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Boris resigns

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XFool
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Re: Boris resigns

#151979

Postby XFool » July 12th, 2018, 2:05 pm

ap8889 wrote:
Sundance13 wrote:..... the EU as an evil galactic empire, which we need to break free of.

"The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers."

This. The EU could have kept the UK had it only been a tiny bit less meddlesome and controlling, determined to crush all human resistance, such as rebel barrow-boys selling fruit and veg in pounds and ounces.

Arrrgghh!

But isn't this simply one quite good example of the phoney objections to the EU? (Aren't they all?)

Surely no country can or will allow TWO official mensuration systems for weights and measures in buying or selling? There HAS to be just ONE official system. That's quite different from asking for "A stone of spuds please!"

I remember I used to ask for "half a pound of cheese" (not sure if it would work now!) and got it, more or less. Just that it was weighed out in Kilograms etc. AFAICS nothing stopped anyone asking for, or being sold, a pound of this, or a stone of that - just that it HAD to be measured out using the current official UK standards for weights & measures.

My belief is many of the objections to EU rules were ALWAYS essentially political in origin, rather than genuine objections leading to political consequences.

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Re: Boris resigns

#151982

Postby BobbyD » July 12th, 2018, 2:12 pm

ursaminortaur wrote:You do realise that the chief proponent of that expansion of the EU to the east was the UK.


It's almost like we wanted to move the political centre in the EU to the right and dilute support for the CAP...

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Re: Boris resigns

#152168

Postby BobbyD » July 13th, 2018, 12:39 pm

NeilW wrote:Don't threaten war just because you can't get what you want. It's not very nice, nor is it very likely. Ireland has moved on.



Man held on suspicion of attempted murder as Derry violence goes on
Northern Ireland police say officers came under sustained attack in Bogside area

A 22-year-old man has been arrested on suspicion of attempted murder as explosive devices were thrown at police on a sixth successive night of violence in Derry.

Two devices were aimed at officers during unrest in the Bogside area, with 74 petrol bombs also thrown. Two more men, aged 18 and 50, were also arrested.




- https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... rn-ireland

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Re: Boris resigns

#152262

Postby Stonge » July 13th, 2018, 8:49 pm

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/10/opin ... rexit.html

Moderator Message:
RS: Bare links are not acceptable, please provide either a summary or comment as to why you find the link interesting.

Sorcery
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Re: Boris resigns

#152264

Postby Sorcery » July 13th, 2018, 9:17 pm

Stonge, it would be helpful if you could have provided some description such as :
"Deluded writer for the UK Times writing for the New York Times, blames Boris for everything Brexit related"

From the article :
It is petrifying that the deliberate deceptions and wild ego of one man can so mislead a nation. (Americans know all about that.) One insider told me that Mrs. May was prepared for Mr. Johnson’s defection, and will outflank him, persuading wavering Conservatives that the time for fantasy has passed.

I have often defended Theresa May on TLF, can't see me ever being that gushing on so little evidence, though.
Think I can safely say Boris influenced me less than Gove, Frank Field, Andrea Leadsom, Gisella Stewart, Kate Hoey for Brexit. David Cameron, George Osbourne & Obama were also convincing in the opposite way they intended (mainly for lying).

Late edit: Forgot Saint Nigel.

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Re: Boris resigns

#152278

Postby BobbyD » July 14th, 2018, 4:37 am

BobbyD wrote:
NeilW wrote:Don't threaten war just because you can't get what you want. It's not very nice, nor is it very likely. Ireland has moved on.



Man held on suspicion of attempted murder as Derry violence goes on
Northern Ireland police say officers came under sustained attack in Bogside area

A 22-year-old man has been arrested on suspicion of attempted murder as explosive devices were thrown at police on a sixth successive night of violence in Derry.

Two devices were aimed at officers during unrest in the Bogside area, with 74 petrol bombs also thrown. Two more men, aged 18 and 50, were also arrested.




- https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... rn-ireland


Gerry Adams home attacked with 'explosive device'

...

Explosive devices were thrown at the homes of prominent republican figures in Northern Ireland, including the former Sinn Féin leader Gerry Adams, on Friday night, the party has said.

The Police Service of Northern Ireland (PSNI) confirmed on Friday it was dealing with two incidents at two addresses in west Belfast, though officers declined to give any further details.


