The Lemon Fool

A recent circular discussion with family went.....

"well NZ managed it by closing their borders, that's what we should have done.
Well by this time last year it was too late, but now we have it under control, we should stop all foreign travel and tighten quaratnine.
But we go to France every summer, we won't get to use our holiday home. Anyway we'll isolate when we get there and when we come back.
So miss it this year, after all you spent 6 months there last year then drove back at the peak of the second wave. You couldn't have done that in NZ"


The major issue (to me) is that the larger the infection pool, the higher the chance of a new vaccine resistant variant, and if that takes hold here we are back to where we were 6 months ago. With about 93 Million foreign trips taken in 2019, that is a lot of potential exposure.

So, given that we do finally seem to be getting a grip on the situation, should Boris subsidise the travel sector, ban foreign travel and tighten our borders for another 12 months until the rest of the world settles, or risk another lockdown and impacting the rest of our economy and disrupting school education so a few people can get some beach time?

Your first option seems to be oxymoronic in response to the question.

John

redsturgeon wrote:Your first option seems to be oxymoronic in response to the question.

John

And yet more than half of respondents have voted for it!

dealtn wrote:

redsturgeon wrote:Your first option seems to be oxymoronic in response to the question.

John

And yet more than half of respondents have voted for it!

Indeed!

dealtn wrote:

redsturgeon wrote:Your first option seems to be oxymoronic in response to the question.

John

And yet more than half of respondents have voted for it!

Will I edit the wording of option 1 to say “no” if that is what you meant?

redsturgeon wrote:Your first option seems to be oxymoronic in response to the question.

John

I took it to mean yes people could go on holiday, but no return to the UK allowed. They have to stay on their hols for ever...

Mike4 wrote:

redsturgeon wrote:Your first option seems to be oxymoronic in response to the question.

John

I took it to mean yes people could go on holiday, but no return to the UK allowed. They have to stay on their hols for ever...

If the border is closed you cannot leave or those abroad at the moment cannot return.

Holidays? Got an AirBnB villa in Crete that needs whitewashing, and if that's not essential work I'll eat my big straw hat. My old mate Bozza says his dad can fix me up with a connecting flight via Turkmenistan, no questions asked. Who knows, maybe Dominic will pop over as well for an eye test?

Chin chin. Ouzo clever boy?

BJ

Clariman wrote:

dealtn wrote:

redsturgeon wrote:Your first option seems to be oxymoronic in response to the question.

John

And yet more than half of respondents have voted for it!

Will I edit the wording of option 1 to say “no” if that is what you meant?

Yes, please. 'No' would be better.

Actually I rephrased the question, then forgot to change the answer

Paul

Mike88 wrote:

Mike4 wrote:

redsturgeon wrote:Your first option seems to be oxymoronic in response to the question.

I took it to mean yes people could go on holiday, but no return to the UK allowed. They have to stay on their hols for ever...

If the border is closed you cannot leave or those abroad at the moment cannot return.

I do not believe that the borders have ever been fully closed anywhere. If they truly were, then airports would be closed, at least for international passenger planes.

Even the places that went obsessional about it, like New Zealand, still had some flights in and out. The UK's version has always had a vast list of exempt categories of traveller.

And you can't really prevent someone with a UK passport from arriving in the UK. Best you can do is stick them in a hotel for ten days and hope they don't escape.

We've booked to go to Tenerife the last week in August. If we can't travel then we will move it to the end of October.

We will all be vaccinated by then and I'd guess the hotel staff will be too.

It's only the same as jumping in the car and travelling to Cornwall for a glass of cider. I don't think the covid variants are as big an issue as suggested, but stand to be corrected.

AiY

Being allowed or prohibited is one aspect. In practice, all these ducks need to be lined up:

1) Able to leave the UK on holiday
2) Able to arrive in destination without quarantine
3) Able to use restaurants while on holiday
4) Able to leave destination and return to UK without quarantine on return (rules may have changed while away)

I'm coming round to the conclusion that it's just not worth the hassle, and looking at the UK for holidays again.

Mike88 wrote:

Mike4 wrote:

redsturgeon wrote:Your first option seems to be oxymoronic in response to the question.

John

I took it to mean yes people could go on holiday, but no return to the UK allowed. They have to stay on their hols for ever...

