Musk endeavours

[Howard]

One defect with the insurance survey is that it does not provide comparison insurance costs to other similar priced vehicles.

It would have been nice if they had included that, particularly if they had include other BEV, so as to give us an idea of the Tesla premium, whether it be + or - compared to other makes.

Regards,

The link below doesn’t answer your question fully. However it does explain why it is more expensive to insure a BEV than the ICE equivalent in the USA. One of the main reasons given is that BEV variants are more expensive to buy and manufacture. The research suggests that this difference should decrease as more consumers buy BEVs and the costs come down.

How Having an Electric Car Affects Your Auto Insurance Rates - https://www.valuepenguin.com/how-having ... ance-rates

This organisation has a lot of information about insurance costs and there may be some information which is more relevant to your question, but I couldn’t find it from a quick look.

regards

Howard

[odysseus2000]

Advantage of Cyber over F350:

https://www.teslarati.com/elon-musk-tes ... ssion=true

Regards,

[JamesMuenchen]

Japanese motors saw this coming & cut their UK factories.

Japanese companies shut their UK plants because their workers voted to put up barriers between their European suppliers and their UK factories and between their UK factories and their European markets.

So why did they shut their Turkish factories at the same time?

[Howard]

Advantage of Cyber over F350:

https://www.teslarati.com/elon-musk-tes ... ssion=true

Regards,

These stunts are fun. When will Tesla demonstrate that a Cybertruck is as rugged as a Toyota Hilux. Can it survive a drop from a 23 storey building?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFnVZXQD5_k



Howard

[odysseus2000]

Interesting comparisons of BEV to ICE insurance.

The extra electric premium on the quoted insurance rates would soon be saved via the reduced fuel costs, especially if home fuelled via solar.

Regards,

[BobbyD]

Can't see how anything could go wrong here...

ELON MUSK TO TESTIFY AS BRITISH DIVER SUES OVER ‘PEDO GUY’ SLUR

- https://www.independent.co.uk/life-styl ... 30681.html

[BobbyD]

Who knew? Rock solid defence...

"I assume he did not mean to sodomise me with a submarine... Just as I didn't literally mean he was a paedophile."

...of course that isn't actually what diver-guy said.

“People say a lot of things on Twitter that aren’t true,” Musk said.

Musk also acknowledged under oath that he was duped out of $52,000 by a man posing as a private detective to dig up information about Unsworth after it became clear a defamation suit was in the works. The investigator proved to be a con artist, Musk testified.

- https://www.reuters.com/article/us-musk ... SKBN1Y718A

The judge has denied the defence's request to define Mr Unsworth as a "public figure" - meaning lawyers for Mr Unsworth do not have to prove Mr Musk acted with "actual malice", lowering the bar necessary to win the case.

- https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-50653531

[PeterGray]

Just as I didn't literally mean he was a paedophile

If he didn't mean it then why did he come up with more outrageous lies about him weeks later? Even by Musk's standards this is unconvincing!

[odysseus2000]

Producing a 64kWh battery takes as much water as 30 cups of coffee:

https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-model-3 ... researcher

Also note the lower comments on Cobalt and how Tesla currently use about 20% of the Cobalt as does a VW battery with Tesla planning to have zero Cobalt quantity by 2025.

Regards,

[odysseus2000]

Automatic labelling for computer vision is part of the way robotic driving is being developed. This is an interesting article showing how the statistics of having many miles driven improves labelling and is where Tesla has a huge lead:

https://seekingalpha.com/article/431033 ... king_alpha

Regards,

[BobbyD]

Just as I didn't literally mean he was a paedophile

If he didn't mean it then why did he come up with more outrageous lies about him weeks later? Even by Musk's standards this is unconvincing!

It's intriguing to try and work out which was the worst decision in this completely pointless and unnecessary farrago.

There's the initial comment on a totally public platform, the badgering a publication to investigate diver-guy, the hiring a fake private detective to investigate diver-guy, or actually putting up a defence and taking it to open court rather than settling which would doubtless have required a sum of money which wouldn't even have been trivial for Musk, and possibly more problematically the need to admit that Musk was not just sorry, but wrong.