- https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... rn-ireland

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Re: Boris resigns

#152303

Postby Nimrod103 » July 14th, 2018, 10:45 am

BobbyD wrote:
BobbyD wrote:
NeilW wrote:Don't threaten war just because you can't get what you want. It's not very nice, nor is it very likely. Ireland has moved on.



Man held on suspicion of attempted murder as Derry violence goes on
Northern Ireland police say officers came under sustained attack in Bogside area

A 22-year-old man has been arrested on suspicion of attempted murder as explosive devices were thrown at police on a sixth successive night of violence in Derry.

Two devices were aimed at officers during unrest in the Bogside area, with 74 petrol bombs also thrown. Two more men, aged 18 and 50, were also arrested.




- https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... rn-ireland


Gerry Adams home attacked with 'explosive device'

...

Explosive devices were thrown at the homes of prominent republican figures in Northern Ireland, including the former Sinn Féin leader Gerry Adams, on Friday night, the party has said.

The Police Service of Northern Ireland (PSNI) confirmed on Friday it was dealing with two incidents at two addresses in west Belfast, though officers declined to give any further details.


- https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... rn-ireland


I would guess this attack is more likely to have been from dissident republicans.

PS I often find the posting times of people's comments intriguing.

ursaminortaur
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Re: Boris resigns

#152305

Postby ursaminortaur » July 14th, 2018, 11:05 am

Nimrod103 wrote:
BobbyD wrote:


Gerry Adams home attacked with 'explosive device'

...

Explosive devices were thrown at the homes of prominent republican figures in Northern Ireland, including the former Sinn Féin leader Gerry Adams, on Friday night, the party has said.

The Police Service of Northern Ireland (PSNI) confirmed on Friday it was dealing with two incidents at two addresses in west Belfast, though officers declined to give any further details.


- https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... rn-ireland


I would guess this attack is more likely to have been from dissident republicans.

PS I often find the posting times of people's comments intriguing.



https://www.ft.com/content/c16d1236-86a9-11e8-96dd-fa565ec55929


Unionist and Nationalist parties in Northern Ireland made a rare joint statement calling for calm on Friday after six consecutive nights of rioting in Londonderry. The violence was blamed on dissident Irish republicans who reject Sinn Féin’s support for the Good Friday deal. Earlier in the week, pro-British loyalists were blamed for violence in Belfast on the eve of celebrations to mark the 1690 Battle of the Boyne, an event they hold dear.



https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/jul/12/northern-ireland-orange-order-parades-12-july-amid-violence-belfast-derry

Police had warned the loyalist paramilitary Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF) was planning to “orchestrate and participate in serious disorder” in east Belfast.
The violence came after loyalists expressed anger at moves by authorities to limit the size of bonfires at two controversial sites in the east of the city. Hundreds of eleventh night bonfires were lit at midnight across Northern Ireland to usher in 12 July.

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Re: Boris resigns

#152318

Postby Nimrod103 » July 14th, 2018, 12:55 pm

ursaminortaur wrote:
Nimrod103 wrote:


I would guess this attack is more likely to have been from dissident republicans.

PS I often find the posting times of people's comments intriguing.



https://www.ft.com/content/c16d1236-86a9-11e8-96dd-fa565ec55929


Unionist and Nationalist parties in Northern Ireland made a rare joint statement calling for calm on Friday after six consecutive nights of rioting in Londonderry. The violence was blamed on dissident Irish republicans who reject Sinn Féin’s support for the Good Friday deal. Earlier in the week, pro-British loyalists were blamed for violence in Belfast on the eve of celebrations to mark the 1690 Battle of the Boyne, an event they hold dear.



https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/jul/12/northern-ireland-orange-order-parades-12-july-amid-violence-belfast-derry

Police had warned the loyalist paramilitary Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF) was planning to “orchestrate and participate in serious disorder” in east Belfast.
The violence came after loyalists expressed anger at moves by authorities to limit the size of bonfires at two controversial sites in the east of the city. Hundreds of eleventh night bonfires were lit at midnight across Northern Ireland to usher in 12 July.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... nfirm.html

The headline reads:
Former Sinn Fein leader Gerry Adams calls on those responsible for bombing his home to 'come and sit down and tell me what it's about' after six nights of violence 'from dissident Republicans'

Can't be bothered to read the article, but the headline suggests Adams knows exactly what it is all about.

