Gov.org doesn't make it easy maybe I should try using a PC instead of a table or ask a school.
So does anyone know the real stats
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modellingman wrote:Have a look at the research and statistics section of the Standards and Testing Agency : https://www.gov.uk/search/research-and- ... ing-agency
There's not that much there but there are results of the Key Stage Two SATs for 2019 are there. This shows the percentage of girls reaching the required standard in mathematics slightly exceeded that of boys. I suspect 2020 and 2021 were massively disrupted by covid and 2022 and 2023 have been involved in catch-up in schools.
modellingman
bungeejumper wrote:It's a rocky road when people start to make generalisations.
BJ
UncleEbenezer wrote:bungeejumper wrote:It's a rocky road when people start to make generalisations.
BJ
Indeed. I tend to me most suspicious of that which is fashionable to believe.
Food for thought. If men don't have a natural advantage at intellectual games like chess (let alone bridge, which also has a strong social element), why are there separate mens and womens tournaments at elite levels?
servodude wrote:I would argue historical precedent for that kind of thing among the cultures playing the games; or similarly ask why women were/(are in some places) not capable of the mental exercise required in voting?
UncleEbenezer wrote:servodude wrote:I would argue historical precedent for that kind of thing among the cultures playing the games; or similarly ask why women were/(are in some places) not capable of the mental exercise required in voting?
Entirely plausible. Entirely unproven. Food for thought, but not solid evidence of anything other than society's expectations (and we can argue over which expectations: who would be up in arms if separate womens tournaments were abolished?)
There's a lot of inertia. The arguments that gave us the "womens prize" for fiction if applied today should've made it a "men-only prize", as the men who now get considered for literary prizes are those who are older and firmly established. A rapid swing of a pendulum! But it tells us nothing about the original question.
modellingman wrote:Have a look at the research and statistics section of the Standards and Testing Agency : https://www.gov.uk/search/research-and- ... ing-agency
There's not that much there but there are results of the Key Stage Two SATs for 2019 are there. This shows the percentage of girls reaching the required standard in mathematics slightly exceeded that of boys. I suspect 2020 and 2021 were massively disrupted by covid and 2022 and 2023 have been involved in catch-up in schools.
modellingman
In individual subjects, attainment increased in maths, writing and science compared to 2022. Attainment remained the same in grammar, punctuation and spelling and fell in reading.
In reading, 73% of pupils met the expected standard, down from 75% in 2022.
In maths, 73% of pupils met the expected standard, up from 71% in 2022.
In writing teacher assessment, 71% of pupils met the expected standard, up from 69% in 2022.
In grammar, punctuation and spelling, 72% of pupils met the expected standard, unchanged from 2022.
In science teacher assessment, 80% of pupils met the expected standard, up from 79% in 2022.
In all of reading, writing and maths (combined), 60% of pupils met the expected standard, up from 59% in 2022. At the higher standard, 8% of pupils met the standard, up from 7% in 2022.
Girls made more progress than boys in reading and writing, while boys made more progress in maths.
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Direct questions and answers, this room is not for general discussion please
Gerry557 wrote:The reason I'm asking is that a child was told that she wouldn't do well at maths because she's a girl. I was looking to find evidence to either support or deny this statement. Even so she is still an individual and is just as likely to differ from any average. I would not want her not to be given the opportunity to do well in maths as it has already been pre determined that because she's a girl she's not expected to attain a set level.
Gerry557 wrote:I'll keep searching for some more Ks1 stats that are more recent.
Gerry557 wrote:Im not sure the term "more progress" helps much as they could be making more progress but still be behind although this is looking unlikely.
UncleEbenezer wrote:Gerry557 wrote:The reason I'm asking is that a child was told that she wouldn't do well at maths because she's a girl. I was looking to find evidence to either support or deny this statement. Even so she is still an individual and is just as likely to differ from any average. I would not want her not to be given the opportunity to do well in maths as it has already been pre determined that because she's a girl she's not expected to attain a set level.
So someone is trying to encourage her in a different direction.
We could interpret that in more than one way. "because she's a girl" may or may not be a genuine belief, as might "won't do well at maths". I'd use the SATs stats mentioned by others here to counter that. Once upon a time when the Rubik's cube was new and I was showing it to some of my family, my cousin - a five-year-old girl at the time - showed by far the greatest aptitude for it (can't recollect if that included her dad, who was a professional engineer).
If she's intelligent and interested in Maths then she should be encouraged. If she's old enough (secondary school age certainly should be if the aptitude is there) I'd strongly recommend G H Hardy's Mathematician's Apology to any intelligent young person. If she's younger than that, maybe something like Roald Dahl's Matilda might serve to defend against being undermined by adult negativity
chas49 wrote:Gerry557 wrote:I'll keep searching for some more Ks1 stats that are more recent.
The 2022/23 figures (i.e. for the SATS taken in the Summer Term 2023 which I linked above are the most recent data there can be.Gerry557 wrote:Im not sure the term "more progress" helps much as they could be making more progress but still be behind although this is looking unlikely.
Two measures are used in education in the UK - attainment and progress. You're probably looking for attainment.
servodude wrote:I'm a bit worried though if the person that told you the expectation was in an educational position it might turn out to be a self fulfilling prophecy
Two of the ladies I studied with are now quite active in promoting females in STEM in the UK (in addition to the other bits of their careers) - they would be horrified to hear the conjecture posted! (if taken at face value)
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