was Ok so I bumped it back up. It probably doesn't matter for a short period. There seem to be widely diverging opinions amongst the medics about supplements and in the end one has to use one's own judgement. I can imagine the reaction if I asked a GP to test both my D3 and D2 levels. I think my level is probably OK at present; it returned to normal pretty quickly but I will get it tested as soon as I can get around to it. I'd rather make my own arrangements for that which is why I shall be interested to know whether Dr John's diy test was accurate.

There isn't any cure for IPF. I'm hoping that a spin off from Covid will lead to some gene modulation/therapy that will reverse the lung scarring but it won't be in my lifetime. No matter, I've had quite a good innings, but some serious research into this illness is long overdue so I shall be agitating for that and also to promote knowledge about the importance of Vitamin D to prevent this and other illnesses. It should be part of the educational process. Sleep is also very important so I had better go and get some. Not enough hours in the day.

Sleep well.

AiY

[Bouleversee]

I remembered I hadn't yet read the links in On the move's post 386755 so have now done so. So back in May of last year research had shown the link between Vitamin D deficiency and the over reaction of the immune system in the face of a Covid 19 infection but I didn't see anything about that in the newspapers or hear it on the radio, despite the fact that those studies involved the UK. What is the point of doing research if nobody takes any notice of it? I don't think our Covid patients were even being tested for Vitamin D levels. How many lives could have been saved if they had been and appropriate treatment given which would have been easy and cheap?

[AsleepInYorkshire]

I remembered I hadn't yet read the links in On the move's post 386755 so have now done so. So back in May of last year research had shown the link between Vitamin D deficiency and the over reaction of the immune system in the face of a Covid 19 infection but I didn't see anything about that in the newspapers or hear it on the radio, despite the fact that those studies involved the UK. What is the point of doing research if nobody takes any notice of it? I don't think our Covid patients were even being tested for Vitamin D levels. How many lives could have been saved if they had been and appropriate treatment given which would have been easy and cheap?

Exceptionally frustrating. I've been there for over 40 years. All I can do is empathise with you. It's all I've got to give.

Take care

AiY