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Re: Boris resigns

#152323

Postby ursaminortaur » July 14th, 2018, 1:20 pm

Nimrod103 wrote:
ursaminortaur wrote:
Nimrod103 wrote:
I would guess this attack is more likely to have been from dissident republicans.

PS I often find the posting times of people's comments intriguing.



https://www.ft.com/content/c16d1236-86a9-11e8-96dd-fa565ec55929


Unionist and Nationalist parties in Northern Ireland made a rare joint statement calling for calm on Friday after six consecutive nights of rioting in Londonderry. The violence was blamed on dissident Irish republicans who reject Sinn Féin’s support for the Good Friday deal. Earlier in the week, pro-British loyalists were blamed for violence in Belfast on the eve of celebrations to mark the 1690 Battle of the Boyne, an event they hold dear.



https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/jul/12/northern-ireland-orange-order-parades-12-july-amid-violence-belfast-derry

Police had warned the loyalist paramilitary Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF) was planning to “orchestrate and participate in serious disorder” in east Belfast.
The violence came after loyalists expressed anger at moves by authorities to limit the size of bonfires at two controversial sites in the east of the city. Hundreds of eleventh night bonfires were lit at midnight across Northern Ireland to usher in 12 July.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... nfirm.html

The headline reads:
Former Sinn Fein leader Gerry Adams calls on those responsible for bombing his home to 'come and sit down and tell me what it's about' after six nights of violence 'from dissident Republicans'

Can't be bothered to read the article, but the headline suggests Adams knows exactly what it is all about.


The headline seems to be conflating the 6 days of violence in Londonderry/Derry with the violence in Belfast. Whereas other articles mentioned above seem to suggest that whilst the former are being conducted by dissident republicans the latter are probably being carried out by the loyalist UVF. But I'd agree that Gerry Adams probably knows that he is hated by the UVF - the only question being as to timing ie why bomb his home now.

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Re: Boris resigns

#152330

Postby BobbyD » July 14th, 2018, 2:50 pm

Nimrod103 wrote:I would guess this attack is more likely to have been from dissident republicans.


Bloods or Crips it rather suggests that 'Ireland has moved on' is a touch overoptimistic, as does lobbing petrol bombs at the police...

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Re: Boris resigns

#152379

Postby gryffron » July 14th, 2018, 11:20 pm

Great. So these dissident republicans should be delighted if brexit results in the GFA being binned.

Or maybe not. But the contradiction does show yet another thread of Project Fear is total rubbish.

Gryff

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Re: Boris resigns

#152382

Postby BobbyD » July 14th, 2018, 11:39 pm

gryffron wrote:Great. So these dissident republicans should be delighted if brexit results in the GFA being binned.

Or maybe not. But the contradiction does show yet another thread of Project Fear is total rubbish.


Violence in NI is proof that warnings about the possibility of future violence in NI are just project fear?

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Re: Boris resigns

#152936

Postby BobbyD » July 17th, 2018, 4:10 pm

According to the Daily Mail, Boris Johnson has broken Whitehall rules by not consulting the advisory committee on business appointments before taking up a job as a Telegraph columnist after resigning as foreign secretary.


- https://www.theguardian.com/politics/bl ... -118400878

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Re: Boris resigns

#160017

Postby ursaminortaur » August 15th, 2018, 11:05 pm

A freedom of information request has revealed that Boris' trip to Afghanistan to avoid the Heathrow vote cost at least £19,000 and Labour are calling for him to refund the money.

https://www.ft.com/content/fa3978c4-a0cc-11e8-85da-eeb7a9ce36e4

Labour has called for former foreign secretary Boris Johnson to refund taxpayers, after it emerged that an impromptu foreign trip to avoid a crucial parliamentary vote had cost at least £19,000.Mr Johnson visited Afghanistan for nine hours on June 25, the same day that MPs in London voted on approving a third runway to Heathrow airport. He would otherwise have had to resign from the government, or break a pledge to his west London constituents to oppose Heathrow expansion.He nonetheless resigned as foreign secretary two weeks later, saying that he disagreed with the government’s Brexit plans.

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Re: Boris resigns

#160019

Postby Lootman » August 15th, 2018, 11:13 pm

ursaminortaur wrote:A freedom of information request has revealed that Boris' trip to Afghanistan to avoid the Heathrow vote cost at least £19,000 and Labour are calling for him to refund the money.

