Lootman wrote:Spet0789 wrote:Please let’s not import the US meaning of liberal.
In the U.K. liberal means you believe in the freedom of the individual above the power of the state. It means low taxes, a smaller state, pro-business, pro free trade, strong property rights, protection of personal freedoms to live and let live.
I was using the word "liberal" in more of an American sense of the word. It is further confused here because we have a Liberal Party that is not at all "liberal" in your sense of the word.
That said I would probably use "libertarian" to mean what you are saying, and us libertarians are not woke at all.
I would say that woke people and liberals hold the same views on issues like same sex relationships and racial discrimination. Woke people are louder (sometimes annoyingly, stridently so) in their desire to change society to reflect those views.
Libertarianism is a very extreme version of liberal. Liberals believe in smaller government. Libertarians believe in almost no government! Again, it’s an American thing really. No one in the U.K. is that daft.
The so called Orange book Liberal Democrats (Clegg, Alexander, Laws) were very closely aligned with my definition. They aligned nicely with Cameron and Osborne. The problem was that the LD vote was about 50% that grouping and 50% what I would describe as silly dreamers who probably align politically with Labour but prefer to smugly vote for a party who never has to make the real-world compromises inherent in holding power. For them it’s effectively a way of spoiling one’s ballot paper and being able to disagree with every government.
The Lib Dems got into power in the coalition. At the next election, the liberals were happy to vote for Cameron and Osborne and the silly lefties were so appalled that they had actually caught the car and elected a government which had to make real compromises (eg tuition fees) that they didn’t bother turning out or voted for the Greens.