Still at least he isn't in charge of a multi-billion dollar car company or anything...

[onthemove]

Just as I didn't literally mean he was a paedophile

If he didn't mean it then why did he come up with more outrageous lies about him weeks later? Even by Musk's standards this is unconvincing!

It's intriguing to try and work out which was the worst decision in this completely pointless and unnecessary farrago.

There's the initial comment on a totally public platform, the badgering a publication to investigate diver-guy, the hiring a fake private detective to investigate diver-guy, or actually putting up a defence and taking it to open court rather than settling which would doubtless have required a sum of money which wouldn't even have been trivial for Musk, and possibly more problematically the need to admit that Musk was not just sorry, but wrong.

Still at least he isn't in charge of a multi-billion dollar car company or anything...

Why would he hire the private investigator if he didn't intend to mean his comment literally? Just curious.

But then, yeh, about the 'being in chage of a multi-billion dollar car company'... curious how there's a claim out there that they don't spend anything on advertising.

Musk is getting himself - and his position - and therefore his company - quite some exposure via this court case. Even the BBC report on the case starts off "The Tesla founder..."

Part of creating brand awareness is just simply getting the name plastered anywhere and everywhere. And Musk is getting some pretty extensive brand awareness for Tesla out of this case.

Just my idle / rambling thoughts....

[Howard]

November sales figures for Tesla in Europe are now coming out.

Norway accounted for 546 cars
Germany 280
France 300

Q4 looks very challenging for the brand in these markets.

Sales in the Netherlands of 4116 were much higher thanks to buyers taking advantage of the very generous government subsidies which end this month. Sales in the first few days of December are looking good.

The UK figures will be available soon. It will be interesting to see if they are lower or higher than the 587 cars sold in October.

These figures do question the investment case for a German megafactory. There is not much evidence that European buyers have been impressed by Tesla’s cars so far. Initial subsidised sales appear to be followed by a steep drop in volumes in most markets.

By comparison it’s interesting to look at how European manufacturers are exploiting the US market.

VW sales in the USA in November were 29,218 (up 9%) and their year to date sales are up 4.2% on the same time last year (335,445).
And BMW vehicle sales totalled 31,213 vehicles in November 2019, an increase of 10.2 percent over the 28,330 vehicles sold in November 2018. Year-to-date, BMW sales in the U.S. are up 4.5 percent.

(Figures are from VW and BMW corporate websites - nice PR quote: “We enter the final month of 2019 in the midst of our annual ‘Road Home’ sales event with optimism for a strong year-end and a prosperous year ahead,” said Bernhard Kuhnt, president and CEO, BMW of North America.)

VW and BMW are making profits and their dealers must be pleased. These profits are helpful for subsidising their BEV programmes.

Tesla aren’t revealing how many cars they sold in the USA in October and November, and whether they are seeing a drop in volumes, they are being uncharacteristically shy on this. We may have to wait until they publish their Q4 results next year.

See https://eu-evs.com/ for sales in Norway and Netherlands. German figure is from registration statistics.

No FUD or wild forecasts (apart from the bullish comment from the BMW CEO) in the above. Just facts

regards

Howard

[BobbyD]

No FUD or wild forecasts (apart from the bullish comment from the BMW CEO) in the above. Just facts

A touch unsporting Howard!

[odysseus2000]

Howard
By comparison it’s interesting to look at how European manufacturers are exploiting the US market.

VW sales in the USA in November were 29,218 (up 9%) and their year to date sales are up 4.2% on the same time last year (335,445).
And BMW vehicle sales totalled 31,213 vehicles in November 2019, an increase of 10.2 percent over the 28,330 vehicles sold in November 2018. Year-to-date, BMW sales in the U.S. are up 4.5 percent.