If the border is closed you cannot leave or those abroad at the moment cannot return.

There's always a dingy across the channel...

DrFfybes wrote:

Clariman wrote:

dealtn wrote:
And yet more than half of respondents have voted for it!

Will I edit the wording of option 1 to say “no” if that is what you meant?

Yes, please. 'No' would be better.

Actually I rephrased the question, then forgot to change the answer

Paul

Done

Clariman wrote:

DrFfybes wrote:

Clariman wrote:Will I edit the wording of option 1 to say “no” if that is what you meant?

Yes, please. 'No' would be better.

Actually I rephrased the question, then forgot to change the answer

Paul

Done

Cue 20 people all changing their vote now, lol!

Interesting...if you look at the new rules there is a loophole the size of Barnard Castle!

You are allowed to go abroad to sort out your existing property, or to sell it but wait for it...you can also go out to buy a property.

Cue many estate agents in Alicante booked viewings for their latest three bed villa with shared pool in a lovely quiet Urbinizacion only 20 minutes from the Med.

John

Snorvey wrote:

redsturgeon wrote:Interesting...if you look at the new rules there is a loophole the size of Barnard Castle!

You are allowed to go abroad to sort out your existing property, or to sell it but wait for it...you can also go out to buy a property.

Cue many estate agents in Alicante booked viewings for their latest three bed villa with shared pool in a lovely quiet Urbinizacion only 20 minutes from the Med.

John

Are you already looking for loopholes to exercise your God-given right, or is your big shop not from Ocado?

Yes I read that too.

For the avoidance of doubt, I am not planning any holiday this year.

John

Snorvey wrote::D just me trying to stir it up a bit.

Actually, I though the next Daily Mash article even funnier.

Viz Top Tips: Save money by not buying the Daily Mail/Express and simply come to us:

https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/politics ... 0323206446



Re. Traveling, that's all sorted. A Covid test before you travel, and a Covid test before you come home. Results in 30 minutes.


Steve

Lootman wrote:And you can't really prevent someone with a UK passport from arriving in the UK. Best you can do is stick them in a hotel for ten days and hope they don't escape.

Did Shamima Begum have her passport rescinded?

AsleepInYorkshire wrote:It's only the same as jumping in the car and travelling to Cornwall for a glass of cider. I don't think the covid variants are as big an issue as suggested, but stand to be corrected.
AiY

SARS-Cov-2 is not entirely dissimilar to SARS-Cov-1 which caused the last SARS outbreak, or the other 6 less dangerous Coronaviruses that infect humans. It probably only took a small mutation for it to become infectious to humans. IF the UK keeps contained then the chances of variants arising that can evade the current vaccine are much reduced.

stevensfo wrote:Re. Traveling, that's all sorted. A Covid test before you travel, and a Covid test before you come home. Results in 30 minutes.

Now there's an idea - sample everyone who comes back, and if they are found to be carrying a variant new to the UK then they face 1 year in prison and a £10k fine for each person who dies after being infected with the new variant. Seems only fair, after all their actions can be directly linked to the deaths so they should take responsibility for the consequences.

Paul [edited for spelling]

If you've had both doses of the vaccine then you should be allowed to travel freely. However, if you're travelling to a `red list' country it would be reasonable to insist that you have a rapid result test on re-entry.

I don't know how quick a reliable test is now, but I'm assuming it could be processed within 24 hours, so you might have to spend a night in a quarantine hotel, which I'm sure most people would accept as being a reasonable price to pay.

By the time there's any propsect of overseas travel (late May, at the earliest) the large majority of the UK population will have been vaccinated, so the risk of infecting anyone when returning home will be minimal. Likewise, if you're travelling to a high risk area there will probably be some form of local lockdown, which will minimise your exposure to local people.

There will always be some risk of catching a new variant and bringing it back, but it's a risk that is now there permanently, and it has to be balanced against the desirability of allowing people to travel. The risk is unlikely to be significantly lower in a year's time or five years' time, so all that closing the borders would achieve is to postpone the risk. In fact, there may even be an argument that if there are new variants it may be better to import them in the relatively near future, when immunity will be at its highest, than to do so in a year's time.

Like AiY I've got flights for late August, but I'm frankly sick of lockdown life in the UK, and I fully intend to go abroad as soon as it's possible to do so.