Yeah, at least when the appalling Diane Abbott had her oh-so-convenient (not tonight darling, I have a) headache to avoid a humiliating vote she had the decency to not cost the taxpayer anything

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Re: Boris resigns

#160020

Postby beeswax » August 15th, 2018, 11:24 pm

Lootman wrote:
ursaminortaur wrote:A freedom of information request has revealed that Boris' trip to Afghanistan to avoid the Heathrow vote cost at least £19,000 and Labour are calling for him to refund the money.

Yeah, at least when the appalling Diane Abbott had her oh-so-convenient (not tonight darling, I have a) headache to avoid a humiliating vote she had the decency to not cost the taxpayer anything


I would question that sum of money as it seems far too high unless he chartered a special RAF flight which is unlikely..

Politicians travel all over the place as an excuse to discuss this or that and most are not even Cabinet Ministers...Their FIRST and only job is to represent their constituents...Cabinet Ministers use any excuse and always have...eg New Zealand have an interesting idea about waste disposal, think we will go and investigate...

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Re: Boris resigns

#160022

Postby ursaminortaur » August 15th, 2018, 11:29 pm

beeswax wrote:
Lootman wrote:
ursaminortaur wrote:A freedom of information request has revealed that Boris' trip to Afghanistan to avoid the Heathrow vote cost at least £19,000 and Labour are calling for him to refund the money.

Yeah, at least when the appalling Diane Abbott had her oh-so-convenient (not tonight darling, I have a) headache to avoid a humiliating vote she had the decency to not cost the taxpayer anything


I would question that sum of money as it seems far too high unless he chartered a special RAF flight which is unlikely..

Politicians travel all over the place as an excuse to discuss this or that and most are not even Cabinet Ministers...Their FIRST and only job is to represent their constituents...Cabinet Ministers use any excuse and always have...eg New Zealand have an interesting idea about waste disposal, think we will go and investigate...


It was an FCO response to a freedom of information request

https://theferret.scot/boris-johnson-afghan-trip-20000/

The Ferret submitted a freedom of information request to the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) asking for details of Johnson’s trip.
We asked for the full cost of the trip and dates of when discussions on it began. The FCO refused to answer most questions but did disclose that the cost to the taxpayer for three staff to accompany Johnson was £19,366.

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Re: Boris resigns

#160027

Postby beeswax » August 15th, 2018, 11:57 pm

ursaminortaur wrote:
beeswax wrote:
Lootman wrote:Yeah, at least when the appalling Diane Abbott had her oh-so-convenient (not tonight darling, I have a) headache to avoid a humiliating vote she had the decency to not cost the taxpayer anything


I would question that sum of money as it seems far too high unless he chartered a special RAF flight which is unlikely..

Politicians travel all over the place as an excuse to discuss this or that and most are not even Cabinet Ministers...Their FIRST and only job is to represent their constituents...Cabinet Ministers use any excuse and always have...eg New Zealand have an interesting idea about waste disposal, think we will go and investigate...


It was an FCO response to a freedom of information request

https://theferret.scot/boris-johnson-afghan-trip-20000/

The Ferret submitted a freedom of information request to the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) asking for details of Johnson’s trip.
We asked for the full cost of the trip and dates of when discussions on it began. The FCO refused to answer most questions but did disclose that the cost to the taxpayer for three staff to accompany Johnson was £19,366.


Ah so it wasn't 19 grand just for BJ....it was for the four of them ie around 5 grand each which is more like it and so my question would be why did those others NEED to accompany him and no doubt he would have had security personal which may have been part of that group?

Yes we all knew it was probably to get out of the Heathrow Parliamentary vote and BJ has form as he ducked out of the Tory Leadership race too and guess he would have lost many supporters by doing both these things..It would have looked worse for BJ had the trip to Afghanistan been arranged as soon as they knew when the Parliamentary vote was...So the FoI request only goes so far then? Security reasons of course....

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Re: Boris resigns

#160034

Postby PinkDalek » August 16th, 2018, 12:42 am

beeswax wrote: … Ah so it wasn't 19 grand just for BJ....it was for the four of them ie around 5 grand each ...


Nope.

You need to read the reply https://assets.documentcloud.org/docume ... /Boris.pdf. The £19,366 relates to the disclosed Breakdown of costs for the three officials.


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