(Figures are from VW and BMW corporate websites - nice PR quote: “We enter the final month of 2019 in the midst of our annual ‘Road Home’ sales event with optimism for a strong year-end and a prosperous year ahead,” said Bernhard Kuhnt, president and CEO, BMW of North America.)

Are there independent checks to confirm these numbers?

Regards,

[odysseus2000]

Model X does well in Ncap safety testing:

https://twitter.com/Tesla/status/120227 ... 91040?s=20

Regards,

[Howard]

Howard
By comparison it’s interesting to look at how European manufacturers are exploiting the US market.

VW sales in the USA in November were 29,218 (up 9%) and their year to date sales are up 4.2% on the same time last year (335,445).
And BMW vehicle sales totalled 31,213 vehicles in November 2019, an increase of 10.2 percent over the 28,330 vehicles sold in November 2018. Year-to-date, BMW sales in the U.S. are up 4.5 percent.

(Figures are from VW and BMW corporate websites - nice PR quote: “We enter the final month of 2019 in the midst of our annual ‘Road Home’ sales event with optimism for a strong year-end and a prosperous year ahead,” said Bernhard Kuhnt, president and CEO, BMW of North America.)

Are there independent checks to confirm these numbers?

Regards,

Ody

That's a rather "out of touch" question. What is surprising you about the reality of the continued profitable dominance of these two brands in the USA? Their sales volumes in Europe are even bigger. And their sales channels are still dominant across the world. This may change in future but they and some other car manufacturers are quietly getting on with developing BEVs and they aren't wasting time with vapourware like Cybertrucks which may never sell in volume.

VW US sales report is at https://media.vw.com/en-us/releases/1235.

BMW at https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/usa/arti ... -u-s-sales

Enjoy

Howard

PS Can you help by finding a source which tells us how many cars Tesla sold in the USA in October and November? Rumour has it that sales volumes are reducing but this may be incorrect. However if they are growing Elon Musk is being unusually coy about publicising this.

[BobbyD]

...Are there independent checks to confirm these numbers?

Regards,

Ody

That's a rather "out of touch" question.

If Musk didn't say it on twitter it isn't true.

Speaking of which, another element of the defence

Musk responded: “Most things I say on Twitter will generally get some press awareness … If I write something on Twitter, it will get reported.

- https://www.theguardian.com/technology/ ... hai-rescue

Good job he didn't use Twitter to make distasteful and frankly dangerous allegations about anybody which, if circulated, could end up in a defamation suit.

[odysseus2000]

That's a rather "out of touch" question. What is surprising you about the reality of the continued profitable dominance of these two brands in the USA? Their sales volumes in Europe are even bigger. And their sales channels are still dominant across the world. This may change in future but they and some other car manufacturers are quietly getting on with developing BEVs and they aren't wasting time with vapourware like Cybertrucks which may never sell in volume.

VW US sales report is at https://media.vw.com/en-us/releases/1235.

BMW at https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/usa/arti ... -u-s-sales

Enjoy

Howard

Not an out of touch question at all.

I find no evidence of a very strong US economy & yet these two companies report large increases in sales. Sure they could be rebounds after losing market share or they could be the same kind of information in Diesel Gate, I.e. Not reality.

Let us not forget that both makers are going to need to borrow serious dosh if they are to live up to their BEV plans & so will be doing everything pissible in these dog & pony reports to give a favourable impression.

Regards,

[BobbyD]

I find no evidence of a very strong US economy & yet these two companies report large increases in sales. Sure they could be rebounds after losing market share or they could be the same kind of information in Diesel Gate, I.e. Not reality.

It's called increasing market share, and starting from a low base. BMW by the nature of it's product line is never going to have a massive market share in any market, and whilst it is the clear market leader in Europe and China VW has never really, as yet, been a volume seller in the states.

Let us not forget that both makers are going to need to borrow serious dosh if they are to live up to their BEV plans & so will be doing everything pissible in these dog & pony reports to give a favourable impression.

It's a hard life being a massively profitable company with billions of euros of cash in the bank, and the odd surplus to requirements holding like Renk up for sale.